Wife can't get it together

Does she want children--or does she want to wait until she's all grown up?

She does want children. But she wants to wait until she has a career. I am just worried that there are people in life that are procrastinators and then ther are people who are go getters. I don't work well with procrastinators. She says she is not but that is all I have seen for 6 years. She says that she is just maturing and want to do something good with her life.

joji--

I may well be being unjust, but pre-pill your wife would be chasing rug rats and muttering, "If it weren't for you/them I'd have a career."

Why not tell her that she has the rest of the summer to sign up for at least one college course. In January, you're going to look at the situation again. If she is still shilly-shallying, then you'll have to act.

...I have a friend who is going through the same thing as you are,
shes done the same thing flitted through life and jobs, while he studied and carved himself a good career, while also supporting her and although he loves her, he is at his wits end and he wants to move his life along, he feels his life has been on hold waiting for her to get her sh.t together and keep those long forgotten promises, he is at the stage of wanting to travel and enjoy life, where now she has only just got herself a decent job and has made more promises that he has heard time and time again, that she will change, this also after 6 years.....

he has reluctantly just ended it....and he feels like a big weight has just been lifted off his shoulders.

In my opinion, you get one life and one shot at it, my voice of experience says 'look after no1 because no other b'stard is going to do it for you!'
-Cheers Dad!

Thanks for everyones help. Since everything I am going through and reading these posts. MY instincts tell me that my wife is not right for me. But she is finally trying to go to school so she can move foward in life. She seems sincere about it. It gets confusing because when I think about her. she is a great person. warm and fun. But something tells me that she will always be lost. It is so hard when you care for someone. I wish there was an easier way to brake it off like if she cheated or was a bitch but she is not.
Do guys believe in instincts or do you go by that she is a wonderful person. Also are there people that just never get it together or do all people grow in time. I did meet her when she was 22. help
thanks

I will agree that you may not be right for each other, but I am not quite as enthused as you about how great a human you are.

Not to knock you down, but you are fairly presumptive and show little interest in other than getting ahead. There have been plays written about all that... Life is about more than getting ahead, and you seem pretty closed to a programmed way of being.

Thus, I think she may be smart to move on from you.

I don't say that with hostility - more to point out that there is more than one way of thinking with legitimacy and that you seem to have no clue of that.

If you are willing to listen, then I surely recommend you talk and go to counselling together.
If not, if you want to act as you've described here, you'd best be about moving on.





edited to fix spelling

I disaggree. People are attracked to things that they are compatible with. If you fell in love with a guy who sat around all day long and drank beer and played video games but did not support a family finacially you would probably leave. This is the extreme but some people are attracked to people who just are ok with doing the do everyday. I am not. I am very ambitious. I fell in love with my wife because she said she was ambitious. I found out she is not. I think she thinks this because she has dreams like everyone else. the difference is you have to take your dreams and have action. Otherwise they just stay in your head. I think what happends is when you are 22 or a young person you think really big like I want to be a CEO or an Astronoaut. But this is what goes on in your head. But when you mature into yourself you realize what you really want out of life. For some they will follow through exactly what they dreamed of. Others realize that they don't want to work 80 hour work weeks to get ahead. it is not worth it for them. that is normal. I am not showing interest in just getting ahead only but it is very important to me. Everyone is different. There is no wrong or right about how succesful someone wants to be. I think my wife has not figured out yet that she does not have that drive or motivation to do these big and great things or she is mentaly blocked somehow. But she comes home everyday after work and complains and complains tha she is miserable at a day job and wants to be at the top of her game. This is so unrealistic. It is ok to be sad that you have to pay your dues. But she gets extremly irrational about it. I think she is scared to get rejected. This way if she tries for her dreams and she does not get it then she won't feel pain or sadness. This is very common in people. Anyway this lead to me being depressed because my wife is wonderful for a lot of things but It is hard to live with someone who is angry and depressed all the time from being irrational. I try to explain and help her and Therapists have told her to but it goes in one ear and out the other. What do you do when you love the person. She is trust worthy, same interests. gets along with my family etc. Then on top of this her sadness leads to lack of interestin sex because of her depression. Then I feel unloved and sad. I keep getting a wandering eye because of it. I never cheated but I keep feeling that maybe there is someone more compatible for me.
help

Is your marriage big enough for two high achievers?

