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Hamas Wins !!!

 
 
Reply Thu 26 Jan, 2006 07:04 am
The earthquake
By DAVID HOROVITZ

And so it came to pass.

The earthquake whose warning rumblings the secular Palestinian leadership insistently refused to heed has struck. The era of Fatah is over. The Islamists are taking control.

"No one will vote for Hamas," Nidal Abu-Dahan, Mahmoud Abbas's bodyguard, declared derisively in this column two weeks ago (Why the Palestinians are voting for Hamas), defiantly discounting a series of local election results across the West Bank that had already proved the contrary.

Hamas will get "50.5 percent," Ziad Dayyeh, one of those newly elected local councillors, predicted in the same column, averaging out the municipal election showings and actually, as it has turned out, underestimating the disgust with which ordinary Palestinians have come to regard the Fatah fat cats.

Until yesterday, Israel and the rest of the West were grappling with the problem of how to relate to a Hamas minority in a still Fatah-dominated new Palestinian Authority government, as deaf as Abbas and his colleagues to the scale of the shift on the Palestinian street. Now there can be no escaping the Islamist reality, even if Abbas proves prepared to serve as the fig-leaf, the acceptable, secular, face of the Palestinians' new leadership.

Until yesterday, Israel and much of the West were issuing demands that Hamas put down its arms as a pre-condition for substantive contacts, that it abide by the democratic pre-condition for one rule of law, one legitimate force of arms. Now Hamas's leaders might assert that, in apparently fair elections, the Palestinian public has entrusted them with the rule of law, that they bear the single legitimate force of arms.

Ordinary Palestinians will tell you that they voted for Hamas because the Fatah PA cheated them and stole from them, whereas the Islamists have proved themselves exemplars of good governance at the local level. Many will stress that their vote for Hamas was not a ballot for a renewed campaign of suicide bombings and shooting attacks on Israeli targets.

And many Hamas officials will doubtless highlight, as Ziad Dayyeh did when I met with him in El-Bireh two weeks ago, that the patron of those suicide bombings and of Hamas itself, Sheikh Ahmed Yassin, provided religious legitimacy for a suspension of such attacks and a temporary accommodation with Israel.

But Hamas's founding charter is uncompromising in its intolerance of Israel. It strives "to raise the banner of Allah over every inch of Palestine" and prescribes "resistance and quelling the enemy" as "the individual duty of every Muslim, male and female."

Some may seek comfort in the belief that an ascent to government could prompt a greater sense of responsibility, a move to moderation. But Hamas's intolerance is based on a perceived religious imperative. No believing Muslim, in the Hamas conception, can be reconciled to Jewish sovereignty in the Middle East. To deny that, for Hamas, is blasphemy.

And that is the ideology to which the Palestinian people, for whatever reason and by their own free hand, have just tied their fate. That is the guiding ideology with which Israel and the West will now have to grapple.
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blueflame1
 
  1  
Reply Thu 26 Jan, 2006 11:24 am
'Hamas victory a blessing in disguise'
By EETTA PRINCE-GIBSON


"The Hamas victory in the Palestinian elections may be a blessing in disguise," Hanna Siniora, a candidate in Wednesday's elections for the Palestinian Legislative Council, told The Jerusalem Post Thursday.

"Now that they are in power, Hamas will have to take responsibility for the future. They will have to become more moderate. Now they are part of the democratic game and they will have to play by the democratic rules," Siniora said.

Siniora, a 69-year-old east Jerusalemite Christian, is publisher of The Jerusalem Times and a co-CEO of the Israel/Palestine Center for Research and Information. An early proponent of negotiations with Israel, he has long been involved in pro-peace activities. He was one of seven candidates contending for one of the two seats reserved for Christians in the Jerusalem district, but is unlikely to win the seat.

"Once they are in power, the Hamas will have to pay salaries, create jobs and provide health and education services. They know that to do all of this, they need stability. In order to be in charge of the government, they will have to
become responsible leaders, if they want to stay in power," he predicted.

Siniora said that Hamas has already begun this process of moderation. "Hamas was responsible during the cease fire with Israel - in fact, they were in better control of their people than Fatah was. And they moderated their rhetoric, especially the positions that were anathema to the United States and Israel, such as calling for the destruction of the State of Israel."

Furthermore, he added, "Hamas ran under the slogan, 'Reform and Change' and promised a clean, efficient government. They ran as 'Mr. Clean' in these elections."

