9
   

Fight the U.N. Gun Ban

 
 
gungasnake
 
  0  
Thu 12 Mar, 2009 11:04 am
@Advocate,
Quote:
There was also a guy in AL who killed a bunch of people with his legally acquired weapons. In Europe, where it is difficult to keep guns, their murder rate is a tiny fraction of ours.


Yeah, but their tyranny rate is a lot higher. Guns in private hands prevent tyranny.
McTag
 
  1  
Thu 12 Mar, 2009 02:27 pm
@gungasnake,

Quote:
Yeah, but their tyranny rate is a lot higher. Guns in private hands prevent tyranny


Rolling Eyes

Like in Afghanistan and Iraq?
0 Replies
 
H2O MAN
 
  0  
Thu 12 Mar, 2009 02:41 pm
@Advocate,
Advocate wrote:

Switzerland may be the exception that proved the rule.
The country is different inasmuch the people of very well educated and there is virtually no poverty.
This may account for the low gun violence.


An example the US should follow.

Switzerland is also a Republic and the citizens would not tolerate the likes of Obama and his ilk.
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Thu 12 Mar, 2009 03:59 pm
@H2O MAN,
H2O MAN wrote:

Switzerland is also a Republic and the citizens would not tolerate the likes of Obama and his ilk.


Switzerland is no republic but a conferation - that's why it's called Swiss Conferation. (Since 1291)

They've got -despite what Americans like to think - nearly the very weapon laws like any other European country (they are a Schengen country since 2009): only one weapon may be purchased per weapon acquisition permit, imitations of real guns, airsoft guns etc are forbidden, private gun trade is nearly totally forbidden, foreigners must have a Swiss (or European) weapon allowance ... ... ...
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Thu 12 Mar, 2009 04:21 pm
@Walter Hinteler,
You even get in Switzerland now the European Union Firearm Passport - it's part of the Swiss Weapon Law.
Swiss 'Waffenverordnung'.
0 Replies
 
H2O MAN
 
  0  
Thu 12 Mar, 2009 05:13 pm
@Walter Hinteler,
Walter Hinteler wrote:

H2O MAN wrote:

Switzerland is also a Republic and the citizens would not tolerate the likes of Obama and his ilk.


Switzerland is no republic but a conferation - that's why it's called Swiss Conferation. (Since 1291)



I think both you and I are correct...

Switzerland (swĭt'sərlənd) , Fr. Suisse, Ger. Schweiz, Ital. Svizzera, officially Swiss Confederation, federal republic
(2005 est. pop. 7,489,000), 15,941 sq mi (41,287 sq km), central Europe.


Switzerland:
Republic in central Europe, bordered by France to the west, Germany to the north, Liechtenstein and Austria
to the east, and Italy to the east and south. Its capital is Bern, and its largest city is Zurich.
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  0  
Thu 12 Mar, 2009 10:11 pm
Does anyone know how ez it is to get along in English in Switzerland ?
David
McTag
 
  1  
Fri 13 Mar, 2009 05:41 am
@OmSigDAVID,

The Swiss speak many languages.
DontTreadOnMe
 
  1  
Fri 13 Mar, 2009 07:35 pm
@McTag,
McTag wrote:


The Swiss speak many languages.


ja. oui. si. alles in die Confoederatio Helvetica
0 Replies
 
oralloy
 
  0  
Fri 13 Mar, 2009 08:48 pm
@Walter Hinteler,
Walter Hinteler wrote:
H2O MAN wrote:

Switzerland is also a Republic and the citizens would not tolerate the likes of Obama and his ilk.


Switzerland is no republic but a conferation - that's why it's called Swiss Conferation. (Since 1291)

They've got -despite what Americans like to think - nearly the very weapon laws like any other European country (they are a Schengen country since 2009): only one weapon may be purchased per weapon acquisition permit, imitations of real guns, airsoft guns etc are forbidden, private gun trade is nearly totally forbidden, foreigners must have a Swiss (or European) weapon allowance ... ... ...


Those weapon acquisition permits are easy enough to get. All you need is to pass a background check.

Once you pass a background check and get your acquisition permit, you can use it to buy a semi-auto rifle, semi-auto shotgun, or semi-auto pistol.

And you can buy bolt-action rifles and double-barreled shotguns without needing any background check or acquisition permit.


At least, that is what it was like a few years ago. I didn't check for updated gun laws, but I wouldn't expect any radical changes.