Would she be a full time mother? Would this satisfy her? Would this satisfy you?

You don't choose who you fall in love with and just because you love each other doesn't mean it will work.

why is it some people think to leave a relationship something terrible has had to have happened or one of you is an a.shole? and counsellors are the remedy?-why cant one just leave on a good note, because they have grown in different directions? Why, must one feel so guilty because the other is indeed a lovely person?

...you know deep within yourself what you need to do.

Everyone here has posted some wonderful insights and given some wonderful advice. I was particularly impressed with yours, Kiwi. A relationship does not have to be bad for it to end and people definitely grow in different directions when they have not set any goals for themselves as a couple. It seems like in the "dating to impress" stages, joji's wife told him everything he wanted to hear and he thought they were truly compatible. I think joji comes from a background that has proven that hard work will reap satisfying payoffs in the end, but I see joji's wife as one who maybe never had to be responsible for herself, maybe was the family's little princess, maybe had most things handed to her on a silver platter and maybe suffers from a bad case of Peter Pan Syndrome. A LOT of assumptions on MY part I know.....but....feel free to tell me if I am totally off the mark here, joji.

Like Kiwi, I also have a very dear friend who met his ex wife in college (very ambitious!) and he was a couple of years older than her. He graduated with his Bachelors and moved to a large nearby city to begin a career with the State. She moved to that city also as that was her hometown and where her family lived and enrolled in a college there. They never lived together prior to their marriage (something he now regrets) and they continued dating and when he felt he was ready, he proposed. She immediately quit school and concentrated on getting married. (oh how he had wished she had finished school first!)

After they married, he realized just how different they were. He encouraged her to go back to college while he was working on both of his Masers Degrees and still working full time, and she kept telling him of the various careers she wanted to have...a Teacher, an Accountant, an Interior Decorator and on and on and on. Yet she never did anything about any of her dreams. She just dreamt. He completed both Masters, took a new job and he continued to try to be supportive.

Instead of school, she decided to just work. But, like joji's wife, she was miserable and no one ever appreciated her and it was degrading to have to start at the bottom when her husband was at the top of his game. My friend didn't care what she did, as long as she was happy. But she was never, ever happy. She fell deeper and deeper into depression (that he discovered she had just after they were married). She decided she was just a completely misunderstood artist and in trying to support her decision to be that at home artist, my friend literally spent thousands upon thousands of dollars for all of the supplies his wife "needed" to be successful. Aside from the initial enthusiasm of all the cool stuff she had and a couple of pairs of earrings and a few greeting cards, everything remained untouched. She was just misunderstood is all.

During these years, they did have a child and her depression worsened even more. She would not get out of bed, she would not lift one finger to clean the house, she would never do a load of laundry. She did what she had to do to care for their child in the most minimal way.. Food and diaper changes were about it. The house became a shambles as my friend could not do it all working 60 hours a week in his new career and caring for his son during his off time. Only once in their entire marriage did they ever have anyone over to their place.

Weekends my friend would clean as much as he could with his son in tow. His wife twice attempted suicide, was diagnosed as a bi-polar, paranoid schizophrenic with severe hypochondria. He stayed married to her for 16 years, unloved, resented, always the target of her anger or vengeance. She was demanding and controlling and bitter and the only time she ever seemed happy was when a new ailment would arise and she could garner someone's sympathy. When he finally left almost 2 years ago, she had no less than 18 doctors.

He is still fighting for his divorce and more importantly custody of his son. Continuance after continuance after continuance have been granted on her behalf because she has fired lawyers and lawyers have quit on her.
She wants him to pay and pay long and good. He is eternally optimistic about a future with his son, but because he could not know the book by its cover, he spent way too many years caught up in her drama and the price he has paid shows.

