0
   

Thoughts on gun control

 
 
cjhsa
 
  0  
Reply Wed 11 Oct, 2006 05:42 pm
As CPS, your job should have been to prevent those a**holes from having kids in the first place.

I find it odd how statistics of such things go way up when a government agency is formed to protect us from them.
0 Replies
 
patiodog
 
  2  
Reply Wed 11 Oct, 2006 05:43 pm
wtf are you talking about, cj?
0 Replies
 
Intrepid
 
  1  
Reply Wed 11 Oct, 2006 05:49 pm
Foxfyre wrote:
Intrepid wrote:
Foxfyre wrote:
Intrepid wrote:
Specific. Paranoid people give me cause for alarm.


I believe that you mean this in theory. I also think in practice you would much prefer to be with CJ, Gunga, or David AND their guns when you were facing down a real threat to you and/or your loved ones' health, safety, or life via another human who didn't give a damn about you or your rights. The vast majority of us will never have to find out. But I think the small minority of victims don't really care about the big picture statistics. For them once is quite enough.


What you believe I mean and what I mean are miles apart. What you think I would prefer is what you prefer...not me. People who live in fear do not live...they exist. I would much rather live without that fear and take what comes without looking for the boogey man.

You and that group of gun loving, gun toting fanatics can live as you choose.


Everybody would prefer to live without fear. I certainly would. But you're also ignoring the point I made which is, when you're facing an armed killer intent on doing you or yours grave bodily harm, the entire perspective of the anti0gun peacenik or any other form of pacifict is likely to change in a big hurry. That's the point I was making and you really didn't address it at all my friend.

Such occurrences are quite rare in most places; nonexistent in a few; all too common in others. But they do happen and often they happen to those who least expect it.

Do we live our lives in anticipation of such an event? Of course not. Is it stupid to be prepared for one. Not the way I see it. I would certainly prefer to be prepared for the rare and unexpected just in case than see another dozen or so school children slaughtered in cold blood.

Now if you want to tell me that you wouldn't appreciate intervention from even the likes of David or CJ or Gunga should you or your wife or kids or grandkids or anybody be faced with a quite unplesant fate at the hands of a killer or worse, okay. I can't say what you think for sure. But if that's what you'll say, I think that would put you in one of the tiniest minorities in the world.


The chances of me, or my family, ever facing an armed killer are very, very remote. Canada is not like the U.S. in that regard and if I lived in the U.S. it is possible that I might think differently. However, I live in Canada and can walk at night without needless fear of being mugged or attacked. Of course, anything is possible but it is silly to dwell on such things.

The advocates for carry concealed weapons seem to be going on the premise that they can easily and readily access these weapons and kill or disable an assailant before they themselves are killed. The act of producing their own weapon would likely cause the assailant to use their weapon when they may not have otherwise. It is also possible to disarm the hapless victim and use his own gun against him. This happens to police officers, according to the news and COPS Laughing fairly often.

IF I was ever confronted with such a situation, I am as likely to be able to fend off such a person without a gun. Again, I say it is paranoid to dwell on being such a victim.

No, I would not like the intervention of Gunga, cjhsa or David. I wouldn't want somebody's blood on my hands because I think they would shoot before even knowing for sure that the assailant was armed. If I am in a tiny minority....sobeit.
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  0  
Reply Wed 11 Oct, 2006 05:56 pm
Intrepid wrote:
Foxfyre wrote:
Intrepid wrote:
Specific. Paranoid people give me cause for alarm.


I believe that you mean this in theory. I also think in practice you would much prefer to be with CJ, Gunga, or David AND their guns when you were facing down a real threat to you and/or your loved ones' health, safety, or life via another human who didn't give a damn about you or your rights. The vast majority of us will never have to find out. But I think the small minority of victims don't really care about the big picture statistics. For them once is quite enough.


What you believe I mean and what I mean are miles apart. What you think I would prefer is what you prefer...not me.
People who live in fear
do not live...they exist. I would much rather live without that fear and take what comes without looking for the boogey man.

You and that group of gun loving, gun toting fanatics can live as you choose.

