ISRAEL - IRAN - SYRIA - HAMAS - HEZBOLLAH - WWWIII?

@Cycloptichorn,

Cycloptichorn wrote:

If I were to say that the Jews' culture were responsible for a great deal of the problems they have faced throughout history - you wouldn't call that an anti-Semitic statement?

Cycloptichorn

It really is an anti-Semitic statement, since if affords the anti-Semite with an alibi for his/her Jew hatred. Much anti-Semitism has been based on resentment of Jewish industriousness, whether in academics, business, or whatever.

If the Jewish culture does include a degree insularity, and Jews could be seen as aloof, who said the Gentile culture had anything better to offer? Remember, historically, for a Jew to associate with nice Gentiles, he/she really needed to convert to associate with nice Gentiles.

nrohcitpolcyC

1 Reply

@Cycloptichorn,

Cycloptichorn wrote:

Opinion noted; I shall continue to refer to you using the term Zionist.

Cycloptichorn

Well, you would be using the term incorrectly. That would be like my referring to you as a beach boy, since you live in California. Your lack of nuanced speech is showing, in that you cannot find a correct term for an American Jew that is pro-Israel, but not a Zionist like Israelis, or Jewish activists are Zionists.

And, you cannot just call me a Jew, since after two millenia of the word "Jew" being an epithet, you do not want to be thought of as anti-Semitic.

But, to be fair, you should give me your preferred moniker. Big Man on Campus?

1 Reply

@Foofie,

Foofie, You're a ****'g Jew. What's the problem?

1 Reply

Can we divert this a little? It's not simply a Jew/Gentile thing.
(Foofie and Ican would make a great team, though.)

I would repeat what I said earlier (why not? Everyone else is...) to point out that a significant proportion of Jews, within Israel and without, recognise that the path chosen by the Israeli government against Palestinians is counter-productive to its long-term security and its preferred national self-image, as well as being cruel and illegal.

Did anyone follow the link I supplied above? I'll reproduce it here:

http://www.concert4palestine.org/voices/index.html

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Interesting speeches by Mr Netanyahu and Mr Obama recently. And much political unrest in Iran.

Mr Netanyahu realises that Israel is perfectly safe, up until the time that America stops its aid, and the Iranians perfect their bombs.

Hence- Realpolitik?- a speech talking about a Palestinian state from an Israeli leader.

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@McTag,

Three choice ones in sequence (They must all be anti-Semites according to all the Israel apologists on this thread.):

Quote:

Wendy Pearlman Middle East researcher, USA
"Every Palestinian family has had a member killed or injured by the Israeli army. The sooner Israel withdraws from the occupied territories, the sooner Palestinian children will be able to imagine a future that offers something other than an early death." [Source]

Noam Chomsky Linguist, USA
"The goal of the peace process is to ensure that Palestine remains a permanent neo-colonialist dependency. It can be called 'a state,' just as apartheid South Africa was happy to call the Bantustans 'states'." [Source]

Jennifer Loewenstein Lecturer, University of Wisconsin, USA
"If your blood doesn't run cold when George W. Bush calls Ariel Sharon a 'man of peace' then you're getting nothing but lies packaged as news by a massive propaganda machine. Americans, you are paying for the dehumanization and destruction of an entire people." [Source]

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This is not a "real" deal to establish a two state solution. Israel has played this game for decades, and they're not about to change it. American government is too dumb to see the games being played.

Quote:

Israel sees deal soon with Obama over settlements
By Adam Entous Adam Entous Tue Jun 16, 9:04 am ET

JERUSALEM (Reuters) " Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu is negotiating a deal with Washington under which Israeli building in existing Jewish settlements could go forward in certain cases, Israeli and Western officials said on Tuesday.

In talks with U.S. President Barack Obama's Middle East envoy, Netanyahu has asserted that his government does not have the legal authority to stop building in cases in which tenders for new structures have already been awarded or when homes under construction have already been purchased.

"I'm confident that we will be able to reach an agreement in the near future that will enable us to put the settlement issue aside and to move forward to what I regard as far more substantive issues in the peace process," Michael Oren, Israel's newly appointed ambassador to Washington, told Reuters.

Under pressure from Obama, Netanyahu this week publicly accepted for the first time the internationally backed goal of Palestinian statehood, but set a series of pre-conditions that were rejected by the Palestinians.

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@Foofie,

Foofie wrote:

Cycloptichorn wrote:

If I were to say that the Jews' culture were responsible for a great deal of the problems they have faced throughout history - you wouldn't call that an anti-Semitic statement?

Cycloptichorn

It really is an anti-Semitic statement, since if affords the anti-Semite with an alibi for his/her Jew hatred. Much anti-Semitism has been based on resentment of Jewish industriousness, whether in academics, business, or whatever.

If the Jewish culture does include a degree insularity, and Jews could be seen as aloof, who said the Gentile culture had anything better to offer? Remember, historically, for a Jew to associate with nice Gentiles, he/she really needed to convert to associate with nice Gentiles.

nrohcitpolcyC

In that case, your statements about the Pals are equally odious; both are statements providing an alibi for hatred of a people. Jews are not special in any way and there are no rules which cover statements about them which do not equally apply to others.

So, before you throw around accusations of anti-semitism, you ought to examine your own speech. Perhaps you simply resent the Pals, and your statements are not grounded in fact whatsoever.

Cycloptichorn

2 Replies

@Cycloptichorn,

I have met and worked with many Jews during my life time, but Foofie is the only one who believes Jews are special in intellect and industriousness.

She's blinded by her own bias and ignorance.

Not all Jews are at the top of their class in school and/or doesn't represent some in the middle class or poor.