But all that is about non-militia gun ownership. It does not take into account the most important aspect of Switzerland: the Swiss Militia. A huge number of Swiss Militiamen keep fully automatic rifles in their homes.
oralloy
 
  0  
Fri 13 Mar, 2009 08:52 pm
@Advocate,
Advocate wrote:
There was also a guy in AL who killed a bunch of people with his legally acquired weapons. In Europe, where it is difficult to keep guns, their murder rate is a tiny fraction of ours.


It is not difficult to keep guns in Europe. Maybe in a few selected European countries, but not in all Europe.

And last I knew, Estonia's non-gun homicide rate was nearly four times greater than the US's total homicide rate.
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  2  
Sun 15 Mar, 2009 10:30 am
@oralloy,
oralloy wrote:

Those weapon acquisition permits are easy enough to get. All you need is to pass a background check.

Once you pass a background check and get your acquisition permit, you can use it to buy a semi-auto rifle, semi-auto shotgun, or semi-auto pistol.

And you can buy bolt-action rifles and double-barreled shotguns without needing any background check or acquisition permit.


At least, that is what it was like a few years ago. I didn't check for updated gun laws, but I wouldn't expect any radical changes.


But all that is about non-militia gun ownership. It does not take into account the most important aspect of Switzerland: the Swiss Militia. A huge number of Swiss Militiamen keep fully automatic rifles in their homes.


I wonder why you didn't notice my remark that the Swiss weapon law is no the same as in any other .... European Schengen country.

The Swiss Army is NO militia is it is generally understood but a mixture of very few professional and regular soldiers with additionally up to 95% soldiers doing compulsary service.
And since that's done over a couple of years - they have their one regular gun at home. (I had a weapon at home durting my reservist's period in Germany, too.)


This has nothing to due with weapon laws but the unique situation of the Swiss military.
oralloy
 
  0  
Sun 15 Mar, 2009 01:34 pm
@Walter Hinteler,
Walter Hinteler wrote:
oralloy wrote:
Those weapon acquisition permits are easy enough to get. All you need is to pass a background check.

Once you pass a background check and get your acquisition permit, you can use it to buy a semi-auto rifle, semi-auto shotgun, or semi-auto pistol.

And you can buy bolt-action rifles and double-barreled shotguns without needing any background check or acquisition permit.


At least, that is what it was like a few years ago. I didn't check for updated gun laws, but I wouldn't expect any radical changes.


But all that is about non-militia gun ownership. It does not take into account the most important aspect of Switzerland: the Swiss Militia. A huge number of Swiss Militiamen keep fully automatic rifles in their homes.


I wonder why you didn't notice my remark that the Swiss weapon law is no the same as in any other .... European Schengen country.


It looks to me like current Swiss law still treats the weapons acquisition permit like a background check system. It shouldn't prevent most people from getting one.

It does now say that if the gun isn't for hunting or sport shooting that people need to state their reason for acquiring the weapon, but it doesn't exclude "home defense" from the possible reasons people can give.

http://www.admin.ch/ch/d/sr/514_54/a8.html



It also looks like there are no prohibitions against semi-auto weapons.

http://www.admin.ch/ch/d/sr/514_54/a5.html



And it also looks like the exemption for double barreled shotguns and bolt-action rifles is still there. They now require such sales to be reported to the government, but no weapons acquisition permit.

http://www.admin.ch/ch/d/sr/514_54/a10.html




Walter Hinteler wrote:
The Swiss Army is NO militia is it is generally understood but a mixture of very few professional and regular soldiers with additionally up to 95% soldiers doing compulsary service.
And since that's done over a couple of years - they have their one regular gun at home. (I had a weapon at home durting my reservist's period in Germany, too.)


This has nothing to due with weapon laws but the unique situation of the Swiss military.


Actually, the Swiss military is the epitome of what a militia is supposed to be. It matches what our Founding Fathers wanted us to have in America in every respect.
Walter Hinteler
 
  2  
Sun 15 Mar, 2009 01:56 pm
@oralloy,
oralloy wrote:

It does now say that if the gun isn't for hunting or sport shooting that people need to state their reason for acquiring the weapon, but it doesn't exclude "home defense" from the possible reasons people can give.
It also looks like there are no prohibitions against semi-auto weapons.

And it also looks like the exemption for double barreled shotguns and bolt-action rifles is still there. They now require such sales to be reported to the government, but no weapons acquisition permit.


