12
   

Can Trump Pardon Himself?

 
 
glitterbag
 
  4  
Reply Fri 27 Nov, 2020 12:06 am
All of you who respond to Oral, including myself, are wasting our time and puffing up Oral's sad view of himself. It's not fair to Oral, too many people are feeling good about ourselves because of someone's limitations and inability to process more than malicious counter culture. It's very sad, if folks continue to confront him with facts, he will just hunker down and double down on the Trump myths. So you can either energize his fantasies or cut them off. It's just not going to help that poor soul.
oralloy
 
  -4  
Reply Fri 27 Nov, 2020 12:09 am
@glitterbag,
You shouldn't be so dishonest. No one here is confronting me with facts. And you are the only limited person here.

And, newsflash, our Constitution is not a myth. I know you really really hate the Constitution, but it's very real.
0 Replies
 
glitterbag
 
  3  
Reply Fri 27 Nov, 2020 12:20 am
Trump might think he can pardon his self, he might even do it. The rub is......is it legal? No!!!! toddler man doesn't think he has to comply with the law like the rest of us mere mortals.....but he does (gasp) and the Secret Service will be moving all of his crap into a moving truck, ripping out his phones and his kids govt. phones and all the rest if it.....it's over.
roger
 
  1  
Reply Fri 27 Nov, 2020 12:29 am
@glitterbag,
Presidents pay their own costs of moving in. Pretty sure they have to pay the movers when they move out. That's what I think.
oralloy
 
  -3  
Reply Fri 27 Nov, 2020 12:32 am
@glitterbag,
glitterbag wrote:
is it legal? No!!!!

The Constitution says otherwise.

I do understand that you hate the Constitution.
0 Replies
 
glitterbag
 
  2  
Reply Fri 27 Nov, 2020 12:57 am
@roger,
They do, some govt. organization (it's actually a well oiled machine) will pack his stuff and put it in the truck, but after that it's on Donald. I hope he actually pays the freight, they might not deliver his stuff.
0 Replies
 
neptuneblue
 
  1  
Reply Fri 27 Nov, 2020 01:25 am
@glitterbag,
It was a slow night....

Lol!
oralloy
 
  -4  
Reply Fri 27 Nov, 2020 01:28 am
@neptuneblue,
That is a poor reason for you to babble nonsense about subjects that you don't understand.
vikorr
 
  2  
Reply Fri 27 Nov, 2020 02:23 am
@oralloy,
Quote:
They will have to wait even longer than that if he pardons himself while he is still president. If Mr. Trump pardons himself while he is president, he remains pardoned once his presidential term expires.
My post refered to charges after Trump finished his presidency. By your post above, I can only conclude that you can be pardoned for something you are:
- not charged with; or
- found not guilty of?
Strange sort of pardon powers.
oralloy
 
  -3  
Reply Fri 27 Nov, 2020 02:26 am
@vikorr,
vikorr wrote:
My post refered to charges after Trump finished his presidency. By your post above, I can only conclude that you can be pardoned for something you are:
- not charged with;

Correct.


vikorr wrote:
or
- found not guilty of?

Beats me. That one has never come up before.


vikorr wrote:
Strange sort of pardon powers.

It seems pretty straightforward to me.
vikorr
 
  1  
Reply Fri 27 Nov, 2020 02:39 am
@oralloy,
Official "Pardons" have always referred to pardons for a crime committed (ie. something you are found guilty of). I've never heard of an ability to grant an official 'pardon' to someone who has been found to not have done anything wrong...at least not in democracies.

Sounds a lot like the ability to interfere with justice.
oralloy
 
  -3  
Reply Fri 27 Nov, 2020 02:55 am
@vikorr,
vikorr wrote:
Official "Pardons" have always referred to pardons for a crime committed (ie. something you are found guilty of).

People can also be pardoned for crimes that they were found guilty of but are actually innocent of.

And they can be pardoned for crimes that they have never been charged with, regardless of their guilt or innocence.


vikorr wrote:
I've never heard of an ability to grant an official 'pardon' to someone who has been found to not have done anything wrong...at least not in democracies.

