Atheists... Your life is pointless

@cicerone imposter,

cicerone imposter wrote:

Nobody has claimed there is no room for doubt, but us humans rely on some evidence to assert that something must exist.

If you read RL's posts you will see he has absolute conviction in his (non) beliefs. He has no room for doubt. His use of the word 'truth,' demonstrates that.

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@cicerone imposter,

Quote:

If I assert there are 10000 elves flying around mars, the burden of proof falls on me, and I must provide evidence for such a claim.

Almost true, but not quite. If someone makes such an assertion and then follows it up with the insistence that therefore others must accept and/or believe there are 10,000 elves flying around Mars, there is a burden of truth for that person to support the assertion with evidence.

However, if someone is asked about his/her personal beliefs, and/or simply states what they are in the course of a discussion of religion or faith or spirituality, etc., and that statement does not contain any such insistence or suggestion that since they themselves hold that belief it follows that others must also, there isn't any burden of proof to produce evidence to convince anyone of anything.

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@snood,

Good point, snood.

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@edgarblythe,

But suppose if everybody believed that there 10,000 elves flying around Mars and that they had sent a message down to earth advising us to change the way we live and we took the advice and discovered that we thereby changed what can only be described as a waking nightmare, where everybody was frightened stiff of what each day might bring, into a land of milk and honey and luxury beyond the wildest dreams of Greek philosophers.

What then ed?

Would we be justified in ostracising those who wouldn't believe to some island where the silly fuckers could shift for themselves?

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@snood,

But that's not the point of discussion; it's about proving there are no gods. Frank says "I don't know."

That's the issue.

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@reasoning logic,

Quote:

I can agree with that logic but what I am trying to establish is your logical understanding of how assertions works when countering claims such as that with a God or Gods or anything else that I see no evidence to support.

That is why I asked the below question.

Quote:
Ok so if I were to assert that there are no elves going at it on each side of your head because I see no evidence to support that they are giving you an ear job, Are you suggesting that this lack of evidence should not be taken into consideration to better understand the probability of its none existance?

RL...if a person makes an assertion, the burden of proof of the assertion falls on the person making the assertion.

If you are asserting that "the probability" of the existence of a god or gods is less than "the probability" of no god or gods...the burden of proof for that assertion falls on you. I seriously doubt you could meet that burden.

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@cicerone imposter,

Quote:

All of your "so whats" only proves what I have asserted that there are no gods. They are all man's creations and nothing more.

Those are the "so what."

ci, if you want to assume that because I have offered a few "so what's" to your posts, that my doing so PROVES there are no gods...well, by all means do so.

But that notion is so absurd it shouldn't even be taken seriously by you.

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@Frank Apisa,

Quote:

RL...if a person makes an assertion, the burden of proof of the assertion falls on the person making the assertion.

If you are asserting that "the probability" of the existence of a god or gods is less than "the probability" of no god or gods...the burden of proof for that assertion falls on you. I seriously doubt you could meet that burden.

Let me reword this just a little and I would like to ask if you could explain to me and others if this is relevant to the conversation or not.

OK so if I were to assert that "the probability" of the existence of 2 invisible elves on each side of your head having ear sex with your ears is less than "the probability" no invisible elves having ear sex with your ears...the burden of proof for that assertion falls on me, therefore you seriously doubt I could meet that burden? Really! Are you being serious? Are you saying that there may be to elves going at it because we do not know this for certain?

I am not trying to make fun of this logic but only trying to use absurdity to share my view point.

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@reasoning logic,

Quote:

I am not trying to make fun of this logic but only trying to use absurdity to share my view point.

No you're not rl. You're trying to avoid my last post whilst remaining in the discussion. It's your fault you have no answer to it.

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@izzythepush,

Quote:

If you read RL's posts you will see he has absolute conviction in his (non) beliefs. He has no room for doubt. His use of the word 'truth,' demonstrates that.

I sure wish "not that I thinks that wishes help" that you could understand that I think very little of what I share may be factual compared to the abundance of opinions that I share. I doubt myself way more than anyone I know and I think that I have been looked down on for doing so.
You have no idea of how much I would like to be, like many who believe in their assertions but I find way to much ignorance in that position. Do not get me wrong because I think that it can have a financial advantage to assert yourself but I find it to be intellectually dishonest.

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@reasoning logic,

OOOOWWWEEE!! A ******* man of honour. Is that anti-American or what?

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@spendius,

Which post specifically spendius? I will try and address it before I go to sleep. I have to get up in about 7 hours to go to work so if I do not address it today I will address it tomorrow when I get home.

