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Why Birth Certificates Don't Work

 
 
Reply Thu 17 Mar, 2022 01:43 pm
So, I've been reading webcomics and such, which is always a good idea.

In one of these, a girl arrives from roughly 1200 years ago brandishing a sword (I think it's called My Wife is from 1000 Years Ago). They bring up the difficulty of securing her ID, since she was never born here. I am also helping a friend out with a story wherein a catgirl arrives from another dimension.

So it got me to thinking, what if you were born in a hut or something, in a small town, and your parents didn't bother to register you at least with a Certificate of Live Birth (what Obama was able to get) much less a bona fide Birth Certificate? It turns out, quite a bit.

https://www.pewtrusts.org/en/research-and-analysis/blogs/stateline/2017/05/15/without-id-homeless-trapped-in-vicious-cycle

Without a means to prove you are who you say you are, fun fact: you can't even enter a government building (this includes the very building you have to enter in order to secure an ID). You can't get medical assistance, and you need some record of identity in order to find a house and a house in order to get a job to pay for a house (talk about Catch 22). You can, after a great deal of red tape, prove that you are who you say you are, send in for your Birth Certificate, and have a driver's license or ID after an uncomfortable amount of waiting. Meanwhile, you're slept on the street for several months, and any health issues weren't addressed all that time. But all off this assumes that you had a birth certificate in the first place! I have checked several websites (as much to figure out for my friend's novel)

The Left wants us to do away with IDs, or screw with the system so it doesn't work. Why? Well, they have a vested interest in importing illegal aliens, screwing with the vote, and creating a sort of welfare state. There's also the problem of identity theft not only creating massive poverty, as one party claims to be another (and the defrauded has to verify their ID), but undermining how society works in general.

So these are real problems:
• We need to de-legitimize the practice of asking for addresses for housing and jobs. It is not the business of the boss that you're homeless. In fact, if the homeless person desperately needs to secure enough money to buy housing, they are stuck in a situation where neither one is really easy to care out. What the boss needs to know is, "Can you show up regularly? If you are sick, can you call in sick? Are you reliable, trustworthy, and able to do the job given to you?" What the landlord needs to know is, "If this person smashes up my apartment, will I be able to find them to seek legal action?"
• We need a system where ID is disconnected from stupid things like hair, eyes, height, or weight (I can lose or gain several pounds, I might lose height due to osteoporosis or just getting older or gain some height but wearing boots, and hair dye is a thing), and especially address. But we do need to enforce a clear system of identification.
• We need to combat homelessness and identity theft, even for those who have lost paper identification.
• We need especially to have a system that is simple, effective, and allows for changes (I changed my name and gender in about 2007 or so), yet protects the innocent and punishes the guilty.
• We need need to use the idea of a dimensional immigrant as an example. If a person never had any ID, the person should nonetheless be able to be entered into the system, and checked against their record if they are some sort of scoundrel trying to hide who they are. Moreover, if they are an honest citizen, there needs to be a quick way of documenting them, so that yes a homeless person or anyone else can enter even a government building and not be harassed.

So, how to go about it?
1 .Well, there's chipping or barcoding people. No, no, and again no. Religious types cry out "Mark of the Beast" and I can't say I blame them. There is something dehumanizing about turning humans into a set of numbers. Worse, while it seems very technical, all one would really have to do is steal the device, and put some random number on. The number also becomes increasingly long as more people get born.
2. Some sort of wrist bracelet? It's equated too closely to wearing chains. Also? Like a birth certificate, you're liable to have it come off.

3. Which led me to a multi-point ID, using facial recognition, fingerprints, and a genetics test from saliva. All of these things you are born with, but if something happens to one (arm gets chopped off), you are able to verify the others through a combination. Better yet, unlike these unnatural identifiers, like barcodes and the like, these use real human markers, and most of these are unique. In fact, fingerprints are so unique that even twins do not share them. You go to an apartment, give them your fingerprints, no criminal record? They don't have a problem with it. And if you do smash up their house, they give those to the police, you pay for damages. You go to a place that needs ID? You don't need to carry a thing with you, just scan your prints. Your fingerprints are bad due to working in pineapple factory or got your hand mangled? Easy, they just compare your face to previous pictures.

Seriously, why are we still subjecting homeless and the poor to this? Yes, there are sketchy people out there. But losing your ID shouldn't be such a major issue. One visit, show a natural (not paper) form of ID, and get your ID delivered or pick it up next time. Not multiple filing trips, check those against existing ones or set one up if you have a new one. Transgender? An immigrant? Alot easier to process, and in the latter, easier to deport. But more importantly, it protects the people at the very bottom of society.
 
View best answer, chosen by bulmabriefs144
Mame
 
  2  
Reply Thu 17 Mar, 2022 02:44 pm
@bulmabriefs144,
bulmabriefs144 wrote:


Without a means to prove you are who you say you are, fun fact: you can't even enter a government building (this includes the very building you have to enter in order to secure an ID).


