What should be done about illegal immigration?

@maxdancona,

I saw that after I posted, and hoped nobody would catch it.

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I have changed my opinion about illegal immigration.
While I used to support deporting all illegals, I have changed my opinion.

Now, I believe that if someone is here illegally, has been here working, paying taxes, has no criminal record or encounters with the law OF ANY KIND, they should be allowed to stay.
To qualify, they must be willing to pay a $5000 per person fine for every member of their family here illegally, they must begin the process to become US citizens within 6 months, and they must have no encounters with law enforcement until they become US citizens.
They will be given 5 years to pay the fine, by not getting tax refunds or by payroll deduction if they choose. Or they can pay in cash at a federal courthouse.

Any person here illegally that has a criminal record, that is in prison or jail, or that refuses these conditions, will be automatically deported to their home country.

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@mysteryman,

Quote:

Now, I believe that if someone is here illegally, has been here working, paying taxes, has no criminal record or encounters with the law OF ANY KIND, they should be allowed to stay.
To qualify, they must be willing to pay a $5000 per person fine for every member of their family here illegally, they must begin the process to become US citizens within 6 months, and they must have no encounters with law enforcement until they become US citizens.
They will be given 5 years to pay the fine, by not getting tax refunds or by payroll deduction if they choose. Or they can pay in cash at a federal courthouse.

you should demand that they learn english as well.

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@mysteryman,

That sounds much like the old McCain/Kennedy bill. While there were parts I didn't much care for, I took it as the best possible compromise.

I very much liked the Dream Act. It's difficult to imagine people in an illegal status without having chosen to commit an illegal act. Note that the current executive order which they like to compare to the Dream Act isn't the same, and is not a law passed by congress.

1 Reply

@roger,

roger wrote:

I very much liked the Dream Act. It's difficult to imagine people in an illegal status without having chosen to commit an illegal act. Note that the current executive order which they like to compare to the Dream Act isn't the same, and is not a law passed by congress.

there is a principle in law to systematically deprive people of personal gains from illegal acts. you can argue for not doing so here, but the default is to uphold our beliefs everywhere.

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@hawkeye10,

Individual beliefs do not matter; it's what our government decides that matters.

1 Reply

@cicerone imposter,

cicerone imposter wrote:

Individual beliefs do not matter; it's what our government decides that matters.

our government must pick a set of beliefs and then must write a set of laws which support those beliefs. should your crime pay for your loved ones? if so why?

1 Reply

@mysteryman,

I am curious why your opinion changed. Was there a particular line of thought that appealed to you?

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@hawkeye10,

Our government's ability to "pick a set of beliefs" belongs on the laffer curve.

The GOP's primary goal is to say "no."

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@hawkeye10,

hawkeye10 wrote:

there is a principle in law to systematically deprive people of personal gains from illegal acts. you can argue for not doing so here, but the default is to uphold our beliefs everywhere.

And the converse would also be true, wouldn't it. If a person has not performed an illegal act, they won't be subject to legal punishment.

1 Reply

@roger,

roger wrote:

hawkeye10 wrote:

there is a principle in law to systematically deprive people of personal gains from illegal acts. you can argue for not doing so here, but the default is to uphold our beliefs everywhere.

And the converse would also be true, wouldn't it. If a person has not performed an illegal act, they won't be subject to legal punishment.

Sending people to where they legally belong is not punishment it is making right, the same as when we relieve people of the stolen goods they bought with out knowledge and send it back where it belongs. I have no right to profit from others illegal acts, when I am not allowed to do so I have not been punished.

1 Reply

@hawkeye10,

You could make that argument about punishment and non-punishment. I could not.

1 Reply

@roger,

roger wrote:

You could make that argument about punishment and non-punishment. I could not.

I note your failure to make a counter-argument.

1 Reply

@hawkeye10,

I consider it punishment. You don't. We disagree.

1 Reply

@roger,

roger wrote:

I consider it punishment. You don't. We disagree.

you have made zero argument. I have. we are not equal here, i win by default.

1 Reply

@hawkeye10,

This problem with illegal aliens is nothing new. In fact, the Indians had a special name for it, they called it 'white people.' ~Jay Leno

1 Reply

@Ice Demon,

Ice Demon wrote:

This problem with illegal aliens is nothing new. In fact, the Indians had a special name for it, they called it 'white people.' ~Jay Leno

show me the Indian law book. no law means no one can break the law....logic 101.

1 Reply

@hawkeye10,

I'm saying look at it from a comedian's aspect, and you'll see that your opinion doesn't matter. The current administration seems to think otherwise.
The problem are parents, not the children. The children are used as human shields for sympathy ploys.
"Immigration policies and laws are based on the
assumption that families will, and should, be united
whether or not parents are deported. Similarly,
child welfare policy aims to reunify families
whenever possible. In practice, however, when
mothers and fathers are detained and deported and
their children are relegated to foster care, family
separation can last for extended periods. Too often,
these children lose the opportunity to ever see their
parents again when a juvenile dependency court
terminates parental rights." (Shattered Families,
executive summary, p. 3)"
There you have it in writing - our immigration policies are to keep families together.
Do you suppose that Obama should sign an executive order it should mandate that children must follow their parents back to the country of origin?
You are not getting your executive order, that is a promise. It doesn't matter what your opinion or my opinion is.

1 Reply

@Ice Demon,

my understanding is that if a mexican has a kid in America that this kid is still entitled to mexican citizenship. do you know different? if not then the mexicans should take their brats back to mexico with them.....end of problem.

2 Replies

@hawkeye10,

Perhaps you haven't heard of "dual citizenship"? And/or perhaps you're not aware of different nationality laws, e.g ius soli, ius sanguinis and mixtures of it?

1 Reply

What should be done about illegal immigration?

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