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Iran Air Strikes Growing in Probability

 
 
blacksmithn
 
  1  
Reply Mon 10 Apr, 2006 08:45 am
Frankly, I doubt the ability of airstrikes alone to insure that Iran's nuclear capabilities, whatever they may be, are irretrievably reduced.

Moreover, given this administration's missteps and blunders in the Middle East, I doubt that anyone has seriously considered any unintended consequences that may arise from such an ill-taken move.

Finally, given this administration's track record for veracity, I am doubtful whether any analysis of Iranian capabilities, and the ability of our air forces to disrupt them, can be trusted.
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Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Mon 10 Apr, 2006 08:47 am
All good points, well made.
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sozobe
 
  1  
Reply Mon 10 Apr, 2006 08:50 am
Exactly.

Probably my number one complaint about Bush, because it has so many implications, is that he is allergic to critical thinking. He doesn't want people around who will tell him that something won't work, and why... he fires those people. He surrounds himself with the people who say "sure, let's do it, it'll work out" and present the rosiest best-case scenario (children, flowers) as the only scenario.

Then when that doesn't work out, they -- and we -- are f*cked.
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snood
 
  1  
Reply Mon 10 Apr, 2006 08:52 am
The thing is, I'm not sure that our heightened sense of wariness because of the Iraq fiasco makes us as a people any stronger to stop the Bushwhackos, once they get started...
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au1929
 
  1  
Reply Mon 10 Apr, 2006 08:57 am
Considering how the war in Iraq swelled the ranks of the terrorists one could only imagine how the Moslem world would react to the nuking of Iran.

Is Bush insane? Only a madman would contemplate using nuclear weapons.
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Ticomaya
 
  1  
Reply Mon 10 Apr, 2006 08:58 am
blacksmithn wrote:
Ticomaya wrote:
blacksmithn wrote:
And now we have this sort of nonsense, yet another example of the failure to understand and learn from history.

The march of folly continues....


Do you believe it would be wise to allow Iran, a state-sponsor of islamic terrorism, to acquire nuclear weapons?


Frankly, I doubt the ability of airstrikes alone to insure that Iran's nuclear capabilities, whatever they may be, are irretrievably reduced.

Moreover, given this administration's missteps and blunders in the Middle East, I doubt that anyone has seriously considered any unintended consequences that may arise from such an ill-taken move.

Finally, given this administration's track record for veracity, I am doubtful whether any analysis of Iranian capabilities, and the ability of our air forces to disrupt them, can be trusted.


You didn't answer my question.
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blacksmithn
 
  1  
Reply Mon 10 Apr, 2006 09:01 am
Yes, I did. That you didn't like the answer is beyond my power to prevent, much like the US ability to prevent Iran from doing what it will. The fact that either one is unpalatable to you or the country is really immaterial.
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Thomas
 
  1  
Reply Mon 10 Apr, 2006 09:03 am
Ticomaya wrote:
Do you believe it would be wise to allow Iran, a state-sponsor of islamic terrorism, to acquire nuclear weapons?

Yes -- if the price is that the US start another un-winnable and illegal war.
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Ticomaya
 
  1  
Reply Mon 10 Apr, 2006 09:04 am
blacksmithn wrote:
Yes, I did. That you didn't like the answer is beyond my power to prevent, much like the US ability to prevent Iran from doing what it will. The fact that either one is unpalatable to you or the country is really immaterial.


You didn't answer the question. You danced around it like so many others.
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Ticomaya
 
  1  
Reply Mon 10 Apr, 2006 09:05 am
Thomas wrote:
Ticomaya wrote:
Do you believe it would be wise to allow Iran, a state-sponsor of islamic terrorism, to acquire nuclear weapons?

Yes -- if the price is that the US start another un-winnable and illegal war.


Now that's an answer.

So if the price is not another war (I'll ignore your "un-winnable" and "illegal" characterization), would your answer be "no"?
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Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Mon 10 Apr, 2006 09:09 am
snood wrote:
The thing is, I'm not sure that our heightened sense of wariness because of the Iraq fiasco makes us as a people any stronger to stop the Bushwhackos, once they get started...


You just wanted to cheer us up, right?
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blacksmithn
 
  1  
Reply Mon 10 Apr, 2006 09:11 am
Again, that you don't like the answer doesn't mean that one wasn't given. Although I freely admit that I missed the memo detailing who died and left you the arbiter of answerdom...
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Thomas
 
  1  
Reply Mon 10 Apr, 2006 09:12 am
Ticomaya wrote:
So if the price is not another war (I'll ignore your "un-winnable" and "illegal" characterization), would your answer be "no"?