Have a long, hard sit down with your wife, joji. Talk about what you both want in the future together and how you both will achieve that. I think you were deceived by promises made to you that helped you fall in love. Your wife may have the most wonderful qualities in the entire world, but if they do not mesh with the marriage you were promised, you may have to re-think what truly is important to your happiness down the road. And for heaven's sake, please do not even consider children until you are both singing off the same sheet of music.

God, I hate it when I offer up such long diatribes as I have been doing lately. My apologies to all.

Great post, Lady J.

Even though I have any real relevance to this situation, I did have my doubts about my previous relationship.

I'm a very ambitious person, with many dreams and goals set forth towards the future. She, on the other hand never did so much, but over time motivated herself to want and believe in the same dreams and goals.

Through the years, I've seen her rise and depletion from her great appetite and thirst for knowledge and expanding her mind in hopes for that future, to lingering doubts and fears, ultimately "realization" that she just wasn't cut out for some things.

I remember for example one time with her Math subject. In the beginning she was very enthused about doing well, beating all odds and concentrating and really achieving well for herself. As time went on, her enthusiasm went and so did her marks. Ultimately, her whole perspective became the "realization" that she simply wasn't cut out for Math and hated it.

I believe that whenever you put enough will and effort into something, you will be able to reach that mark. This world would be so depressing otherwise, as how will those who live in poverty ever get out and move onwards to prosperity if they "realized" that they simply do not have the power to do so. If every great inventor or scientist thought like this, I don't think we'd be that far off from when the wheel was invented.

So, even though she possessed great qualities that I don't believe anybody will ever obtain in my life encounters, I still have that small lingering doubt that someday in the future, I'd be left to fulfill those hopes and dreams, while she would be left compromising it all.

You see though, my only worry is what if? What if my judgment of her heart and spirit is incorrect and she goes out and fulfills all those hopes and dreams? Then I'd be left to regret forever for the rest of my life, which I don't want to do.

This is another one of those times where I ask, where do I go from here?

Thank you Lady J and everyone who is helping out. To keep you posted. we started taking space to figure things out. My wife could only last a week. she started to panic. She called me to meet for dinner to discuss the direction of the relationship. She feels that we have not been compromising enough in the marriage and not working hard enought on it. I will agree with that. We both reached the point where we were bitter toward each other and not always listneing to each other needs. Then she said the reason why she has not been amobitious and driven over the years is because I have been verbally abusive and it paralyses her. I am taking risk by telling you guys this because I need help. My father was verbally abusive to me and I am sure I do this in someoneways to my wife. We talked about this in Therapy with her once and the Therapist said that I can be condecending at times and very critical. She said there are things that I do that are verbally abusive at times but not like a verbally abusive does that would put up a warning flag. The thing is through all the years my dad was verbally abusive. and he was like and animal toward me. very hard on me. It never stopped me from achieveing my dreams. I struggled a lot with many issues because of it but I still had passion and followed through. A question I have is that my belief is that if you have a passion for something and you are driven you will go for it even if there are obstacles. I feel that she is maing excuses why she is not doing anything by making this verbally abusive thing that might happend once in a while very extreme. Also Lady J mentioned the OPeter Pan syndrome. She did not come from a rich family. Her family is poor but they did put here on a pedastill. She came from a small town where whe was the top student, top dancer top everything. She always brings up high school how driven and successfull she was. My response is, that was high school and this is the real world.

Can someone be so paralysed not to go after there dreams?
Don't people with drive and passion try to success even with emotional issues?

My friend who knows my wife even before I met her see it clear from the outside. He thinks that she has no drive and would be happy with a simple job and being a mother. He thinks that because she was adopted and her parents had a bad divorced that she adapted to me when she met me. I am her rock and support. He feels that she heard that I am extremly ambitious and said she was to so I would fall in love so she would have sucurity. Now that I look back she was so needed I always fell suffocated all the time for the first years and a half.

let mek now what you think
thanks

I finally realized from talking to you guys and some space from my wife that I am angry. I think I am over this marriage. My wife in some ways wasted 6 years of my life. I wanted to have akid years ago and she kept telling me she need time so she can work on her career and dreams. in 6 years she has done nothing about it. also she wants bigger and nicers things which I pay for and she never stays with one job because she is always saying the people are mean or hates her boss.
I am making a list of the things that are important to me in a wife or relationship. Then I will list my wifes.
Let me know if you think we are compatible enough to swtay together or I should move on with my life. I am worried if I stay she won't get her act together and then I will waste more time. I am mid 30's so If I get divorced it will take time to get over it. Then it will take a lot of dating to meet someone worth marrying again. I don't want to be in my 40's when I have my first kid. This is not the way I thought things would work out.