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@reasoning logic,

Quote:

Let me reword this just a little and I would like to ask if you could explain to me and others if this is relevant to the conversation or not.

OK so if I were to assert that "the probability" of the existence of 2 invisible elves on each side of your head having ear sex with your ears is less than "the probability" no invisible elves having ear sex with your ears...the burden of proof for that assertion falls on me, therefore you seriously doubt I could meet that burden? Really! Are you being serious? Are you saying that there may be to elves going at it because we do not know this for certain?

I am not trying to make fun of this logic but only trying to use absurdity to share my view point.

I do not mean this as an insult, RL, but I do want to congratulate you on your success at using absurdity to share your view.

As for the burden of proof...no matter what absurdity you use, if you make an assertion, the burden of proof does fall on you.

1 Reply

@Frank Apisa,

Quote:

I do not mean this as an insult, RL, but I do want to congratulate you on your success at using absurdity to share your view.

OK so you do see where I am coming from somewhat? The burden of proof can not be established without evidence so therefore any claims made may not be true if no evidence is present but is it possible to make negative assertions such as I did and be correct? Probably not in most cases but I do think you seen the point that I was trying to make, if you were not able, please let me know.

1 Reply

@reasoning logic,

Quote:

OK so you do see where I am coming from somewhat? The burden of proof can not be established without evidence so therefore any claims made may not be true if no evidence is present but is it possible to make negative assertions such as I did and be correct? Probably not in most cases but I do think you seen the point that I was trying to make, if you were not able, please let me know.

Yes, I see that point. But I have never argued otherwise. Of course you can make negative assertions...and they MIGHT be correct. But if you make an assertion...positive or negative, the burden of proof for the assertion falls on the person making the assertion.

That is what I have been saying consistently.

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@Frank Apisa,

If someone makes an assertion, for instance, that there is a GOD...it makes fine sense to say, "Well, the burden of proof falls on you to establish that there is a GOD."

But if the reply is, "No there are no gods"...it makes just as fine sense to say, "Well, the burden of proof falls on your to establish that there are no gods."

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@Frank Apisa,

Given that in theory you could indeed prove that there is a god if there is one and there is no way that you can disprove a negative such that any imagine god or whatever does not exist the burden is on the person who wish to prove a positive statement of there is a god.

There is zero proof that the so call Christian god exist anymore then the tooth fairy exist so there is no reason to assume that such a god exist any more then the tooth fairy exist.

An there is no reason to give an adult any more respect for claiming a god exist as there is to adults that are claiming that the tooth fairy is real.

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@Frank Apisa,

Quote:

Yes, I see that point.

I worded that wrong it should read.

Quote:

The burden of proof can not be established without evidence so therefore any claims made may not be true if no evidence is present but is it possible to make negative assertions such as I did and be correct? Probably not in "Some" cases but when it comes to make believe or where no evidence is present, it sure seems to me that the burden of proof should be on the person making the claim of existence and the person countering the claim should be seen as the more creditable person rather than the person making a claim of existence or something being a part of reality and has no proof.

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@BillRM,

BillRM wrote:

An there is no reason to give an adult any more respect for claiming a god exist as there is to adults that are claiming that the tooth fairy is real.

Sez you, but you're hardly the sharpest knife in the drawer. FF put it best.

Quote:

It's amazing how you persist in discussing legal issues, and laws, you don't understand, in thread after thread. You really do enjoy making a fool of yourself. And you're too dumb to know when you should shut up.

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@BillRM,

Quote:

Given that in theory you could indeed prove that there is a god if there is one and there is no way that you can disprove a negative such that any imagine god or whatever does not exist the burden is on the person who wish to prove a positive statement of there is a god.

If a person makes an assertion (or positive statement, if you will) that there is a GOD, the burden of proof definitely falls on that person...the burden for some realistic evidence also falls on that person.

If a person makes an assertion (or positive statement, if you will) that there are no gods (YES, THAT IS A POSITIVE ASSSERTION), then the burden of proof definitely falls on that person.

If you cannot prove your assertion...simply do not make it.

Quote:

There is zero proof that the so call Christian god exist anymore then the tooth fairy exist so there is no reason to assume that such a god exist any more then the tooth fairy exist.

There is indeed zero proof that the so-called Christian god exists...so there is no reason to assert that the god exists. I agree with that much.

Quote:

An there is no reason to give an adult any more respect for claiming a god exist as there is to adults that are claiming that the tooth fairy is real.

I agree that there is no reason to give an assertion made by an adult that a god exists than there is to give an assertion made by an adult that no gods exist.

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Atheists... Your life is pointless

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