Where do you live - Mars? Of course you can enter a government building without ID. I can go in any of our buildings without being asked for ID. I can watch a trial, take out a book, ask about permitting regulations, complain about my garbage pick up, etc.

bulmabriefs144 wrote:

The Left wants us to do away with IDs, or screw with the system so it doesn't work. Why? Well, they have a vested interest in importing illegal aliens, screwing with the vote, and creating a sort of welfare state. There's also the problem of identity theft not only creating massive poverty, as one party claims to be another (and the defrauded has to verify their ID), but undermining how society works in general.


That is just off-the-wall crazy. Who, exactly, wants to do away with IDs and where did you read that? And the rest of it is just as hogwash.

The more you write, the more I think you're wearing a tinfoil helmet and radiation vest.
bobsal u1553115
 
  3  
Reply Thu 17 Mar, 2022 04:07 pm
@bulmabriefs144,
Birth certificates work very well. What in your life has ever happened to prove to you that BCs don't work????

An extra 10 points off, if you cite Barack Obama.
0 Replies
 
engineer
 
  3  
Reply Thu 17 Mar, 2022 05:51 pm
@bulmabriefs144,
bulmabriefs144 wrote:

So it got me to thinking, what if you were born in a hut or something, in a small town, and your parents didn't bother to register you at least with a Certificate of Live Birth (what Obama was able to get) much less a bona fide Birth Certificate?

Just so you know, the term "birth certificate" is short hand for "certificate of live birth" or "certificate of birth". It varies slightly from state to state.
vikorr
 
  5  
Reply Fri 18 Mar, 2022 03:13 am
@bulmabriefs144,
Ummm...its interesting that you want ID systems that:

- doesn't relate to height, build, hair, eyes etc

...but want it to relate to:

- DNA, Facial ID etc

Essentially, you want a system that would be capable of taking & analysing DNA without consent, and has the ability to follow persons wherever they go (and record each location they go)....

...yeah, that sort of power leads to much better systems of government...
izzythepush
 
  1  
Reply Fri 18 Mar, 2022 04:26 am
@vikorr,
The problem you have is that you're an Australian and flat Earthers like the OP don't believe Australia exists.

They problem class your posts as delusionzlnightmares from a damaged brain.
glitterbag
 
  3  
Reply Fri 18 Mar, 2022 08:54 pm
@izzythepush,
I tend to think Bulma has a fevered set of evil purpose malaprops floating thru his imagination. It's very sad.
0 Replies
 
Poodlenoodle
 
  -2  
Reply Sun 5 Jun, 2022 03:57 pm
@Mame,
Pretend you are Mexican. In some states (like California) you can get all this free stuff, even a drivers license! with no ID or any birth certificate.
0 Replies
 
Poodlenoodle
 
  -1  
Reply Sun 5 Jun, 2022 04:05 pm
@bulmabriefs144,
In all seriousness, the "REAL ID" that is being pushed and implemented in all states (PA is still dragging its feet), you cannot fly on an airplane (but maybe in a small airport you can, but not an international airport) and can't go into a federal building, yes this will include the FEDERAL social security building, which another poster thought was 'crazy', yes this is happening on our planet earth. I had to do something with a birth certificate a few years ago and they have an armed guard there at the SS office that checks your drivers license when you make an appointment.

Someone we know who is living in a trailer with some other people (he does odd jobs for them so they let him stay), he has no drivers license and his social security card has "faded numbers", they won't issue him a new card, either. So, he tried to get the stimulus check (from a few years ago) and finally was able (after talking to his congressman- his friends drove him since he has no DL) to get the check. BUT, he can't cash it! I told my hubs to ask him if he tried the check cashing places, they take advantage of poor people BIG TIME, but it's better than losing all the money. But he can't get a bank account without "ID".
Definitely this is all pointing to the mark of the beast. Amazon already has "palm pay". Better brush up on your King James Bible.
0 Replies
 
Poodlenoodle
  Selected Answer
 
  0  
Reply Sun 5 Jun, 2022 04:09 pm
@Mame,
Check out the "REAL ID" website, it's all there. You aren't allowed to fly on an airplane and can't enter Federal buildings. SS is a federal program. They have armed guards there that "check you in". You have to now make an appointment using a 'smart' phone, you can't just walk in like they used to let you.
In Canada it's even worse. You can't fly, leave the country (or get back in) or even get on a TRAIN without having proof of vaccination.
No "tin foil hats" needed. This is common knowledge.
Mame
 
  2  
Reply Mon 6 Jun, 2022 03:03 pm
@Poodlenoodle,
Poodlenoodle wrote:

Check out the "REAL ID" website, it's all there. You aren't allowed to fly on an airplane and can't enter Federal buildings. SS is a federal program. They have armed guards there that "check you in". You have to now make an appointment using a 'smart' phone, you can't just walk in like they used to let you.
In Canada it's even worse. You can't fly, leave the country (or get back in) or even get on a TRAIN without having proof of vaccination.
No "tin foil hats" needed. This is common knowledge.


Re: Canada - It's also temporary and because of Covid, of course. There's talk of when that requirement will be ending.

