2
   

Academic Freedom....according to Liberals

 
 
rayban1
 
Reply Mon 15 Aug, 2005 07:57 am
Hmmm......the statement below sounds familiar doesn't it? Free speech according to the Liberals on this forum? Liberalism is under assault and at long last liberal control of academia is being contested.

Quote:
In some of these classrooms, conservative students are intimidated into silence, ignored or occasionally ridiculed. Accordingly, although belatedly, the June 23 "Statement of Academic Rights and Responsibilities," led by the American Council on Education, may finally awaken college trustees and alumni to the degree of indoctrination instead of free inquiry that characterizes much of higher education, particularly in the more elite institutions.


Selective diversity in higher education

By Nat Hentoff
August 15, 2005



Selective definitions of "diversity" can exclude some of its vital meanings. On college campuses, for obvious example, the goal of "diversity" has most urgently been focused on racial diversity. But at last, leaders of the higher-education establishment -- headed by the American Council on Education -- have finally recognized the fundamental basis for all education is diversity of ideas.
The present domination by liberal opinion on many college faculties (often verging on this majority's intolerant orthodoxies) was revealed in a recent study, "Politics and Professional Advancement among Faculty," by Stanley Rothman, emeritus professor of government at Smith College; S. Robert Lichter, a professor of communications at George Mason University; and Neil Nevitte, a political science professor at the University of Toronto.
As summarized in the June 24-26 New York Sun, the result of this study, confirmed in previous reports in the widely respected, nonpartisan weekly, the Chronicle of Higher Education, reveals that campus liberal professors "outnumber conservatives 5-to-1. It also concludes that conservatives get worse jobs than liberals."
In some of these classrooms, conservative students are intimidated into silence, ignored or occasionally ridiculed. Accordingly, although belatedly, the June 23 "Statement of Academic Rights and Responsibilities," led by the American Council on Education, may finally awaken college trustees and alumni to the degree of indoctrination instead of free inquiry that characterizes much of higher education, particularly in the more elite institutions.
As Supreme Court Justice Louis Brandeis advised, "Sunlight is the best disinfectant," and this study, among other similar surveys, may stir parents to look more closely at how free the exchange of ideas actually is among faculty members, and thereby among students, at various colleges.
The release of this statement on behalf of true academic freedom is clearly a recognition, though not explicitly admitted, in the statement of the decline of intellectual diversity in higher education.Otherwise,it wouldn't be necessary for the statement to emphasize that: "Colleges and universities should welcome intellectual pluralism and the free exchange of ideas. Such a commitment will inevitably encourage debate over complex and difficult issues about which individuals will disagree. Such discussions should be held in an environment characterized by openness, tolerance and civility." If "openness, tolerance and civility" were not in short supply on too many campuses, that admonition would not have been required. Nor would this remarkable reminder from American Council on Education to faculty, provosts and presidents of colleges: "Academic decisions, including grades, should be based solely on considerations that are intellectually relevant to the subject matter under consideration. Neither students nor faculty should be disadvantaged or evaluated on the basis of their political opinions. Any member of the campus community who believes he or she has been treated unfairly on academic matters must have access to a clear institutional process by which his or her grievance can be addressed."
It's about time. Included in the impressive list of signers to this manifesto for freedom of thought in the nation's citadels of advanced learning (largely ignored by newspapers and television) are, in addition to the American Council of Education, the American Association of University Professors, the Association of American Law Schools, the Association for Governing Boards of Universities and Colleges, the Council for Higher Education Accreditation and the Council of Independent Colleges.
So, what can and should be done to open the minds of faculties and students? I would think the clear answer is that college and university presidents and boards of trustees have to look deeply into how welcome their own campuses are to "intellectual pluralism and the free exchange of ideas." The statement by the higher-education establishments is just words without accountability. Also, by doing more investigative reporting on freedom of thought on campuses, the media can also be of significant help to future students, faculty and the nation as a whole. We are engaged not only in a war against terrorism, but also in a war of ideas between those committed to freedom and advocates of its lethal opposite.
The prevalence of "political correctness" at many colleges and universities is far from over, but at least a beginning has been made to make freedom of thought part of the curriculum.
  • Topic Stats
  • Top Replies
  • Link to this Topic
Type: Discussion • Score: 2 • Views: 5,136 • Replies: 82
No top replies