Here is my lisst of what is important to me

Warm and Caring
Career (Ambitious and Driven)
Wants more out of Life
Good with money not wastefull or wasting money at malls (More Frugal)
Trustworthy
Easy to talk to
Happy and fun
Responsible
Slim and sexy
Sexy attitude and body language
Adventurous
Good cook


My wife is
Bitter and angry a lot
No career
Procratinator
Can't cook (Not that big of deal)
Complains by hindsite (Does not take responsibilty for her actions)
Responsible (Bills, Cleaning etc.)
Warm and Caring
Does not take care of body or health.
Not very sexy attitude (More goody goody two shoes)
Wants bigger things but does not act on them


There are many others. If you read the post plus this list. I am really torn to stick it out. I know people say the grass is not greener on the other side but I am always meeting nice woman who have careers who are more my type. I don't know if I should wait for my wife to figure out that she has Peter Pan Syndrom
let me know
thanks

joji, man my heart goes out to you. I am so sorry that I had not gotten back to your previous post before this, but sometimes I need to think things through before I opens me mouth!

First, let me thank you for opening yourself up to us. That's a very hard thing to do especially when you know of your own unfavorable traits. In my own opinion and no one else may agree at all, there is a fine line between verbal abuse and sometimes being condescending and critical. An abuser doesn't usually let up. They garner enjoyment from making another feel inferior and destroying their self esteem. The feeling of control over another person actually makes them feel more powerful the more they do it. Now, I would like to ask you if you are that type of person or one who bottles up their frustrations and anger and then let's it blow in a condescending and critical way?

In all of my own personal experiences, I have never known of one couple who has not fought over something and let hurtful words fly. Sometimes very hurtful words. Do battles such as this make us all verbal abusers? Maybe so, maybe not. I definitely feel you have some anger issues and the way you deal with them may be very like your own father. You mentioned that your wife and you have been through some sort of therapy before. Was it ever suggested to you or were you ever assisted in getting help for your abusive/condescending/critical ways? How long did you both stay in counseling and why did you stop going? I'm just piecing things out in my head....the reason I am asking actually is that your wife sounds again, very similar to my friends wife. She was always accusing my friend of being verbally or emotionally abusive to her and claimed he always tried to control her. He would offer a suggestion on some issue and she would fly off the handle and scream "Stop trying to control me!!"

In my own opinion, she used the excuse of verbal or emotional abuse in an attempt to also avoid taking any responsibility for her own actions. Everything, literally everything was someone else's doing or fault. The very few menial jobs that she did have, she also complained excessively about how she was being treated so unfairly and how she hated her bosses. She always quit.

She, too, is not one to take care of her body or her health, in spite of her having 18 doctor! (Most of them are psychiatrists and psychologists) And she has been diagnosed with hypochondria. She also is the very, very goody two shoes type of person. No adventurous spirit in ANY way. She is very puritanical in the romantic sense...or in this case, non-romantic sense....wait a sec....are we sure we are not talking about the same woman here? Just a stab at humor to make you hopefully smile, even if it is a bit woefully.

Moving forward and now you have had some time apart. Your anger is honest. You bought a bill of goods that did not live up to what was promised. Now you have some hard, perhaps even life changing decisions to make. And sadly, no one can make them but you. Keep in mind as you go through this decision making process that no one can bring happiness to you. You must bring that to yourself. This applies down he road as well, should you choose to divorce and you, at some point, find yourself healed enough to try again.

