Where should we help?

@Glennn,

First of all the Hamas attack occurred in October 6

This is from you Glennn
"We can discuss the Nov. 7 attack in another thre

Anyway, what I hear you saying is that because of the Nov. 7 attack, Israel has the right to commit war crimes (including starvation) against the innocent population of Gaza (collective punishment), and that President Joe Biden is right to continue sending weapons of destruction to the perpetrators, ignoring all international humanitarian organizations' call for an end to the war crimes. Is that what you think?
I only ask because you won't say how you feel about a sitting president sending weapons to war criminals.

I disagree with everything that was written, it's simply your notion to FORCE another person to give you a 'yes Glennn youre brilliant' or 'No Glennn, you are absolutely wrong.

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@glitterbag,

glitterbag wrote:

And you truly believe that will solve the problem? Will that make Hamas feel guilty and they will stop raiding musicals with para gliders and armed rapists and kidnappers. I'm not in charge of Israel but I bet they would be thrilled if Hamas stopped shooting Jews. If you think that will work send a note to your Senator, Senators love getting help from their citizens (PS don't put a stamp on upside down if it's the American one)

Funny you should mention that. When first class postage came with Franklin Roosevelt my whole family put him on upside down. I no longer remember why.

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@glitterbag,

Yes, I posted the wrong date. Forgive me. I post elsewhere and by golly I mixed up some numbers.

I'm not forcing you to agree with me. I'm asking you whether or not you approve of President Joe Biden sending the Israelis more bombs and munitions so that they can continue on with their war crimes against Gazans.

I've only seen one other person here who has refused to answer that question, deciding instead to complain that I'm forcing an answer out of them. But no, I'm just asking you whether or not you agree with Joe Biden's aiding and abetting people who are--according to international humanitarian organizations--starving and killing innocent Gazans.

My solution to the war crimes being committed in Gaza by the Israelis is to withhold the tools of destruction from the war criminals.

You don't like that idea? You do like that idea? No one knows but you, and you're not talking. I can't force an answer out of you. However, I'm curious as to why you are so reluctant--in a thread about what to do to stop the atrocities in Gaza--to say anything about what to do to stop the atrocities in Gaza. Did you think you wouldn't be asked your position on what to do about it . . . in a thread about what to do about it? Smile

1 Reply

@Glennn,

Quote:

I'm not forcing you to agree with me.

No, you're wheedling people to agree with you.

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I'm asking you whether or not you approve of President Joe Biden sending the Israelis more bombs and munitions so that they can continue on with their war crimes against Gazans.

Why is it so important for you to know if other people agree with you? Are you running for some official position or something?

Quote:

My solution to the war crimes being committed in Gaza by the Israelis is to withhold the tools of destruction from the war criminals.

How are you going to implement that? My solution is for the leaders of Hamas and Israel to take an excursion to Dubai and spend time in a hot tub together.

It's about as likely as you withholding weapons from the IDF.

1 Reply

@hightor,

Quote:

No, you're wheedling people to agree with you.

*sighs* The thread title concerns how to stop the atrocities being committed against the Gazans by the Israelis. The Israelis are using U.S. weapons to commit the atrocities. So, in answer to the OP, I recommend keeping the bombs and munitions from the war criminals.

You seem to think that that solution is bad. However, you won't say why. Why not?

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Why is it so important for you to know if other people agree with you?

You're not paying attention, hightor. In a discussion of what to do about the atrocities that Israelis are committing against the population of Gaza, I said that Joe Biden has to stop enabling the war criminals with his continued material support for the ones committing the war crimes.

If you disagree with that? If so, explain why?

So, do you disagree?

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How are you going to implement that?

I can't. But Joe Biden can. He won't! Isn't aiding an abetting a war criminal pretty criminal?

1 Reply

@Glennn,

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I recommend keeping the bombs and munitions from the war criminals.

How are you going to do that? Israel can manufacture its own munitions and reportedly even has nukes.

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You seem to think that that solution is bad.

How would I know? It hasn't been done – kind of hard to assess its effectiveness until it's tried out on the ground in real time.

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I said that Joe Biden has to stop enabling the war criminals with his continued material support for the ones committing the war crimes.

Yeah, you've said that many times before. OP hasn't returned so it's possible he read your "solution" and figured the thread was closed. So I suggest you share your advice with your congressional representative or maybe talk to Biden himself.