Well, that's nearly 100% the very same like in .... more than a dozen other European countries: here explicitly the Schengen countries (e.g. Germany).

oralloy wrote:

Actually, the Swiss military is the epitome of what a militia is supposed to be. It matches what our Founding Fathers wanted us to have in America in every respect.


The founding fathers wanted mandatory conscripts? Sure?
Advocate
 
  1  
Sun 15 Mar, 2009 03:40 pm
Interestingly, there was a widespread belief (until recently) that the Nazis were afraid to invade Switzerland because all the people there were armed. We now know that the Swiss were useful tools of the Nazis, being their bankers.
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Sun 15 Mar, 2009 03:52 pm
@Advocate,
And certainly that's the very same reason why none of the allies invaded Switzerland?
oralloy
 
  0  
Sun 15 Mar, 2009 10:21 pm
@Walter Hinteler,
Walter Hinteler wrote:
oralloy wrote:
It does now say that if the gun isn't for hunting or sport shooting that people need to state their reason for acquiring the weapon, but it doesn't exclude "home defense" from the possible reasons people can give.
It also looks like there are no prohibitions against semi-auto weapons.

And it also looks like the exemption for double barreled shotguns and bolt-action rifles is still there. They now require such sales to be reported to the government, but no weapons acquisition permit.


Well, that's nearly 100% the very same like in .... more than a dozen other European countries: here explicitly the Schengen countries (e.g. Germany).


I don't remember them all, but I do know a lot of European countries have a good number of guns in private hands. Not as much as the US, but not all that much less.

I think France and a couple of the Scandinavian countries are among the highest in European gun ownership.

It's really the UK that has the draconian gun laws.




Walter Hinteler wrote:
oralloy wrote:
Actually, the Swiss military is the epitome of what a militia is supposed to be. It matches what our Founding Fathers wanted us to have in America in every respect.


The founding fathers wanted mandatory conscripts? Sure?


Very sure:

"BE it enacted by the Senate and House of Representatives of the United States of America in Congress assembled, That the militia of the United States shall consist of each and every free, able-bodied male citizen of the respective States, resident therein, who are or shall be of the age of eighteen years, and under the age of fifty years (except as is hereinafter excepted) who shall severally and respectively be enrolled by the captain or commanding officer of the company within whose bounds such citizen shall reside, and that within months after passing of this act: And it shall at all times hereafter be the duty of every such captain or commanding officer of a company, to enrol every such citizen as aforesaid, and also those who shall from time to time arrive at the age of eighteen years, or being of the age of eighteen years and under the fifty years (except as before excepted) shall come to reside within his bounds; and shall without delay notify such citizen of the said enrolment by a proper non-commissioned officer of the company, by whom such notice may be proved...."

http://gunshowonthenet.com/2ALEGAL/Precedent/UniformMilitia1790.html
Advocate
 
  1  
Sun 15 Mar, 2009 11:08 pm
@Walter Hinteler,
How silly! Switzerland was neutral. There was no reason for one of the allies to invade.
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Mon 16 Mar, 2009 12:05 am
@Advocate,
Advocate wrote:

Interestingly, there was a widespread belief (until recently) that the Nazis were afraid to invade Switzerland because all the people there were armed. We now know that the Swiss were useful tools of the Nazis, being their bankers.

Walter Hinteler wrote:

And certainly that's the very same reason why none of the allies invaded Switzerland?


Advocate wrote:

How silly! Switzerland was neutral. There was no reason for one of the allies to invade.
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  2  
Mon 16 Mar, 2009 12:08 am
@oralloy,
oralloy wrote:

It's really the UK that has the draconian gun laws.


I didn't refer to the UK since the UK is no Schengen country.

0 Replies
 
 

Related Topics

Obama '08? - Discussion by sozobe
Let's get rid of the Electoral College - Discussion by Robert Gentel
McCain's VP: - Discussion by Cycloptichorn
Food Stamp Turkeys - Discussion by H2O MAN
The 2008 Democrat Convention - Discussion by Lash
McCain is blowing his election chances. - Discussion by McGentrix
Snowdon is a dummy - Discussion by cicerone imposter
TEA PARTY TO AMERICA: NOW WHAT?! - Discussion by farmerman
 
Copyright © 2024 MadLab, LLC :: Terms of Service :: Privacy Policy :: Page generated in 0.03 seconds on 02/26/2024 at 06:10:49