 
rayban1
 
  1  
Reply Mon 15 Aug, 2005 09:28 am
What.........no one here who dares defend the last fortress of Liberal domination.

Good.....perhaps it will crumble like the Liberal news media which is well on the way to self destruction with a helping hand from the blogosphere and a shove by the "fed-up" American public.
0 Replies
 
gustavratzenhofer
 
  1  
Reply Mon 15 Aug, 2005 09:29 am
Go sit in the corner, rayban.
0 Replies
 
Sturgis
 
  1  
Reply Mon 15 Aug, 2005 09:34 am
Hentoff>>>>The Village Voice. What more can be said? Liberal garbage as always. One sided half facts.
0 Replies
 
candidone1
 
  1  
Reply Mon 15 Aug, 2005 09:59 am
Sturgis wrote:
Hentoff>>>>The Village Voice. What more can be said? Liberal garbage as always. One sided half facts.


Didn't read the article huh Sturgis?
Missed the point by a mile.
0 Replies
 
rayban1
 
  1  
Reply Mon 15 Aug, 2005 10:02 am
Sturgis wrote:
Hentoff>>>>The Village Voice. What more can be said? Liberal garbage as always. One sided half facts.


Huh?????
0 Replies
 
squinney
 
  1  
Reply Mon 15 Aug, 2005 10:06 am
Stop whining about being a "silenced" minority.

If these conservative students really want to show what they stand for, have them sign up for military service.
0 Replies
 
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Reply Mon 15 Aug, 2005 10:19 am
Sheesh, didn't Fox's failed thread on this subject argue this to death?

This is my favorite line:

Quote:
In some of these classrooms, conservative students are intimidated into silence, ignored or occasionally ridiculed.


Sounds about right, given the trash some Conservatives spout.

Cycloptichorn
0 Replies
 
rayban1
 
  1  
Reply Mon 15 Aug, 2005 10:38 am
squinney wrote:
Stop whining about being a "silenced" minority.

If these conservative students really want to show what they stand for, have them sign up for military service.


Naw......that would be a cop out. That would allow all you Libs to:

1. Continue your lie about being anti-war......BUT...... Laughing WE SUPPORT OUR TROOPS.

2. Continue your lie about: We must be tolerant of all things. EXCEPT....self defense, defeating Islamic fascism where ever it exists, the right of the majority of Americans to be free from the constant threat of the ACLU to re-write history and to destroy any aspect of American culture which even hints of religion, and the right of the Majority of Americans to insist upon making the desire to become an American as one of the prerequisites to gaining citizenship and the pledge to learn our language as the primary language.

3. Continue the Liberal penchant for apologizing to the world for being American and blaming this country for everything that is wrong with the world.

Just think how much fun you Libs would have in our college classrooms where you could extoll the virtues of every form of gov't except ours.
If you were unopposed you could continue you virulent attack on Capitalism with all it's ugly warts, and distribute all sorts of publications praising socialism as the only form of gov't that will prevent our self destruction.

What an irresponsible "blast" you could have.........
0 Replies
 
Thomas
 
  1  
Reply Mon 15 Aug, 2005 10:40 am
Rayban -- how do your sources on academic freedom explain that liberals also dominate in the hard sciences and engineering, where ideological affiliations don't get you anywhere, where professors have no means of determining the students' political ideology, and even if they had them they would have no incentive to discriminate on its basis? The reason I ask is because on the face of it, this makes it look to me as if the preponderance of liberals has other reasons than academic repression. So what do your sources have to say on this?
0 Replies
 
rayban1
 
  1  
Reply Mon 15 Aug, 2005 10:56 am
Thomas wrote:
Rayban -- how do your sources on academic freedom explain that liberals also dominate in the hard sciences and engineering, where ideological affiliations don't get you anywhere, where professors have no means of determining the students' political ideology, and even if they had them they would have no incentive to discriminate on its basis? The reason I ask is because on the face of it, this makes it look to me as if the preponderance of liberals has other reasons than academic repression. So what do your sources have to say on this?