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But Joe Biden can. He won't!

You don't know that. It's possible that he's just waiting for your input, so give it a try.

1 Reply

@hightor,

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How are you going to do that? Israel can manufacture its own munitions and reportedly even has nukes.

Yeah, I hear ya. You just said that as long as Israel could manufacture the bombs and munitions necessary to carry out their war crimes against Gazans, the U.S. might just as well manufacture them and donate them to Israel's war crimes-cause. You're basically saying that since Israel would commit these war crimes with or without our help, there's no reason for us to not help. I don't agree.

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How would I know? It hasn't been done – kind of hard to assess its effectiveness until it's tried out on the ground in real time.

And what's your best guess as to why Joe Biden won't pull his material support for Israel's ongoing war crimes against Gazans?

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So I suggest you share your advice with your congressional representative or maybe talk to Biden himself.

You're not even curious as to why Biden would support a war criminal? That's curious. Biden's loyalty to Netanyahu is dysfunctional . . . IF Netanyahu is committing war crimes, which he is.

Yeah, the OP got his question answered.

1 Reply

@Glennn,

I think hightor is correct, you wheedle, plead, accuse, shame, embarrass, whine, then whine about everybody else's reluctance to deal with you. You are not having a discussion, you are having a 'demand you answer to me' contest. If someone doesn't give you a definite yea or an unyielding no you complain either they are too stupid to understand the problem or afraid to commit to an answer. That is so weak willed but intentional that your insides must be eating you alive.

I wish global problems were sooooooo easy to fix, but they are not. If you're feeling a little bored tonight, order "Munich" on demand. You would get to see fine people on both sides (borrowed from the Genius former president, Donald 'the massive fabricator' Trump.

1 Reply

@glitterbag,

I believe the discussion is over. The question was how to stop Israel from committing atrocities in Gaza. I recommended that the U.S. stop putting the bombs and munitions necessary to the continuation of those atrocities into the hands of the war criminals committing them. In response, hightor intimated that that would be futile since Israel can manufacture their own munitions. So I pointed out to him that he is implying that, since Israel would commit these war crimes with or without our help, there's no reason for us to not lend them a helping hand.

So far, he hasn't returned to explain that seemingly backward reasoning. So it seems that the prevailing wisdom so far is that the U.S. needs to stop shipping bombs and munitions to war criminals involved in atrocities.

1 Reply

@Glennn,

Quote:

So I pointed out to him that he is implying that, since Israel would commit these war crimes with or without our help, there's no reason for us to not lend them a helping hand.

No, I'm implying that without the US supplying them with heavy conventional weapons they might decide to use nukes on Hezbollah in Lebanon and on what's left of Hamas in what's left of Gaza. Be careful what you wish for.

1 Reply

@hightor,

Quote:

No, I'm implying that without the US supplying them with heavy conventional weapons they might decide to use nukes

Okay, so in your mind, Biden is supplying Israelis with the weapons they need to commit atrocities against the Gazans in order to keep them from possibly using nukes against them? Correct me if I'm wrong, but that's just a "let 'em murder 'em slow to keep 'em from murderin' them fast" idea. Appeasing a monster just to slow it up is not how you deal with a monster!

How about the U.S. cut off their weapons of destruction and all that free money unless they stop committing atrocities against the innocent Gazan population? Or how about send some inspectors in to make sure they don't use their nukes?

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@Glennn,

Quote:

Okay, so in your mind, Biden is supplying Israelis with the weapons they need to commit atrocities against the Gazans in order to keep them from possibly using nukes against them?

No. That's in your mind. It certainly isn't the stated policy of this administration. I simply raised it as a possibility. Typical of you to attempt to make it seem as if I were conveying a certainty. You've condemned Netanyahu as some crazed Old Testament-inspired monster so I'm surprised you haven't thought through your "solution" to consider what might be attempted in desperation if pusher Uncle Sam cuts off his arms supply.

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Or how about send some inspectors in to make sure they don't use their nukes?

What if he doesn't let them in? Think it through – you have this habit of arriving at some idea, which you anoint as the "solution", and repeating it incessantly, without any consideration of what may follow. Your "solution" is nothing more than "thoughts and prayers".

1 Reply

@hightor,

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You've condemned Netanyahu as some crazed Old Testament-inspired monster . . .