As I said, I can freely walk into any federal, provincial or municipal building, so it must just be the USA and I bet I know why - all your mass shootings. I've decided to not travel to the US anymore for that reason, so I can imagine how much safer the employees and visitors must feel having to show ID and maybe being patted down. It's for safety reasons.

Before my dad protested something in the early 60s by throwing a milk container full of beef blood onto the floor of the House of Parliament, there were no ID checks. After that, they ID you and search your body and belongings. Maybe even pat you down, I don't know. It only takes once. He was nicknamed "The Blood Bomber".
0 Replies
 
bulmabriefs144
 
  -1  
Reply Tue 7 Jun, 2022 08:07 am
@engineer,
They are not the same.

https://instantvitalrecords.com/certificate-live-birth-vs-birth-certificate/

A certificate of live birth is a hospital record that you are born.

A birth certificate is an official record of your birth that incorporates information from your live birth certificate. It is printed on official state letterhead and is certified by the state seal and the registrar’s signature.

Why there is a thing about Obama's birth certificate is because a birth certificate is an official legal document, while the certificate of live birth is a medical document that you can actually get a blank version of online.
https://data.templateroller.com/pdf_docs_html/1728/17286/1728684/form-102-certificate-live-birth_print_big.png

They are not the same thing.
0 Replies
 
bulmabriefs144
 
  -1  
Reply Tue 7 Jun, 2022 08:42 am
@vikorr,
I want an ID that you don't need to carry around with you. As much as possible, this should not be obtained without consent, and should not be done to children. No birth certificates.

The current systems of ID will fail, and the big state will be like "See? See?!? This is why you need to all be branded with a barcode and have a chip implanted in your neck."

Nuhhh. We have a natural ID. Our spit and our fingerprints.

At adulthood, people who wish to become citizens of a country, who wish to vote and work at official jobs (under the table jobs are always available, but there is legal risk of many of these) register their fingerprints and footprints, take a photo that scans for distinguishing traits, and saliva. They are on record as being who they say they are. It doesn't matter that they were time displaced from the feudal era, a zombie, or a catgirl from another dimension. Their fingerprint identify them.

If I later want to change my name to Samantha R Hooker, I simply update these. Or claim to be another gender. Sure, whatever.

A single database for a person, with their name, fingerprints and toe prints, face, and a scan of dna. You can simply spit or give a blood or hair sample, or scan prints. No card needed. Since I don't bring my wallet with me anywhere, and don't keep track of papers and forms, it seems that God has already provided sufficient means to identify a person even if they conceal themselves. Commit a crime? You're dead to rights. And no, you don't have to consent to this. Because the birth certificate system would be gone, it wouldn't matter where you're from if you want to live in this country and have a third-rate job. But if you're arrested (and thus booked) or if you work in a job that requires fingerprints (in Arizona they made me get a fingerprint card for being a teacher) or if you want to vote, you have to be officially registered as a citizen. There is no "losing your ID" and then getting deported, because your ID can easily be retrieved from natural markers.

When I went to change my name and gender under the current system, I had to go to a legal office, then social security, then DMV. Oh yeah, and then the IRS. There was no centralized Bureau of Live Persons that I could just go to, register my new information, and have it change on all forms.

Btw, the average ID (even the so-called Real ID) expires. This is because they are based on stupid identifiers and anyone can fake such ID. You don't want dead people voting, so ID must expire every few years. The ID that I propose makes no distinction between born and naturalized citizens, no dustinction between hospital or middle of nowhere births, and is one and done. You need to be identified, they scan you in at age 15 or 99. The card version of this ID might be pretty simple, but it is checked against your database.
0 Replies
 
PoliteMight
 
  -1  
Reply Tue 7 Jun, 2022 01:30 pm
@bulmabriefs144,
If every person was to "send for" ( represent ) and immigrant or even take representation for etc homeless person this problem with birth certificates among many would be solved. Everyday at my post office I see tons of people applying to send for people from other nations, family or not. Every single day. That is what is holding homeless and immigrants back. They have nobody to vouch for them.

Otherwise people like Kai the Hitch Hiker who is both an illegal immigrant and homeless who is illegally locked up in jail who needs to be deported right now, just needs to be deported.

I am not kidding if I or you literally sent for somebody from any country we could get them in. The problem is that under us we have responsibility to ensure they do not cause problems for other people.

It is like owning a tiger. Like the Tiger-man of Harlem. Guy had a Tiger inside of his apartment. However people can be a bigger issue.

One guy had his cousin with a travel pass from ______ and he literally stole some ice cream from a store within hours of arriving. He had to pay for the ice cream and apologize for his behavior.

I see tons of homeless immigrants who had benefits card ( food stamp, public assistance, etc ) and their problem is that nobody is helping them or giving them any resources in education. They are sitting their waiting for work all day long and sometimes other immigrants like themselves take advantage of them to use for their dirty work ( gangs, people taking advantage of other people ). That being said this homeless immigrant are literally living inside of their own little world. I see dating, prostitution, people raising families, and etc. Twelve people inside of one house all with legitimate jobs paying $3000 a month rent.
0 Replies
 
 

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