What should be done about illegal immigration?

Ebrown makes perfect sense. I'd wager most readers of this exchange agree, but recognize the futility of joining the discussion against such obstinate denial of reason.

There is overt racism of the type that thnks minorties are some pitiful people that can't survive without Whitey. And there is overt racism that demeans and puts down people of another race purely because they are of that race.

CJ did neither. It is Ebrowns side that has been pulling the race card intermittently throughout this entire discussion and who expounded half a page still playing it. I acknowledged that CJ exaggerated for effect, but talking about the elephant in the room is NOT racism. Politically incorrect yes according to those on the Left. Indelicately expressed, yes. Uncomfortable? Definitely. But racism, no.

I know what real racism is, and I have learned to expect eBrown to trivialize it. I didn't expect it of you Bill.

Bill, Thanks for your support. I always enjoy debating with you, especially when we are on the same side.

Foxfyre, saying I am playing the race card is unfair. I think you know that. What happened with the pregnant 14 year old Latinas is what typically happen. You guys make a racially based argument or statement, I respond, and then you tag me with playing the "race card".

Anyone else reading...

I am curious if there is anyone who opposes a path to earned citizenship and rejects the racially based arguments that are so prevalent in this debate.

If you both...

1) Think that allowing people here illegally should not be given a chance to earn citizenship.

2) Think that the arguments using negative ethnic stereotypes either toward 14 year old Hispanic girls, or politically active American citizens with Hispanic surnames are wrong and inappropriate in a debate about immigration.

... I would be interested in hearing from you.

A national drinking license for citizens only would do the trick. If the Illegals can't drink beer they will leave.

I notice that both of you said quite a lot in this thread, and heartily applaud your sense of self-criticism.

All evidence to the contrary. Think it through, Foxy. What you refer to as CJ's exaggeration is so overtly racist, it is absurd to pretend otherwise. No?

""most if not all" 14 year old Latino girls are pregnant..."

Are you kidding? And which part of fearing a non-white majority are you pretending isn't overtly racist? Huh?

Justify your prejudice if you can, but don't defend racist BS while pretending there's an "elephant in the room" that someone other than you is ignoring. Those examples are as obvious as... an elephant in the room.

There's a whole lot of 14-year old elephants where I just came from.

Even my uber-liberal friends there have taken notice.

Illegal immigration is a HUGE problem in this country, and the majority of Americans agree there's a problem.

Occom Bill, I'm disappointed in you.

You've taken on the personna of a contractor driving up and down the El Camino Real in a pickup truck, looking for day workers.

Well, I hope you had ahd a nice day - glad, they didn't take you in one of the cages of that zoo you've been to.

Really? I'm surprised by you less and less all the time…

What are you talking about? You can't be that stupid. You are assuming that since I own a couple of restaurants that that is the reason I think your racist BS is racist BS? No need for day workers here, thank you... and no need for racist A-holes either...

I bet you can't prove your workers are legal.

I bet you don't care.

When you play the racist card, you lose.

Interesting, very interesting.

What would you like to wager? I have not one employee without the legal documents to gain employment... and if you had a clue what your were talking about; you'd know what "new hire reporting" meant... and I've already stated I follow that law implicitly. The burden of proof, along with the racism, is on you.

It is interesting that you think the possibility of my hiring an illegal somehow justifies your racist comment. Look up Non Sequitur.

You play the race card because you cannot otherwise justify your arguments.

Pity.

So how about that bet? You offered it, Bill accepted it. Time for you to put up or shut up. Having offered the bet, how much money are you willing to put where your mouth is?

I'll bet he cannot prove his workers are legal.

Does it bother me that other people have contributed to my social security fund? From an identity theft position, yes.

If self-criticism requires admitting to something that I know to be a lot of bull, I'm just not going to do it. Nor am I going to allow somebody to play the race card over and over in the most egregious liberalspeak, especially when it is directed at me, and not call them on it.

You and Ebrown and Occumbill are joined at the hip in your opinion that people should be able to come to the United States, against our laws and policies, and the law should not be enforced. If they get here you three seem to believe we are obligated out of human kindness to allow them to stay. Especially those who break the law the longest should be penalized the least.

Then they (and you?) take it one step further and call it racist if it is pointed out that the significantly largest group doing this are Mexican and they are doing it with the tacit encouragement of their government who also accuses us of racism if we take any useful measures to stop it. And it is impolite to speak of the anchor babies that are creating a huge part of the problem. We can't split up families. No....that would be inhumane. And we can't show how this is also being engineered or we are racist.

Well baloney.

Despite what some people would have you believe, it is very possible to be politically incorrect and not be the least bit racist. When directed at issues of race, I think political correctness itself is a form of racism.

There is nobody who could assess my circle of friends and colleagues, the ethnic make up of my family, the people I work for and who have worked for me, who could honestly accuse me of any form of racism.

I wouldn't phrase things the way CJ does, but I have seen zero evidence that he holds any contempt or unfavorable impression or condescension toward people of any race. He is being maligned purely because he talked about that elephant in the room. Most liberals don't allow that because, in my opinion, most liberals are thoroughly intellectually dishonest when it comes to their sacred cows. It is my number one criticism of liberalism.

Accusations of racism are a diversion and a huge red herring in this discussion. If you don't like CJ, fine. If you don't like me, fine. So bite me.

But your insinuations are way off the mark.

I think, since I've met him and know him via the internet for more than five years, Thomas seldom if ever believes what others want him to believe.
He's not only old enough to have an own opinion.

I suppose furthermore that the sentence quoted above might be right in your opinion.
But others may think, it's "way off the mark".

Walter, you think I'm 'way off the mark" so much of the time, you really should have just a standard macro to just say that after every one of my posts. It would save you a lot of time typing.

When Thomas agrees with those who accuse me of racism, he's way off the mark. Now, Smarty Pants, you prove how he is not.

And why did you choose that particular phrase from my quote? You have a problem with it?

I agree that it might be different in that part of world, you live.
So I can't prove that.