Define God

neologist wrote:

And I believe he has made his purpose and intentions understandable to even the least sophisticated among us.

I must be at the sub bargain basement level of sophistication in the eyes of god Confused

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Why would God have any regard for 'sophistication?'

None of us really are spphisticated or elevated, anyway.

Wherever we all came from, that's where we all came from.

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queen annie wrote:

Amigo wrote:
One time I said; "God is truth"

God is truth and everything there is to know.

I think there is a base, a root perhaps--something which remains when all the rest (illusion) is stripped away. This 'thing' has an utterly pure nature that is understood/experienced on several levels: Light, love, truth, mind, thought, energy...

These things are part of every human. But I feel they are 'God.' These are that which 'will not be moved.'

That there would be levels is a human idea. To help them understand something they can never understand and what it is we can't understand or optain is Omnipotence.

Omnipotence needs no order of understanding or need to separate into levels.

I have to think about your statement about light, love, truth, mind, thought and energy being god and that god cannot be moved. To me meaning the good at it's root can not be compromised.

But that leads us back. What is the nature of good and god?

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neologist wrote:

Amigo wrote:
Neologist, One time I said; "God is truth" A very short response in another thread. You responded. I did not respond back but I read what you said.

God is truth and everything there is to know. God is the knowledge of right and wrong. God is the travel through infinity and time all at once at will.
OK; but I can't find your post in search.

I believe it is impossible for God to lie. And I believe he has made his purpose and intentions understandable to even the least sophisticated among us.

That is why I constantly ask those who are intellectual among us to prune their posts for clarity.

How can truth be a lie? It is possible for god to lie because we declare to know the truth when we ourselves are liers and yet we trust our own judgment of what god is.

God is the truth we don't know but seek till death to understand.

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Chumly wrote:

neologist wrote:
And I believe he has made his purpose and intentions understandable to even the least sophisticated among us.
I must be at the sub bargain basement level of sophistication in the eyes of god

Not at all. Consider Jesus' words at Matthew 11:25: "At that time Jesus said in response: "I publicly praise you, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, because you have hidden these things from the wise and intellectual ones and have revealed them to babes."

Not that you should 'dumb yourself down', either. You will understand in time.

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Amigo wrote:

neologist wrote:
Amigo wrote:
Neologist, One time I said; "God is truth" A very short response in another thread. You responded. I did not respond back but I read what you said.

God is truth and everything there is to know. God is the knowledge of right and wrong. God is the travel through infinity and time all at once at will.
OK; but I can't find your post in search.

I believe it is impossible for God to lie. And I believe he has made his purpose and intentions understandable to even the least sophisticated among us.

That is why I constantly ask those who are intellectual among us to prune their posts for clarity.
How can truth be a lie? It is possible for god to lie because we declare to know the truth when we ourselves are liers and yet we trust our own judgment of what god is.

God is the truth we don't know but seek till death to understand.

There are many things about God we could not understand in any length of time. However, none of those things are essential for our happiness.

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Ecclesiastes 9:5,6: ...

It is so similar.. well...

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Amigo wrote:

That there would be levels is a human idea.

Exactly! Those levels/layers--those are veils, delusions, illusions, whatever--they are necessary but they are not permanent. They fall away as they may--some welcome their leaving, but others cling on to them. And others don't even know they are there. It doesn't matter, really.

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Omnipotence needs no order of understanding or need to separate into levels.

Right--it's like ultimate mind-unity or some such thing like that...

Quote:

I have to think about your statement about light, love, truth, mind, thought and energy being god and that god cannot be moved. To me meaning the good at it's root can not be compromised.

That's what I meant--there is no chance for anything compromising because there is nothing to oppose it. It is beyond 'good,' therefore, and even 'evil.' Those are part of the layers, the veils.

When it gets the point the type of unity that needs no reflection of any sort in order to self-identify, then good and evil, right and wrong, male/female, sweet or sour, (and on and on) cease to exist because they are not required. Nothing is required. It just is.

Quote:

But that leads us back. What is the nature of good and god?

The nature of good, IMO, is defined by the ego--at this point in time in our human development.
'Only God is good,' the bible reads. Yet God is good because we need a good God. God doesn't need to be good.

The nature of God, well, that is yet relative, as well....

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queen annie wrote:

. . .The nature of good, IMO, is defined by the ego--at this point in time in our human development.
'Only God is good,' the bible reads. Yet God is good because we need a good God. God doesn't need to be good. . .

God doesn't need anything and doesn't need us to be complete.

However the central question of the universe, as raised by the rebel Satan, is whether God has the right to set standards for his sentient creatures.