U suppressionists simply obsessively,
unreasoningly, REFUSE to be dissuaded from,
or even to re-CONSIDER
the false notion
that anyone who PLANS to deal with difficulty or danger
is guided by his sound JUDGMENT,
rather than by emotions.

U remind me of the Catholic Bishop
who declared that he wud not believe
that the Earth was round,
even if he were lifted up
and SHOWN that it is round.

There is no evidence of fear on our part.

How will u answer
if someone accuses u of cowardice
because u have fire insurance ?

U must be convinced that
firemen live in permanent, unending TERROR,
because thay plan to deal with danger.
( not that it matters WHAT u believe )
David
0 Replies
 
cjhsa
 
  0  
Reply Wed 11 Oct, 2006 06:01 pm
Like I said, guns are a tool. I may or may not be carrying one.

Wanna rob me?
0 Replies
 
snood
 
  2  
Reply Wed 11 Oct, 2006 06:07 pm
Dys, I want to apologize for cjhsa's nasty comments about your past profession as a CPS worker.
I don't know the history between you two, and I know you and I don't see eye-to-eye on some things, but there is no excuse for the way he maligned CPS workers. I think CPS workers and all social workers of good conscience have some of the most thankless jobs on earth, along with public school teachers in some parts of the country.
thanks for your service as a CPS worker, and Illegitimi Non Carborundum.
0 Replies
 
Intrepid
 
  2  
Reply Wed 11 Oct, 2006 06:08 pm
OmSigDAVID wrote:
Intrepid wrote:
Foxfyre wrote:
Intrepid wrote:
Specific. Paranoid people give me cause for alarm.


I believe that you mean this in theory. I also think in practice you would much prefer to be with CJ, Gunga, or David AND their guns when you were facing down a real threat to you and/or your loved ones' health, safety, or life via another human who didn't give a damn about you or your rights. The vast majority of us will never have to find out. But I think the small minority of victims don't really care about the big picture statistics. For them once is quite enough.


What you believe I mean and what I mean are miles apart. What you think I would prefer is what you prefer...not me.
People who live in fear
do not live...they exist. I would much rather live without that fear and take what comes without looking for the boogey man.

You and that group of gun loving, gun toting fanatics can live as you choose.

U suppressionists simply obsessively,
unreasoningly, REFUSE to be dissuaded from,
or even to re-CONSIDER
the false notion
that anyone who PLANS to deal with difficulty or danger
is guided by his sound JUDGMENT,
rather than by emotions.

U remind me of the Catholic Bishop
who declared that he wud not believe
that the Earth was round,
even if he were lifted up
and SHOWN that it is round.

There is no evidence of fear on our part.

How will u answer
if someone accuses u of cowardice
because u have fire insurance ?

U must be convinced that
firemen live in permanent, unending TERROR,
because thay plan to deal with danger.
( not that it matters WHAT u believe )
David


You should really take that mensa stuff out of your profile. It is becoming an embarrassment to you.
0 Replies
 
snood
 
  2  
Reply Wed 11 Oct, 2006 06:09 pm
MENSA? This idjit says he's in MENSA? Tell me no!!
0 Replies
 
cjhsa
 
  0  
Reply Wed 11 Oct, 2006 06:10 pm
I just think all social workers outside of faith based organizations are non-essential government personnel. Our country does not require CPS or most other social programs in order to function.

The military isn't a social program.
0 Replies
 
Intrepid
 
  2  
Reply Wed 11 Oct, 2006 06:11 pm
snood wrote:
MENSA? This idjit says he's in MENSA? Tell me no!!


Go read it for yourself. MENSA, criminal lawyer.... you name it. Laughing
0 Replies
 
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Wed 11 Oct, 2006 06:27 pm
Intrepid wrote:
Foxfyre wrote:
Intrepid wrote:
Foxfyre wrote:
Intrepid wrote:
Specific. Paranoid people give me cause for alarm.