I make it a firm rule to NEVER reply to Paul Krugman.......I have my self respect to consider. :wink:
0 Replies
 
ehBeth
 
  1  
Reply Mon 15 Aug, 2005 11:00 am
So you can't answer Thomas' question?

~~~~~~~~

achhhhhhhh, we've had this silly discussion before, and it led nowhere. Good luck to you all.
0 Replies
 
Thomas
 
  1  
Reply Mon 15 Aug, 2005 11:01 am
That's a pitty, rayban, because people might get the wrong impression that you are protecting a conspiracy theory against data contradicting them. Wink
0 Replies
 
rayban1
 
  1  
Reply Mon 15 Aug, 2005 11:02 am
That cute little avator is very deceptive ehBeth
0 Replies
 
Bi-Polar Bear
 
  1  
Reply Mon 15 Aug, 2005 11:03 am
why not go pull the wings off some flies rayban? that you have the strength for.
0 Replies
 
rayban1
 
  1  
Reply Mon 15 Aug, 2005 11:10 am
Thomas wrote:
That's a pitty, rayban, because people might get the wrong impression that you are protecting a conspiracy theory against data contradicting them. Wink


You are making a faulty assumption similar to Setanta in his wrong war thread.......you are assuming that I believe " facts" would change the mind of a liberal........we know better don't we Thomas.\?
0 Replies
 
candidone1
 
  1  
Reply Mon 15 Aug, 2005 11:15 am
rayban1 wrote:

squinney wrote:
Stop whining about being a "silenced" minority.

If these conservative students really want to show what they stand for, have them sign up for military service.


Naw......that would be a cop out. That would allow all you Libs to:

1. Continue your lie about being anti-war......BUT...... Laughing WE SUPPORT OUR TROOPS.


How does this follow Ray?
Squnney asks that conservatives stand up for what they believe and enlist and you respond that this would be a cop out which allows the left to continue lying about their anti-war position?
The anti-war bit is not a lie, and you continue to make supporting the troops and not supporting the war incompatible propositions.
It's Voltairian in nature, and not contradictory. Surely that can be seen in the filth through which you peer.

rayban1 wrote:
2. Continue your lie about: We must be tolerant of all things. EXCEPT....self defense,


The left tolerates self defense. The left does not tolerate lies by the administration which overstate the need for such things as thePatriot Act.

rayban1 wrote:
defeating Islamic fascism where ever it exists,


If you mean plucking every Arab out of middle America and locking them up indefinately, then no, the left doesn't support defeating Islamic fascism.
The left would have preferred defeating Islamic fascism at a grassroots level....say...in Afghanistan 2 years ago. Not Iraq.

rayban1 wrote:
the right of the majority of Americans to be free from the constant threat of the ACLU to re-write history and to destroy any aspect of American culture which even hints of religion, and the right of the Majority of Americans to insist upon making the desire to become an American as one of the prerequisites to gaining citizenship and the pledge to learn our language as the primary language.


Can you demonstrate how the ACLU is, has or has attempted to re-write history? Or is this just the manifestation of your penchant for slobbering over the evil ACLU.

rayban1 wrote:
3. Continue the Liberal penchant for apologizing to the world for being American and blaming this country for everything that is wrong with the world.


Sometime apologies are appropriate. Not everyone prefers the middle finger high salute.

rayban1 wrote:
Just think how much fun you Libs would have in our college classrooms where you could extoll the virtues of every form of gov't except ours.


This vitriol is becoming excessive and completely baseless.

rayban1 wrote:
If you were unopposed you could continue you virulent attack on Capitalism with all it's ugly warts, and distribute all sorts of publications praising socialism as the only form of gov't that will prevent our self destruction.

What an irresponsible "blast" you could have.........


Woah...how's the blood pressure old timer?
0 Replies
 
Thomas
 
  1  
Reply Mon 15 Aug, 2005 11:19 am
rayban1 wrote:
you are assuming that I believe " facts" would change the mind of a liberal........we know better don't we Thomas.\?

