The US, UN & Iraq III

Reassuring to know, perception, that you have full knowledge of all events, happenings, and thinking, and can so easily apply your expertise in all this. Equally reassuring that you know what democrat thinks, should be thinking, should be saying. How come you're not running? With all this wonderful perception, you'd make a better candidate than Bush.

Mama

Yeah I know----Just can't imagine why they haven't asked my advice.

As I posted in another thread mamaj - anybody is better than the jerk currently occupying the office

Blatham

Hi old friend---as you said earlier ---we do go back a long way ---all the way to the very beginning of this thread ----which seems like about two lifetimes.

Your link was to a very balanced article and I recommend it to everyone( probably a good reason for everyone on this thread to ignore it) I especially liked the following sentence.

"The fact is, in the decades since the founding of the U.N. Security Council, that entity has never succeeded in establishing itself as the final authority bestowing legitimacy on military action, and it is no closer to doing so today".

Hey I like your RMP avatar but I can't help but wonder if it really represents flipping the bird at authority.

Mama wrote:


Reassuring to know, perception, that you have full knowledge of all events, happenings, and thinking, and can so easily apply your expertise in all this. Equally reassuring that you know what democrat thinks, should be thinking, should be saying. How come you're not running? With all this wonderful perception, you'd make a better candidate than Bush.

Nice of you to write even in sarcasm but the only omnipotent one I know is Kuvasz---if you know what I mean----whew. Sure glad he hasn't demanded that I fall on my sword.

Breaking news on the radio but haven't found anything on the Internet is that the U.N. will be involved with the reconstruction and new government of Iraq. Syria abstained as they did not like the makeup of the Iraqi council (well, duh...)

Excellent article, blatham.

Perc, I thought you were going to say that they begged you to run for prez but you are too busy keeping a certain group of forum chatters in line. :wink:

The line you quote from the FP article, perc, is true, of course. But the UN is all we have, however imperfect.

Kara wrote

Perc, I thought you were going to say that they begged you to run for prez but you are too busy keeping a certain group of forum chatters in line.

Certainly is a full time job

Re: the thing about the UN ----sadly it will never get any better until the UN charter is corrected and that has about as much chance as me being elected President

Wizard wrote:

Breaking news on the radio but haven't found anything on the Internet is that the U.N. will be involved with the reconstruction and new government of Iraq. Syria abstained as they did not like the makeup of the Iraqi council (well, duh...)

Yeah I suspect most of them just want to get their pretty white land rover and park it in front of their PALACE. The only thing the UN will accomplish will the pecking order to see who gets what palace. And then our guys will be assigned to guard the bastards and clean up after them. The UN official cocktail circuit is about to crank up in Iraq.
Just another obstacle for our guys in finding WoMDs and Saddam.

perception

You might have missed something: the resolution was US-drafted!

I doubt, btw, that any palaces are to be found Iraq not occupied by US-troops already.

Kara, we have no objetive there but to stay alive as long as possible. As long as we have no objective, how can we accomplish anything..

What are our sons, daughters, brothers, sisters, giving up thteir lives to accomplish?

The only way to end war is to end it ... bring whats left home ....NOW!

Walter wrote:

You might have missed something: the resolution was US-drafted!


I might have known it---the US gets blamed for everything else why not that?

Yeah --- I know it was an American communist that Truman appointed to draft it. (can't think of his name) But the operative word is "Draft"---there are at least three other countries who played a part and every one of them including the US wanted the UN to be a shell without substance. But can you imagine the UN tasking the US to send thousands of combat troops into battle under the command of a French "general"? Not in this lifetime! Our diplomats could see that happening especially with the number of countries all with a vote the same as ours. The rest of the world would love that.

Re: The palaces----when does some poor GI outrank some 3rd world diplomat who wants his own palace?

Back to the UN in Iraq----my god ---- can you imagine about 10,000 3rd world wonders,each with his own white land rover with hard hat and clipboard sucking up what little gas there is and and raising the rent prices for all the largest homes in Iraq. Then of course they must be stocked with the best booze complete with servants. Yup----just what we need

We went to war, we struck pre-emptively, to accomplish something I never thought was reasonable and would not have been even if our administration had revised their agenda to dance us around and come up with a rationale.

We are there. We colonized Iraq. Now we must do the really difficult job of creating a country out of chaos. It was a monstrous idea from the start, but we took it on. Now, we have it served up to us --a country in disarray -- and you want us to leave?

We are responsible for what we have done. We must see it through.

Kara

It falls on deaf ears-----IMO

Unfortunately, yes; at question, the way you accomplish the job. The current method and its boss suck!!!!!!!!!!!!

a



Kara, if, as you say, we are all guilty of aiding and abetting the crimes committed in our name by an un-elected non official, wouldn't our guilt be compounded with each death, Iraqi or American from here to our departure from Iraq?

And what of Afghanistan?

We have everything to lose and nothing to gain ....

Bring them home ..... alive

I tend to agree with Kara, in principle at least. But it's really important that we act (for a change!) with a little humility -- preferably a lot of humility. To work as equals with members of the international community to repair the damage in both Afghanistan and Iraq. Working with others would restore our reputation, at least to some extent, and begin to win back some badly needed friends. "Bring them home alive" is a good thought, a natural wish. But we owe first our best efforts to leave the invaded alive and well, even at cost to ourselves. With a little less pride and subterfuge, we might even start to do the job well and avoid casualties.

Jeez Tartarin----Is that really you saying that?