I believe that you mean this in theory. I also think in practice you would much prefer to be with CJ, Gunga, or David AND their guns when you were facing down a real threat to you and/or your loved ones' health, safety, or life via another human who didn't give a damn about you or your rights. The vast majority of us will never have to find out. But I think the small minority of victims don't really care about the big picture statistics. For them once is quite enough.


What you believe I mean and what I mean are miles apart. What you think I would prefer is what you prefer...not me. People who live in fear do not live...they exist. I would much rather live without that fear and take what comes without looking for the boogey man.

You and that group of gun loving, gun toting fanatics can live as you choose.


Everybody would prefer to live without fear. I certainly would. But you're also ignoring the point I made which is, when you're facing an armed killer intent on doing you or yours grave bodily harm, the entire perspective of the anti0gun peacenik or any other form of pacifict is likely to change in a big hurry. That's the point I was making and you really didn't address it at all my friend.

Such occurrences are quite rare in most places; nonexistent in a few; all too common in others. But they do happen and often they happen to those who least expect it.

Do we live our lives in anticipation of such an event? Of course not. Is it stupid to be prepared for one. Not the way I see it. I would certainly prefer to be prepared for the rare and unexpected just in case than see another dozen or so school children slaughtered in cold blood.

Now if you want to tell me that you wouldn't appreciate intervention from even the likes of David or CJ or Gunga should you or your wife or kids or grandkids or anybody be faced with a quite unplesant fate at the hands of a killer or worse, okay. I can't say what you think for sure. But if that's what you'll say, I think that would put you in one of the tiniest minorities in the world.


The chances of me, or my family, ever facing an armed killer are very, very remote. Canada is not like the U.S. in that regard and if I lived in the U.S. it is possible that I might think differently. However, I live in Canada and can walk at night without needless fear of being mugged or attacked. Of course, anything is possible but it is silly to dwell on such things.

The advocates for carry concealed weapons seem to be going on the premise that they can easily and readily access these weapons and kill or disable an assailant before they themselves are killed. The act of producing their own weapon would likely cause the assailant to use their weapon when they may not have otherwise. It is also possible to disarm the hapless victim and use his own gun against him. This happens to police officers, according to the news and COPS Laughing fairly often.

IF I was ever confronted with such a situation, I am as likely to be able to fend off such a person without a gun. Again, I say it is paranoid to dwell on being such a victim.

No, I would not like the intervention of Gunga, cjhsa or David. I wouldn't want somebody's blood on my hands because I think they would shoot before even knowing for sure that the assailant was armed. If I am in a tiny minority....sobeit.


Well, as fond as I am of you, and that is considerably, I sure wouldn't want to depend on you to be my defender and protector.Smile

Personally if it came to the protection of kids or loved ones or any innocent people for that matter, I'm of the 'by any means necessary' school when it comes to protecting them. I would not want THEIR blood on my hands because I was unwilling to act or allow others to act.
0 Replies
 
hamburger
 
  1  
Reply Wed 11 Oct, 2006 06:38 pm
speaking in general terms , in canada we still rely mainly on the police to offer protection for the citizenry .
some of the murders taking place (around certain dangerous nightclubs as an example) are often driveby shootings and a gun doesn't offer any protection . in a number of these cases they are also revenge shootings ; the person shot may have previously taken a potshot at the assailant . so it's a way of getting even - no gun would provide protection in these driveby shootings at night imo.
hbg
0 Replies
 
Intrepid
 
  1  
Reply Wed 11 Oct, 2006 06:39 pm
Foxfyre wrote:


Well, as fond as I am of you, and that is considerably, I sure wouldn't want to depend on you to be my defender and protector.Smile

Personally if it came to the protection of kids or loved ones or any innocent people for that matter, I'm of the 'by any means necessary' school when it comes to protecting them. I would not want THEIR blood on my hands because I was unwilling to act or allow others to act.


Thank you for the kind words, Foxfyre.