For these reasons, Siniora does not believe that the popular vote for Hamas was a vote of support for their terrorist agenda.

"Voting for Hamas was as much a backlash against the PLO as it was a vote for Hamas," he told the Post. "The voters wanted to say to the Fatah, 'You have done nothing for ten years. Now get out.'" http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?cid=1137605924104&pagename=JPost%2FJPArticle%2FShowFull
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okie
 
  1  
Reply Thu 26 Jan, 2006 04:31 pm
If they remain terrorists bent on wiping Israel off the face of the map, then as the official government, then acts of terrorism by them becomes more definitely linked with an identifiable government which is a more visible target for Israel and more accountability may be in order. They better watch their step, they may have gotten more than they bargained for if they continue their terrorist ways. It might be a good thing for Israel. At least the enemy, one of the enemies, is more visible now.
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Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Thu 26 Jan, 2006 05:26 pm
Excerpted from today's NY Daily News
Final results of yesterday's Palestinian legislative elections are still trickling in. But one thing is sure: Yasser Arafat's chickens have come home to roost. After decades of dictatorial and corrupt control by the late Fatah leader and his cohorts, vast numbers of voters in both the West Bank and Gaza have angrily turned their backs on Arafat's heirs and given their support to rival Hamas, the radical Islamic party.
The prime result: Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas may feel obliged to let Hamas join a coalition government.

Trouble is, Hamas remains the same terrorist party it's always been, a heavily armed, blood-drenched gang that boasts of suicide bombings and doesn't even pretend to want peace with Israel. Its goals are crystal clear: the total annihilation of the Jewish state in favor of an Islamic state throughout the entire Holy Land. Its presence in a Palestinian government is hardly incentive for Israel to follow up on its recent withdrawal from Gaza and move ahead on the U.S.-sponsored road map to Mideast peace. . . .


. . . . The U.S., the European Union, Russia and the United Nations have all declared that "a future Palestinian Authority cabinet should include no member who has not committed to the principles of Israel's right to exist in peace and security and an unequivocal end to violence and terrorism." And two weeks ago, Secretary of State Rice said that "armed groups have no place in the democratic process."

Let's hope they hold firm. Granting any legitimacy to Hamas unless it seriously disarms and changes policy would be total disaster. At the very least it would undermine Palestinian moderates who preach that violence will distance Palestinian statehood, not bring it closer. It could also produce a defeat for Israeli moderates in Israel's upcoming March elections. Then back to square one-minus.
http://www.nydailynews.com/news/ideas_opinions/story/385822p-327415c.html
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Dartagnan
 
  1  
Reply Thu 26 Jan, 2006 05:30 pm
Netanyahu's idea of peace between Palestine and Israel probably helped increase the Hamas vote. He's so far right and militant he made Sharon seem reasonable...
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Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Thu 26 Jan, 2006 05:39 pm
Nevertheless, the main talking point in Netanyahu's current run for the top will be that his policies reduced incidents of terrorism to the lowest point they had been in a half century. And he can back that up. If Hamas keeps rattling sabers and setting off bombs, the people of Israel will probably want somebody who isn't afraid to stand up to their enemy and stop them.
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blueflame1
 
  1  
Reply Thu 26 Jan, 2006 07:29 pm
Egypt says Hamas recognizes existence of Israel Sat Jan 21, 6:15 AM ET

CAIRO (Reuters) - The Palestinian militant group Hamas recognizes the existence of Israel and will go along with negotiations with the Jewish state, Egyptian Foreign Minister Ahmed Aboul Gheit said in an interview published on Saturday.


Aboul Gheit, whose government has had close contacts with Hamas and other Palestinian militants over the past year, also said that joining the political process would lead to fundamental changes in the thinking of Hamas.

Hamas, which advocates replacing Israel with an Islamic state throughout historical Palestine, is taking part in Palestinian parliamentary elections for the first time on January 25. It poses a strong challenge to the ruling Fatah movement.

The United States and the European Union want Hamas to disarm and renounce armed struggle against Israel.

Aboul Gheit, interviewed in the London-based newspaper Asharq al-Awsat, said: "I am confident that Hamas recognizes the existence of Israel and I am confident that it is able to coexist with the idea of negotiations with Israel."

"There's no need to keep equivocating on this matter, especially since Hamas has already accepted a truce with Israel for the sake of negotiations. I wonder whether this truce was with a ghost," he added.