Neither have I. As I said, that one has never come up before.


vikorr wrote:
Sounds a lot like the ability to interfere with justice.

Maybe so, but pardons have been a part of our system for quite a long time, maybe even for as long as we've had governments that can administer punishments.

If a prosecutor chooses to not prosecute a given crime, is that also interfering with justice?

At any rate, there is nothing just about the witch hunts that progressives perpetrate against people who don't agree with them, so no justice is being interfered with if Mr. Trump pardons himself.
vikorr
 
  3  
Reply Fri 27 Nov, 2020 03:50 am
@oralloy,
Quote:
If a prosecutor chooses to not prosecute a given crime, is that also interfering with justice?
If it is going against the rule of law? Yes.

But your question is more complex than the surface. In decomcracies, prosecutions don't start unless there is a likelihood of a successful prosecution (together with a public interest) - less than that standard becomes a malicious prosecution. This is one of the major reasons why people have confidence in the rule of law. It's also the sticking point in contentious political prosecutions. So the full answer to your question is more like - if a prosecutor:
- knows there is enough evidence to have a likelihood of securing a conviction; and
- knows there is a public interest to prosecute; then
not commencing the prosecution is interfering with justice.

Most people are largely, implicitly aware of this methodology - even if it hasn't explicitly been explained to them.
0 Replies
 
neptuneblue
 
  3  
Reply Fri 27 Nov, 2020 06:24 am
@oralloy,
oralloy wrote:
That is a poor reason for you to babble nonsense about subjects that you don't understand.


LMAO! Babble? BABBLE?

It is you who seems blissfully unaware of the subject. Like Trump, saying nonsense things are your forte. You offer no substantive evidence on Trump's behalf nor your own and are clearly misguided.

This is just an other example of the bloviate tweets that will cease once Biden is sworn in.
snood
 
  4  
Reply Fri 27 Nov, 2020 06:45 am
@neptuneblue,
Yeah we will see an end to one type of bloviation, but they will just start another type. From ‘we wuz robbed by the evil left’, to ‘here’s all the evil things Joe Biden and the left are doing’.

Because fact-free blathering is all they know how to do.

We’ll have to be consoled by that little stubborn news item that isn’t going away : Trump got his ass whipped and has to GTFO of our White House.
oralloy
 
  -4  
Reply Fri 27 Nov, 2020 07:15 am
@snood,
You sure are dishonest. We offer plenty of facts. It's you who is always denying reality.
0 Replies
 
oralloy
 
  -3  
Reply Fri 27 Nov, 2020 07:16 am
@neptuneblue,
neptuneblue wrote:
LMAO! Babble? BABBLE?

Correct. That is the proper terminology to describe your posts here.


neptuneblue wrote:
It is you who seems blissfully unaware of the subject.

Incorrect. You are the one who is ignorant of the subject.


neptuneblue wrote:
Like Trump, saying nonsense things are your forte.

Wrong again. You are the one who is spouting nonsense.

Case in point: your claim someone needs to be convicted before they can receive a pardon. That was pretty silly even by your standards.

And then, in a futile attempt to back up that silly claim, you offer a quotation explaining that the President can't pardon state convictions.

Face it, you are not even remotely competent to discuss this topic.


neptuneblue wrote:
You offer no substantive evidence on Trump's behalf nor your own and are clearly misguided.

Untrue. I provided the relevant section of the Constitution when you asked for a cite.

And unlike you, I actually understand what I am talking about.
farmerman
 
  5  
Reply Fri 27 Nov, 2020 10:50 am
@oralloy,
Quote:

And unlike you, I actually understand what I am talking about.
Then why are you just loading the airways with your incessant garbage??

If you claim youre smart, you know your opinions are FOS
oralloy
 
  -3  
Reply Fri 27 Nov, 2020 11:02 am
@farmerman,
You cannot point out anything untrue in my posts, and you know it. So pipe down with your silly bluffing.
farmerman
 
  2  
Reply Fri 27 Nov, 2020 02:37 pm
@oralloy,
Is that an OLLIE version of nyah nyah nyah??
 

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