I mentioned in another thread to another poster, contemplating divorce that there are no guarantees in life. We only get this one shot and if you are not happy, then you are the captain of your own ship and must follow the course you set for yourself to make yourself happy.

Please don't look at the last 6 years as being wasted. No time is ever wasted if we have grown and learned more than we knew before. Try to eventually let lose of your anger and realize the love you two shared was not wasted at all, but you have just grown in different ways and have different goals for your individual lives.

I'm sure I have said enough for now, but I and many other caring A2K peeps will be here for you when you need us.

Lastly, take care of you during this very tough time. Your answers will come and either way it goes, you will need your strength and peace of mind.

Lady J,
Hi thank you very much again for you great response. It is really helping. To answer the question about verbal abuse. I am a perfectionist and like to be in control but I don't get a high or rush out of controling my wife. I can go in circles and argue for longer than most peoople I guess. I personally think it is more heated arguments. I do agree once and a while that I might say something that is abusive. We did discuss this in Therapy once. The Therapist never said I was a verbaly abusive person in the relationship but she did point out that sometimes in arguments that things I said can be crossing the line. But most of it is just agruments because for a long time we have been arguing about the same thing. I keep getting frustrated that she is running away from responsibility and not taking charge of her life. She keeps telling me that she had this drive before she met me. She was younger then. She just got out of college so there was not much time to grow into herself until she met me. She keeps thinking that for a year and a half before we got together that she had everything together and was extremly driven. now she says since she met me she has kept from moving foward. My friends and family and myself feel that she just wants someone to lean on and take careof her. I also think that if she was not with me should would do the minimum to get by.

We stopped therapy only because we moved from state to state. Right now all I feel is resentment and anger toward her but I do know that this will subside eventually. I am just not happy with my wife in many ways but I amstill just afraid that If I leave that I will have regret. I guess I am just scared because I have never been in this situation before.

I am also excited to meet new people who would be more compatible. This tought feels like freedom and makes me excited. But also I remember the dating scene. I hated it years ago. I know if I fall in love again there will be other problems so I feel confused what to do. Do I try to fix this marriage or will I be happier with someone else even though there are issues, but they might be more compatible.

You are right. there were many fun times with my wife for the past years. she is far from a bad person. This is why it is so hard. She is warm gentle nice person. Just lost in life. IF she cheated or was a bitch it would make my lilfe easier to let go.

LEt me know your thoughts
thanks

If you blame your wife for "wasting" six years, you will be bitter for the rest of your life.

Keep in mind, you deliberately wooed and won her, making a lifetime marriage decision on the person you were at that time.

In the last six years you have become established in your career and grown as a person. You see yourself and the world more clearly than you did six years ago.

You are better suited for fatherhood than you were as a newlywed. You have gained both maturity and financial stability. Further, you chose this woman as a helpmeet. She was not foisted upon you.

Life comes with detours and dead ends. If you learn from them the time is not wasted.

I know you feel you have wasted some of your good years, but I agree with Noddy that its all a learning kerb, well you have to look at it that way dont you...and now you finaly have had a gutsful and is chomping at the bit to just get on with it!......so whats stopping you then?
your guilt?
tick tock tick tock :wink:

The hard thing now is she is crying now that we have space. She realizes and feels so guilty for not getting it together. She says it is because I met her so young. I do have to give her that because at her age I knew what I was starting career wise but a lot of other things I was clueless. But of coarse my fear is that she is a procrastinator. I also can except if she is true to herself and stops this facade. She says she is so sad without me and want to work on a plan and compromise. She also wants to concentrate on our marriage and less on being defensive. I really feel confused after hearing this because I don't want to find out that she is exactly the same after this but I guess I should give a time limit. how long should I give her. It is complicated because she found out that she has a year and a half of school left. So I have to wait for a year and a half plus then looking for a job. I am afraid after school she will try something for a month and quit. It seems like a long time to give someone a chance. But This is my first marriage so what do I know. If I met someone new there will be differences but maybe I can meet someone who is more compatible. Or I should stay because we built a life together.
Help as usual Thanks