In March Egypt helped persuade Hamas and the militant Islamic Jihad group to accept a conditional halt to attacks on Israelis until the end of 2005. Hamas has shown more respect for the truce than many other factions.

Aboul Gheit said: "The Hamas which works in the political framework through parliamentary work is completely different from the Hamas which adopts armed struggle... We believe that Hamas joining the political process will lead to a fundamental change in its thinking and its premises."

Asked about U.S. and European threats to cut aid to the Palestinian Authority if Hamas wins the elections, he said the elections should take place without intervention.

A Hamas spokesman said this week that there was no question of disarming and that it was "committed to resistance against the occupation."
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okie
 
  1  
Reply Thu 26 Jan, 2006 11:00 pm
Is this talk in the mold of Yassar Arafat? He said one set of things to Americans and to Israel, that he wanted peace and negotiation, and when he was speaking to his own people, the message was 180 degrees out of phase, that they were intent on eliminating the state of Israel. Terrorists lie and have always lied about their intents. Lying is part of their tactics. I guess you can always hope, but most importantly their actions must be what is taken seriously, not their words.
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Brandon9000
 
  1  
Reply Thu 26 Jan, 2006 11:44 pm
D'artagnan wrote:
Netanyahu's idea of peace between Palestine and Israel probably helped increase the Hamas vote. He's so far right and militant he made Sharon seem reasonable...

Is he sending any kids with nail bombs strapped to their waists to blow up public places?
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InfraBlue
 
  1  
Reply Fri 27 Jan, 2006 12:05 am
foxyfyre wrote:
Most authorities, not the least being Benjamin Netanyahu, former prime minister of Isaral, think peace lost big time in this election.


If you're referring to the peace process, it has been dead since long before this election, since around 2000.

Quote:
If Hamas keeps rattling sabers and setting off bombs, the people of Israel will probably want somebody who isn't afraid to stand up to their enemy and stop them.


According to Martin Inkyk, former US ambassador to Israel, Hamas hasn't conducted any terrorist attacks within the last year. In a very good question and answer session on PBS' News Hour he stated that, "they understand that they have to meet the needs of the Palestinian people . . . And I think that there is a good prospect that because the Palestinians people are exhausted, because they don't want to see a return to the violence and terror of the Intifada, that Hamas in government will actually maintain the calm and then we will have the ultimate irony, that while they don't want to make peace with Israel, they may actually have an interest in maintaining the calm and maintaining the peace."

http://www.pbs.org/newshour/bb/middle_east/jan-june06/hamas_1-26.html
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InfraBlue
 
  1  
Reply Fri 27 Jan, 2006 12:05 am
Brandon wrote:
Is he sending any kids with nail bombs strapped to their waists to blow up public places?


No, but he's so far right and militant he made Sharon seem reasonable...
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Brandon9000
 
  1  
Reply Fri 27 Jan, 2006 03:43 pm
InfraBlue wrote:
Brandon wrote:
Is he sending any kids with nail bombs strapped to their waists to blow up public places?


No, but he's so far right and militant he made Sharon seem reasonable...

Which is a vanishingly small sin compared to people who deliberately strap bombs to their waists and murder non-combatants, including babies, not as a mistake, not even because they don't care, but as the intended target.
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Dartagnan
 
  1  
Reply Fri 27 Jan, 2006 04:37 pm
Yesterday's terrorists are today's freedom fighters. Take Menachim Begin. Do you know his history during the British occupation of Palestine, Brandon?
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blueflame1
 
  1  
Reply Fri 27 Jan, 2006 04:47 pm
Gush Shalom : Now, more than at any other time, the struggle for peace must not stop.

The following declaration of principles is a proposal for joint Israeli-Palestinian discussion. It should not be considered a take-it-or-leave-it proposition.

We went into details in order to express our conviction that all the issues at stake - the components of the conflict - can be resolved. Not by diktats, not by an overbearing master-and-servant attitude, but by negotiations between equals.

The government and the army leadership are leading us into a hell of blood and fire. We call upon all peace-seekers in Israel to unite for the future of the two peoples of this country, Jewish Israelis and Palestinian Arabs.

The country has given birth to us as twins.