Don't get me wrong. I would use all means at my disposal to protect my family and loved ones. Those means just do not include a gun. Unless, it is one I took away from the one intent on using it.
0 Replies
 
Intrepid
 
  1  
Reply Wed 11 Oct, 2006 06:41 pm
hamburger wrote:
speaking in general terms , in canada we still rely mainly on the police to offer protection for the citizenry .
some of the murders taking place (around certain dangerous nightclubs as an example) are often driveby shootings and a gun doesn't offer any protection . in a number of these cases they are also revenge shootings ; the person shot may have previously taken a potshot at the assailant . so it's a way of getting even - no gun would provide protection in these driveby shootings at night imo.
hbg


You make too much sense hamburger. :wink:
0 Replies
 
snood
 
  2  
Reply Wed 11 Oct, 2006 06:43 pm
I got nothing against guns. I like shootin 'em, myself - and think they can serve as vital tools in some situations.

I have something against people whose ownership of firearms has seemingly usurped part of their humanity.
0 Replies
 
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Wed 11 Oct, 2006 06:44 pm
Intrepid wrote:
Foxfyre wrote:


Well, as fond as I am of you, and that is considerably, I sure wouldn't want to depend on you to be my defender and protector.Smile

Personally if it came to the protection of kids or loved ones or any innocent people for that matter, I'm of the 'by any means necessary' school when it comes to protecting them. I would not want THEIR blood on my hands because I was unwilling to act or allow others to act.


Thank you for the kind words, Foxfyre.

Don't get me wrong. I would use all means at my disposal to protect my family and loved ones. Those means just do not include a gun. Unless, it is one I took away from the one intent on using it.


I know. It's mostly a philosophical difference I think. You think I'm a gun crazed nut. And I think you're naive mostly because you've never had to make that decision when it counted.

And we could both be wrong. Smile
0 Replies
 
Intrepid
 
  1  
Reply Wed 11 Oct, 2006 06:46 pm
Or, we could both be right. Laughing
0 Replies
 
cjhsa
 
  0  
Reply Wed 11 Oct, 2006 06:59 pm
snood wrote:
I got nothing against guns. I like shootin 'em, myself - and think they can serve as vital tools in some situations.

I have something against people whose ownership of firearms has seemingly usurped part of their humanity.


Many have given up more than just their humanity for your right to bear arms.

Keep that in mind.
0 Replies
 
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Wed 11 Oct, 2006 07:00 pm
Intrepid wrote:
Or, we could both be right. Laughing


That too. Smile
0 Replies
 
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Wed 11 Oct, 2006 07:14 pm
hamburger wrote:
speaking in general terms , in canada we still rely mainly on the police to offer protection for the citizenry .
some of the murders taking place (around certain dangerous nightclubs as an example) are often driveby shootings and a gun doesn't offer any protection . in a number of these cases they are also revenge shootings ; the person shot may have previously taken a potshot at the assailant . so it's a way of getting even - no gun would provide protection in these driveby shootings at night imo.
hbg


The sad fact is, though, that the USA will have 300 million people within the next few weeks or months and we are a large country with a lot of very large towns and cities plus a lot of really remote locations that are sparsely populated. Many people live many miles from the nearest neighbor or town that may well be too small to afford its own law enforcement protection. It could take many long minutes or more for the police to respond to an emergency.

What with burglaries, robberies, muggings, drive by shootings, bar brawls, traffic accidents, wild parties disturbing the peace, lost kids, domestic violence, puppies loose on the freeway, and crowd control, the police are stretched thin in the metropolitan areas. If you have a crazed drunk trying to break into your house, a 911 call will summon the police, but they may be minutes away. You may not have that much time.

The vast majority of the people never need to call the cops because they never perceive themselves to be in personal danger. But the few who do, as often as not, will need some means to defend themselves or suffer the worst.

If there has to be a choice, I'm generally more in favor of bad guys getting shot or otherwise taken down rather than the good guys being shot, stabbed, beaten up, raped, and worse.

Seriously, the United States is not so violent as it might appear on this thread. But again, if you're the victim, it doesn't much matter that you're in a very small minority. It's everything and all things to you at the time.

I don't fault anybody for not owning a weapon. I figure its a calculated risk for them and they feel the risk is minimal. But I also think those who choose that route should not begrudge those who would rather not take that chance and would rather be prepared.
0 Replies
 
 

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