Her brain has been taken over by prejudice; poor woman!

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@cicerone imposter,

I respectfully disagree. Jews are brighter than the British average (at least: maybe that's not saying too much, though) And asiatic peoples are more intelligent than caucasian, I believe.

3 Replies

@McTag,

I also strongly disagree and the evidence is overwhelming.

Below is a table from" Human Accomplishment" by Charles Murray--p. 283

RATIO OF ACTUAL TO EXPECTED JEWISH NOBEL PRIZE WINNERS IN LITERATURE AND THE SCIENCES 1951-2000

SCIENCES--total 13:1

CHEMISTRY-10:1

MEDICINE---14-1

PHYSICS-----14-1

LITERATURE--7-1

************************************************************

What this means is that Jews are overrepresented by thirteen times( in the Sciences total) one would expect viewing their numbers in the world.

Similarly, with the rest of the chart.

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@McTag,

Asians, at least in California, perform at the top of their class and are the biggest percentage who attend the best universities. Asians represent 12% of the state's population, but represents about 50% of the student body at UC Berkeley, and a lesser amount at Stanford.

There was a report recently that also showed Asians in the top averages in income.

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@cicerone imposter,

Are you lying about Foofie's views? You lied when you said that I said that Pals were inferior.

Carter tells the Gazans how badly he feels for their terrible treatment by Israel. I guess he thinks that 8,000 rockets are not enough.

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Jews have a strong belief and tradition relative to the need for education. There is also great pressure in the Jewish family and community to be a good, successful, person. This motivates the young Jew to very hard in school to eventually become a professional.

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@Cycloptichorn,

Cycloptichorn wrote:

Foofie wrote:

Cycloptichorn wrote:

If I were to say that the Jews' culture were responsible for a great deal of the problems they have faced throughout history - you wouldn't call that an anti-Semitic statement?

Cycloptichorn

It really is an anti-Semitic statement, since if affords the anti-Semite with an alibi for his/her Jew hatred. Much anti-Semitism has been based on resentment of Jewish industriousness, whether in academics, business, or whatever.

If the Jewish culture does include a degree insularity, and Jews could be seen as aloof, who said the Gentile culture had anything better to offer? Remember, historically, for a Jew to associate with nice Gentiles, he/she really needed to convert to associate with nice Gentiles.

nrohcitpolcyC

In that case, your statements about the Pals are equally odious; both are statements providing an alibi for hatred of a people. Jews are not special in any way and there are no rules which cover statements about them which do not equally apply to others.

So, before you throw around accusations of anti-semitism, you ought to examine your own speech. Perhaps you simply resent the Pals, and your statements are not grounded in fact whatsoever.

Cycloptichorn

I do not hate the Palestineans. I just think of them as collectively uneducable, based on their cause celebre of wanting Israel to cease to exist. Your statement about the Jewish culture causing anti-Semitism is still anti-Semitic. What you think of me, and my thinking, has nothing to do with you not understanding that your statement was anti-Semitic (since you thought it was not an anti-Semitic statement).

0 Replies

@McTag,

McTag wrote:

I respectfully disagree. Jews are brighter than the British average (at least: maybe that's not saying too much, though) And asiatic peoples are more intelligent than caucasian, I believe.

You get an A+ for honesty!

0 Replies

@cicerone imposter,

cicerone imposter wrote:

Asians, at least in California, perform at the top of their class and are the biggest percentage who attend the best universities. Asians represent 12% of the state's population, but represents about 50% of the student body at UC Berkeley, and a lesser amount at Stanford.

There was a report recently that also showed Asians in the top averages in income.

But, I believe unless there is a constant flow of Asian immigrants into the U.S., Asians will be intermarried with mostly Caucasians before we see the next one or two centuries. They do not have "dominant" genes; therefore, a la Eurasians, the future generations of intermarried descendants will look like plain Western Europeans. In my own opinion, Asians will function like a B-12 shot to the American gene pool's intelligence. Perhaps, they will also cure the obesity epidemic we hear about?

0 Replies

@cicerone imposter,

cicerone imposter wrote:

Foofie, You're a ****'g Jew. What's the problem?

Your terminology above is sounding atavistic from a prior era. Wake up and smell the 21st century, or at least middle class speech.

1 Reply

@Foofie,

What do you know about middle class speech? You're so damn ignorant, you don't even know how the real world exists! Until you learn that Jews are no better or worse than the rest of humanity, you haven't learned anything about life.

We're all decended from Africa; we're called the human race.

2 Replies

@cicerone imposter,

cicerone imposter wrote:

What do you know about middle class speech? You're so damn ignorant, you don't even know how the real world exists! Until you learn that Jews are no better or worse than the rest of humanity, you haven't learned anything about life.

We're all decended from Africa; we're called the human race.

I was not talking race. I was talking culture.

The problem is that this thread has to do with a country called Israel. Many on the thread have decided to equate Israel to all Jews. That is anti-Semitic.

In other words, my thinking about Jews has nothing to do with what Israel does, or does not do. You might not like it if I espoused opinions about people of Japanese descent. Yet, you seem to have an opinion about my opinion about Jews. M.Y.O.B. (Mind Your Own Business). I think you have a big problem with admitting that some groups may be superior to other groups, in specific ways, for reasons that have nothing to do with us all being humans. I can feel superior to any number of people, and it has nothing to do with my Jewishness. For example, I feel "socially superior" to you, since my family never was part of a nationality that was at war with the U.S. There is nothing that can be done about that feeling of mine. It is my feeling, and I have it. It does not reflect poorly on you. It is just my feeling.

1 Reply

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