Draft Peace Agreement

Between the State of Israel and the Palestine Liberation Organization, the Representative of the Palestinian People.
Whereas both parties wish to end the historical conflict between them, establish peace and bring about a historical conciliation between the two nations,

And whereas both parties wish to base the peace on the principles of self-determination, mutual respect, justice and equality,

And whereas both parties acknowledge the principle of "two states for two nations",

And whereas both parties accept UN resolutions 242,338 and 194 as the basis for a solution and regard the implementation of the agreement below as the full realization of these resolutions,

It is agreed by both parties:
http://domino.un.org/UNISPAL.NSF/0/ef5f8d942930e11b85256e38006a10c4?OpenDocument
0 Replies
 
Brandon9000
 
  1  
Reply Sat 28 Jan, 2006 08:05 pm
D'artagnan wrote:
Yesterday's terrorists are today's freedom fighters. Take Menachim Begin. Do you know his history during the British occupation of Palestine, Brandon?

Isreal does not have an official policy of going into public places in a deliberate attempt to kill non-combatants as the primary, intended target.
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Finn dAbuzz
 
  1  
Reply Sat 28 Jan, 2006 11:37 pm
Hamas succeeded beyond their hopes or plans.

It is possible that the mantle of responsibility will cause them to moderate their ways, but it is not likely and thus far there is no indication that it will.

The destruction of Israel is the core value of Hamas members.

Is there a culture more macho than that of the Arabs? Their favorite soccer team wins a game and they fill the streets firing machine guns in the air. This is not a culture that is going to easily back down from it's most aggressive assertions.

The Palestinian people are like drug addicts. They will have no hope until they kick their jones for the destruction of Israel.
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OCCOM BILL
 
  1  
Reply Sun 29 Jan, 2006 12:33 am
They've elected a terrorist organization to power and I can't imagine that being good for them. If (when?) Israel is forced to defend itself again; the enemy will be very, very clear and retaliatory attacks on Palestine will be legitimized like never before. I for one will find it harder to support the Palestinian people knowing this really is their will. I'd like to see them moderate, but suspect they haven't and won't "be careful what they wish for". I fear they will very soon see just how well Israel can defend itself and I'll find it harder than ever to censure Israel for doing so. IMO, this is a very sad development.
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Finn dAbuzz
 
  1  
Reply Sun 29 Jan, 2006 12:42 am
OCCOM BILL wrote:
They've elected a terrorist organization to power and I can't imagine that being good for them. If (when?) Israel is forced to defend itself again; the enemy will be very, very clear and retaliatory attacks on Palestine will be legitimized like never before. I for one will find it harder to support the Palestinian people knowing this really is their will. I'd like to see them moderate, but suspect they haven't and won't "be careful what they wish for". I fear they will very soon see just how well Israel can defend itself and I'll find it harder than ever to censure Israel for doing so. IMO, this is a very sad development.


Hamas has, until now, enjoyed the status of a non governmental, quasi illegal organization.

When Mexican drug lords cross the border into the US and shoot up American citizens, the US government is constrained from invading Mexico to render justice.

If the Mexican drug lords ran for and won political power, the gloves would come off.

The same applies in the Holy Lands.

Now that Hamas has won political control over Palestine, the first time that a Hamas suicide bomber detonates himself in an Israeli bus, a state or war will commence.

If Israel follows Sharon's Third Way, the ascendsy of Hamas can only be an advantage to them.
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OCCOM BILL
 
  1  
Reply Sun 29 Jan, 2006 12:56 am
Precisely Finn. Perhaps its been inevitable all along and they're now coming down the End Game. If so; do you think Palestine will be left to stand alone? Or will this become the new battlefield, once and for all? My guess is; fear of the United States will prevent an escalation... but who knows?
0 Replies
 
Finn dAbuzz
 
  1  
Reply Sun 29 Jan, 2006 01:10 am
OCCOM BILL wrote:
Precisely Finn. Perhaps its been inevitable all along and they're now coming down the End Game. If so; do you think Palestine will be left to stand alone? Or will this become the new battlefield, once and for all? My guess is; fear of the United States will prevent an escalation... but who knows?


The apologists for institutionalized Palestinian terror are legion. Palestine, even if it is run by Hamas, will never be left to stand, rhetorically, alone.

Should war ensue between Israel and Palestine, we can expect the Europeans to wring their hands and condemn Israel. So what?

More problematic is how other Arab nations will feel compelled to respond.

By now they know that Israel can kick their collective butts, but they will be forced, at least, to rattle their sabres by the Arab Street.

In the end, I doubt the Arab nations will do anything beyond rhetorical condemnation, particularly when the US stands up to support Israel.

Negotiations with the Palestinians is a non-starter. Israel's best options are to wall them off or destroy them. Hamas may provide the opportunity to choose the second option.
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