Frank Apisa wrote:Derevon wrote:So when exactly does a fetus become a child in your opinion?
A fetus becomes a child when it is born.
Quote:A certain week? When it has reached a certain state? Who is to decide when a fetus becomes a child?
A fetus is a fetus....a child is a child. A fetus becomes a child...when it becomes a child...when it is born.
Quote:As for the egg parallel, there is of course a huge difference between an egg and a fertilized egg.
This apparently is in response to my saying that an egg is not a chicken. Are you prepared to argue that a fertilized egg is a chicken???
Quote:From a Christian point of view it's not really the degree of development the fetus/child has undergone that is relevant, but rather whether the fetus/child has a soul or not. Killing a fetus/child with a soul would of course be murder, and therefore totally unacceptable. Even if nothing is known for sure about when a soul comes into being, one simply cannot guess that it's in the third week, or fourth week or whatever. To be sure, one must assume that there is a soul involved from the earliest moment of the conception.
Really?
And why is that?
How about assuming that there is no soul?
Or that the soul only comes into being when the fetus is born into the world as a child.
Or even better...how about ending after "we really do not know."
Quote:Also, the mother has no right to kill the child in her womb, because the child isn't her creation, but God's.
Well...there might not be a God. But let's suppose there is a God....why must we suppose that the God does not want the fetus (or baby, if you insist) to die while still totally innocent? Maybe the God is lonely in Heaven...and the only visitors he gets are innocent babies (and fetuses) that die.
Quote:She may be its host, but it certainly doesn't mean that she is entitled to killing it at her whim.
Why not?
If there is a God...the God has no problems about taking small children into Heaven in very unusual ways. Many got to Heaven because someone dropped an atomic bomb on them. Many got there by having their pajamas catch fire...or by being in a car crash.
Some got there because the god of the Bible slaughtered them when Pharaoh refused to do his bidding.
In any case...if the soul of the fetus ends up in Heaven for all of eternity...what is the damage?
ABORTION or MURDER
GOD says :
1 Corinthians 3:16 Don't you know that you yourselves are
God's temple and that God's Spirit lives in you?
1 Corinthians 3:17 If anyone destroys God's temple,
God will destroy him; for God's temple is sacred, and you are that temple.
1 Corinthians 6:19 Do you not know that your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit,
who is in you, whom you have received from God? You are not your own;
1 Corinthians 6:20 you were bought at a price. Therefore honor God with your body.
1 Corinthians 6:13 "Food for the stomach and the stomach for food"-
-but God will destroy them both. The body is not meant for sexual immorality,
but for the Lord, and the Lord for the body.
Ephesians 5:5 For of this you can be sure: No immoral, impure or greedy person--such a man is an idolater--has any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and of God.
Ephesians 5:6 Let no one deceive you with empty words,
for because of such things God's wrath comes on those who are disobedient.
Hebrews 10:26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth,
there remaineth no more a sacrifice for sins,
Matthew 12:31 And so I tell you, every sin and blasphemy will be forgiven men,
but the blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven.