If Bush could stop Iran from acquiring nuclear weapons by purely diplomatic means, I would encourage him to do that, yes.
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Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Mon 10 Apr, 2006 09:14 am
Thomas wrote:
If Bush could stop Iran from acquiring nuclear weapons by purely diplomatic means, I would encourage him to do that, yes.


That would be the most sensible course, in my never humble opinion. It also appears to be what motivates everyone else who is actively addressing the issue and is not a resident of the Pennsylvania Avenue fantasy land.
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Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Mon 10 Apr, 2006 09:15 am
I agre, you won't find many outsite that area with a very different opinion.
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Ticomaya
 
  1  
Reply Mon 10 Apr, 2006 09:39 am
blacksmithn wrote:
Again, that you don't like the answer doesn't mean that one wasn't given. Although I freely admit that I missed the memo detailing who died and left you the arbiter of answerdom...


Thomas answered my question with a qualified "yes." You did not answer.

My question was whether it was wise to allow Iran to acquire nuclear weapons. In response, you said:

blacksmithn wrote:
Frankly, I doubt the ability of airstrikes alone to insure that Iran's nuclear capabilities, whatever they may be, are irretrievably reduced.


Fine ... you doubt airstrikes will be effective. They may or may not be effective, but that does not answer the question of whether it is wise to allow Iran to acquire nuclear weapons.

blacksmithn wrote:
Moreover, given this administration's missteps and blunders in the Middle East, I doubt that anyone has seriously considered any unintended consequences that may arise from such an ill-taken move.


Okay, you think there might be "unintended consequences" if we make airstrikes on Iran. That does not answer the question of whether it is wise to allow Iran to acquire nuclear weapons.

blacksmithn wrote:
Finally, given this administration's track record for veracity, I am doubtful whether any analysis of Iranian capabilities, and the ability of our air forces to disrupt them, can be trusted.


Finally, you express your doubts about the Bush Administration's analysis. That does not answer the question of whether it is wise to allow Iran to acquire nuclear weapons.

I have a guess at what your answer might be, but I don't understand your obvious reluctance to respond clearly and succinctly, and force everyone to guess at whether you think it's wise to allow Iran to acquire nukes or not.
0 Replies
 
Ticomaya
 
  1  
Reply Mon 10 Apr, 2006 09:39 am
Thomas wrote:
Ticomaya wrote:
So if the price is not another war (I'll ignore your "un-winnable" and "illegal" characterization), would your answer be "no"?


If Bush could stop Iran from acquiring nuclear weapons by purely diplomatic means, I would encourage him to do that, yes.


But if Iran cannot be stopped by diplomatic means -- and we all know that Iran is the key to diplomatic success on that question -- are you saying you would prefer allowing Iran to acquire nukes rather than the US making military strikes on Iran's reactors?
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Ticomaya
 
  1  
Reply Mon 10 Apr, 2006 09:39 am
Setanta wrote:
Thomas wrote:
If Bush could stop Iran from acquiring nuclear weapons by purely diplomatic means, I would encourage him to do that, yes.


That would be the most sensible course, in my never humble opinion. It also appears to be what motivates everyone else who is actively addressing the issue and is not a resident of the Pennsylvania Avenue fantasy land.


Of course it's the most sensible course, and I don't know anybody who is advocating not attempting dimplomacy with Iran on this issue.
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Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Mon 10 Apr, 2006 09:41 am
Which is not, of course, the point of this thread. The point is that many people are justifiably apprehensive, on the basis of the track record of the Shrub and his Forty Theives of Baghdad, that diplomacy will not be allowed to run its reasonable course.
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Buck Fush
 
  1  
Reply Mon 10 Apr, 2006 09:52 am
Ticomaya wrote:
Thomas wrote:
Ticomaya wrote:
So if the price is not another war (I'll ignore your "un-winnable" and "illegal" characterization), would your answer be "no"?


If Bush could stop Iran from acquiring nuclear weapons by purely diplomatic means, I would encourage him to do that, yes.


But if Iran cannot be stopped by diplomatic means -- and we all know that Iran is the key to diplomatic success on that question -- are you saying you would prefer allowing Iran to acquire nukes rather than the US making military strikes on Iran's reactors?


You have it exactly backwards. It is Bush who likely cannot be stopped by diplomatic means.
0 Replies
 
 

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