For one thing, no, I don't know "better", as you appear to define it. I am a liberal, albeit one of a very old-fashioned kind, and I have been known to change my mind in response to facts. For another thing, what I actually assumed was that you as a rational, fact-driven conservative would be eager to use data for backing up your hypothesis. Set an example for us about how it's done. As it now seems, that's the part I was wrong about.
0 Replies
 
rayban1
 
  1  
Reply Mon 15 Aug, 2005 12:17 pm
Thomas wrote:
rayban1 wrote:
you are assuming that I believe " facts" would change the mind of a liberal........we know better don't we Thomas.\?

For one thing, no, I don't know "better", as you appear to define it. I am a liberal, albeit one of a very old-fashioned kind, and I have been known to change my mind in response to facts. For another thing, what I actually assumed was that you as a rational, fact-driven conservative would be eager to use data for backing up your hypothesis. Set an example for us about how it's done. As it now seems, that's the part I was wrong about.


Actually Thomas, I must admit that I was laboring under two faulty assumptions when I posted the article:

1. That the article was well enough written that any liberal reader would recognize it as the truth and attempt to defend the reality of liberal repression.

2. That any liberal reader would possess the powers of comprehension adequate to understand the implications posed by liberalism's hypocrisy of demanding academic freedom while operating in exactly the opposite manner in our classrooms.

Obviously I was wrong on both counts......sorry to have wasted both your time and mine.

BTW......what I really objected to was your attempt to use a diversionary tactic to put me on the defensive immediately. You immediately destroyed any trust that you could be relied upon to conduct an honest discussion. Thus the reason for my curt response initially.
0 Replies
 
Thomas
 
  1  
Reply Mon 15 Aug, 2005 12:42 pm
rayban1 wrote:
1. That the article was well enough written that any liberal reader would recognize it as the truth and attempt to defend the reality of liberal repression.

A faulty assumption indeed. The article quotes a lot of people saying that liberal repression is a reality, but cites no data that would show that it actually is a reality. The only data it cites is the liberal-to conservative ratio, which, by itself, is no evidence of repression. (The ratio is reversed in the military. I would be surprised if you concluded from this that the army represses liberals. And since what's sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander ...) I think your article was not well written at all!

rayban1 wrote:
2. That any liberal reader would possess the powers of comprehension adequate to understand the implications posed by liberalism's hypocrisy of demanding academic freedom while operating in exactly the opposite manner in our classrooms.

Have you considered the possibility that liberal readers possess the power to comprehend that the article does not show what it claims to show -- and you do not? That maybe there is no liberal hypocrisy to consider the implications of? If you did consider it, on what basis did you reject this possibility?

rayban1 wrote:
BTW......what I really objected to was your attempt to use a diversionary tactic to put me on the defensive immediately. You immediately destroyed any trust that you could be relied upon to conduct an honest discussion. Thus the reason for my curt response initially.

If you are interested in an honest, factual discussion, why would you consider it "a diversionary tactic" for a correspondent to ask you a backup question about your data? And why would it put you on the defensive?
0 Replies
 
 

Related Topics

Obama '08? - Discussion by sozobe
Let's get rid of the Electoral College - Discussion by Robert Gentel
McCain's VP: - Discussion by Cycloptichorn
Food Stamp Turkeys - Discussion by H2O MAN
The 2008 Democrat Convention - Discussion by Lash
McCain is blowing his election chances. - Discussion by McGentrix
Snowdon is a dummy - Discussion by cicerone imposter
GAFFNEY: Whose side is Obama on? - Discussion by gungasnake
 
  1. Forums
  2. » Academic Freedom....according to Liberals
Copyright © 2022 MadLab, LLC :: Terms of Service :: Privacy Policy :: Page generated in 0.03 seconds on 09/30/2022 at 12:14:18