It would not make sense to affirm his right were he not 'good'.

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neologist wrote:

God doesn't need anything and doesn't need us to be complete.

How do you know that, when you don't even know if God exists.

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rosborne979 wrote:

neologist wrote:
God doesn't need anything and doesn't need us to be complete.

How do you know that, when you don't even know if God exists.

Precisely the reason for the title of this thread.

Change the word 'doesn't' to 'wouldn't' and see if it makes a difference to you.

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neologist wrote:

Change the word 'doesn't' to 'wouldn't' and see if it makes a difference to you.

Yes, that makes more sense. It tells me about your assumption without actually making the assumption. Much better. Smile

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What's your assumption?

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neologist wrote:

What's your assumption?

My assumption is that if anything can go wrong, it will.

My next assumption is that the supernatural does not exist, and that I am capable of understanding the world around me, and that my perceptions are not pure illusion, or delusion.

After that, I follow Occam's Razor.

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neologist wrote:

However the central question of the universe, as raised by the rebel Satan, is whether God has the right to set standards for his sentient creatures.

It would not make sense to affirm his right were he not 'good'.

From my perspective, the standards are not set for general authoritarianism, but rather in the fashion of a basic required principle:

Those who wish to draw near to God must seek to share God's nature.

The standards are for neccesity, not government or direct control by God. God is self-governing, and we must acquire that ability in order to draw near.
We must learn to control ourselves, because God is not going to do it for us.

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Bertrand Russell had this to say

"Many orthodox people speak as though it were the business of sceptics to disprove received dogmas rather than of dogmatists to prove them. This is, of course, a mistake. If I were to suggest that between the Earth and Mars there is a china teapot revolving about the sun in an elliptical orbit, nobody would be able to disprove my assertion provided I were careful to add that the teapot is too small to be revealed even by our most powerful telescopes. But if I were to go on to say that, since my assertion cannot be disproved, it is intolerable presumption on the part of human reason to doubt it, I should rightly be thought to be talking nonsense. If, however, the existence of such a teapot were affirmed in ancient books, taught as the sacred truth every Sunday, and instilled into the minds of children at school, hesitation to believe in its existence would become a mark of eccentricity and entitle the doubter to the attentions of the psychiatrist in an enlightened age or of the Inquisitor in an earlier time."
-- Bertrand Russell, "Is There a God?"

.........but even worse it seems to me, people not only believe in the Teapot, they say they know this Teapot. It is a porcelain teapot. With blue glaze. Or green. With a big handle. Or small handle. Or no handle Moreover it has feelings. It doesnt like us drinking coffee. We must obey its every will. Some people claim to speak for the Teapot, they disagree about what the teapot likes, but they all say Teapot is on their side. So when it comes to war about the colour of the teapot, the Teapot is on both sides regarding an atribute of itself that is absurd.

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Ok, well I honestly don't remember if I responded to this one or not yet. So rather than reading through... what? 35 pages, I decided to just start with a clean slate. Prepare yourself for corniness personified! LOL Back in the day... I used to write a lot of poetry. At one time I had made an attempt to write a poem about God. Though I do realize you really can't describe Him with words. I thought it might be interesting to at least throw this out there. Enjoy! Hehehe... Don't be too hard me though... I'm just a baby duck... quack quack...

A Tribute to my Father

My Father
If I could paint a picture with my words
My picture would be of Him
Every line so delicately drawn
Oh, it's beauty only one's heart could behold

My Father
So gentle and patient, His Love softly caresses
Even the hardest of hearts
Cannot possibly withstand
If it has truly been touched by His Love

My Father
Whose hope for me burns brighter than the sun
His grace never failing
Whose mercy ripples slowly
Covering broken dreams with a vision for Him.

My Father
Who sent His only Son to suffer quietly
My deepest of pain.
To be my gateway into eternal life
That I may always know that I am truly forgiven.

My Father
Who has given me His Spirit as a guarantee
Of His love, never forsaking.
Comforting in sorrow, rejoicing in victory.
Whispering in a still small voice, "And Lo, I am with you always"

My Father
No words I could say would describe Him completely
And no picture I could draw would fully show His beauty
But I believe in my heart that it is enough to say
That He is my Father

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Very good fizzbar. Except for the religious content (there had to a backhanded comment eh?) but not as good as the one directed at me ...see below

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My definition of god is by a negative abstraction:

The fewer people who believe in god, and hopefully by default then believe in Mankind, the saner this world will be.

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I came across an article recently that stated that all philosophical attempts to prove God's existence are either horribly flawed or do the opposite (i.e. disprove God's existence).

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