Why does God permit suffering?

If god knows you're going to praise him, then you don't need to praise him, because god would already know you are going to praise him, but then if you then don't praise him because you know that he knows that you were going to praise him, then god would know that you were not going to praise him, but if you then knew that god knew that you knew that……

I meant glorify. With that one assumption you can conlcude the rest without having to use the Bible.

If God knows you're going to praise him and you don't, He'd be wrong . And God isn't ever wrong. You're getting into freewill. The question is more why, assuming the rest, is there suffering. The answer is as pawns theres no satisfaction to be had. He paved the road, you're driving it. In the end you're going to the same place. You just get to pick how and how fast you're going to get there.

C'mon, give a newbie a break.

Welcome to the forum, Golf.

Can you prove anything you say?

What about my first posts and your trial by fire adventures? Where was the love then

Yeah, but you're a big boy

Chumley wrote:
Where was the love then?

I've been asking that question all my life.

I then did some introspection, and I realized - oh shet! It's all my fault.

For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God. For it is written, I will destroy the wisdom of the wise, and will bring to nothing the understanding of the prudent. Where is the wise? where is the scribe? where is the disputer of this world? hath not God made foolish the wisdom of this world? For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe. For the Jews require a sign, and the Greeks seek after wisdom: But we preach Christ crucified, unto the Jews a stumblingblock, and unto the Greeks foolishness; But unto them which are called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God, and the wisdom of God. Because the foolishness of God is wiser than men; and the weakness of God is stronger than men.

(I Corinthians 1.18f):

It would be easier to have every atom in existence numbered and memorized (this would be a simple thing to God) than to know what God knows IMHO.

Believe.

The original question was:

"So why does the God, who many believe to be all powerful, who is represented as the very definition of love, allow babies to die of starvation? Why does he permit war and crime and sickness and death?"

I would like to know why God would be so loving that he would allow mothers to experience childbirth? I would like to know why God would be so loving that He would allow the sun to shine on us? I would like to know why he would be so loving as to allow us to live on the only planet in the universe capable of sustaining human life? I would like to know why we are so quick to blame God for problems that are primarily our fault, because we are the ones who have polluted and corrupted this world, yet when it comes to His blessings--even his everyday blessings--we don't even acknowledge his existence.


God is not weak and ignorant, as one poster suggested. If God is weak and ignorant, then I submit that anything that God puts His hand to must be evidence of his weakness and ignorance. Of course, that would leave that poster, myself, and everyone else in the world to admit they are the product of weakness and ignorance. Ultimately, it would also lead everyone, including myself, to admit that since they are the product of a weak and ignorant God, then they must also be weak and ignorant. Of course, if this is true, then any claim we make must be made in ignorance, and this would include the claim that God is weak and ignorant. So if a weak and ignorant God made weak and ignorant creatures, because such a God could not be God and create superior beings to himself, and every claim we make is made out of ignorance, then we must be wrong in claiming that He is a weak and ignorant God. The only alternative solution is to say that He is not a weak and ignorant God. Of course, all of this is subject to a person's belief in God, but I will leave that debate for another forum.

The Poet

Undies, welcome.

Which of the following is true?

Your god chooses not to prevent tragedy.
Your god cannot prevent tragedy.
Your god is not aware of any tragedy.

I've heard he is all-loving, all-powerful and all-knowing but clearly he cannot be all three.

By your definition, an all-loving husband can beat his wife as long as he also brings flowers home sometimes.

There is a fourth option:

God has appointed a time in which to set all matters straight.

It may or may not be a time of which you approve; but it's not your choice

There is a 5th choice: there was a god but he 'died'
There is a 6th choice: he intends tragedy
There is a 7th choice: god is capricious

You just make up characteristics of god as you go along. In what way will god set matters straight? Tell us more of your ideas.

Oooh, Oooh, I got this one Neo.

"We cannot know the mind of God, as he is so much greater than us. God will enact his plan in his own time."

That come close?

Please give me the respect of referring to me by the right name, then i will respond.

The Poet

Theu; I'm sure no disrespect was intended.

On this board it is customary to assign nicknames. Most of us are good natured slobs who get along pretty well regardless of our beliefs.

Well, ya got me there.

Right, but only to a point.

There are but two ways in which my statement my be verified. . .

Nah, I'm good. I'll just stick with talking to folks whose names I can be bothered typing out in full.

(purrleeease, anyone who insists on being called "The Poet" is taking themselves just a little too seriously don't you reckon?)

He does claim to be undone, right?