Well let's see:

_____________________________________________________________________________________________

“'I will punish the Amalekites for what they did to Israel when they waylaid them as they came up from Egypt. Now go, attack the Amalekites and totally destroy all that belongs to them. Do not spare them; put to death men and women, children and infants, cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys. '”
_______________________________________________________________________________________________

Oh yeah, he's an Old Testament religious nutter alright! He sees Amalekites where there are only people who are being illegally occupied and now murdered by his forces.

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I'm surprised you haven't thought through your "solution" to consider what might be attempted in desperation if pusher Uncle Sam cuts off his arms supply.

I'm surprised you're suggesting that Israel will have its delusional way with the alleged Amalekites because the U.S. is afraid of what they will do when the "gifts" stop flowing. That how it works?

So, he's starving and killing innocent human beings, but if we stop him, no telling what he will do, so let's just keep begging him to cut it out, but keep sending him the weapons he needs to do the things we wish he'd stop doing.

Are we so afraid of our "ally" that we have to stand by and watch them commit atrocities against innocent people because we're more afraid of what they might do if we force them to stop? No. That is ridiculous.

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What if he doesn't let them in?

Here you're implying that Israel is above the world and international law, and that when they say NO, we have to respect their belligerence. We put inspectors in Iran's nuclear facilities. You think Israel is special or something; you know, above and beyond the law. I wouldn't blame you for thinking that. After all, they get away with illegal occupation, illegal settlements, undemocratic imprisonment and abuse of kids in their jails, etc. One could easily get the idea that they're special. But in the light of day today, we can see that they're special, but for all the wrong reasons.

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Your "solution" is nothing more than "thoughts and prayers".

Hmm. You're the one who just said that we can't do anything about Israel's war crimes because of what they might do in retaliation; that we'd better not even withhold the bombs and munitions they're using to murder innocent people caught between a rock and an Old Testament religious-nutter. So, the only thing left to do after your suggestion to do nothing is the "thoughts and prayers" thing.

That's what your suggestion to let 'em be amounts to!

1 Reply

@Glennn,

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I'm surprised you're suggesting that Israel will have its delusional way with the alleged Amalekites because the U.S. is afraid of what they will do when the "gifts" stop flowing.

I'm not "suggesting" that; I raised it as a possibility which you hadn't considered. Do you really think hostilities will end as soon as the US cuts off it's military aid?

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Here you're implying that Israel is above the world and international law, and that when they say NO, we have to respect their belligerence.

Again, that's your thinking, not mine. I don't see the USA, under Biden or under Trump, forcing Israel to accept monitors, nor do I foresee Israel complying with any demands as long as Netanyahu is in power.

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You're the one who just said that we can't do anything about Israel's war crimes because of what they might do in retaliation; that we'd better not even withhold the bombs and munitions they're using to murder innocent people caught between a rock and an Old Testament religious-nutter.

No, that's just your deliberate misinterpretation of the problem I posed. You're not interested in a discussion, only in promoting your current idee fixe. (I guess you're tired of PCR testing.) I've wasted enough time with you today.

1 Reply

@hightor,

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Do you really think hostilities will end as soon as the US cuts off it's military aid?

If it doesn't, then the U.S. should get in line with the rest of the world by having the will to condemn Israel's atrocities for what they are instead of using their veto power at the U.N. to PROHIBIT any intervention in atrocities. That would be followed by the application of appropriate sanctions.

Isn't that the usual protocol when it comes to dealing with belligerent war criminals who just won't say no when it comes to committing war crimes against innocent humans?

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I don't see the USA, under Biden or under Trump, forcing Israel to accept monitors

Ah, the crux of the problem! Why the special treatment of proven war criminals? It's not reasonable . . .

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No, that's just your deliberate misinterpretation of the problem I posed.

The problem you posed was that Israel would thumb their nose at world opinion and continue on with their war crimes. My solution was that they need to be stopped right now; it was not thoughts and prayers. I stated that quite clearly.

In what world is the de-funding and sanctioning of war criminals no more than a thought and a prayer? Conversely, in what world is doing nothing except aiding and abetting the war criminals an accepted solution to the problem of war crimes and war criminals?
_________________________________________________________________________________________________

Oh, and for anyone wondering what hightor has decided to draw attention to:

https://able2know.org/topic/557001-1

Though I have no idea why. Wink

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