Intelligent Design Theory: Science or Religion?

How much affect does the Dover decision have on what Florida (or any other state for that matter) does?

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rosborne,

In an interview, Judge Jones described his opinion as "not precedential, but nonetheless persuasive."

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wandeljw wrote:

rosborne,

In an interview, Judge Jones described his opinion as "not precedential, but nonetheless persuasive."

It'll be interesting to see that put to the test. Maybe it'll happen in Florida.

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Quote:

In an interview, Judge Jones described his opinion as "not precedential, but nonetheless persuasive."

I'm afraid that statement means very little.

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Quote:

I'm afraid that statement means very little.

As an experiment, I put held that sentence up to a mirror. Sure enough, it reflected itself.

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It isn't an answer Bernie however clever it is. It's just another insult. I'm used to that and you well know it. Everybody on here agrees with you so what was the point?

To show off of course by displaying what is presumably thought to be a novel turn of phrase and thus, by easy logic, it is you who is looking at oneself and anticipating us gasping in awe at your literary merit and what we have is a classic case of projection.

If you would like to inform us all of the meaning of Judge Jones's statement, in your everso humble opinion, I'm sure those of us who are on your side of the fence will take it as being how you might intend it to be taken or at least make a mental note of it.

The rest of us will be glad of the entertainment as it's a bit of a dead time here early on Sat night as you probably remember.

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The "put held" is very good too. You should play the word association game sometime.

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spendi

Insult is the game you play here more often than not. I understand that. When I bought a computer and discovered my first such community (rather bigger than this one) I referred to it as "straight men as far as the eye can see." Stupidity is a blight and god knows how bad things might get without gleaming soldiers like you and I facing this dull and endless advancing line.

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I take it then that you are not going to put your reputation on the line and try to prove that this-

Quote:

In an interview, Judge Jones described his opinion as "not precedential, but nonetheless persuasive."

means anything of use to the anti-ID side. It does of course mean something to the other side though. That his decision didn't set a precedent which some on here have tried to say it did or, at least, given that impression.

It is quite common to assert that what one has pronounced is "persuasive". Was JJ on fees for the interview?

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Which, when all the chips come to rest, means that ros has been shooting his own barrack room up.

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Okay, I just want to double check that I've got everything right about you, Spendi.

1. You don't believe that Intelligent Design can be taught.
2. It has to be infused into pupil's minds through the teaching environment by Christian teachers.

Have I got this right so far?

So tell me, what exactly is this Intelligent Design of yours?

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Even spendi doesn't know how to explain his ID belief. All we know thus far is that it's not the classical ID most of us are exposed to.

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You'll find the basis in the Gospel of Mark.

If I could explain it so easily as you seem to expect me to I would be able to teach it wouldn't I?

Your 2nd proposition is getting close providing the Christian teachers are real Christians and have studied the Gospels a little.

One might say that all the ceremonies, and music, and art generally employed in the service of a religion are merely a sort of foreground illumination.

I think people want it.

But I have no time tonight.

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spendius wrote:

You'll find the basis in the Gospel of Mark.

If I could explain it so easily as you seem to expect me to I would be able to teach it wouldn't I?

I find it rather suspicious that you can't really define this "Intelligent Design" of yours, seeing as that it's meant to be taught in science classes. Which means, what you're talking about isn't Intelligent Design.

ID is basically, "If we find an irreducibly complex adaptation, that is, an evolutionary adaptation that could not have evolved naturally, then that is proof of an intelligent designer."

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Your 2nd proposition is getting close providing the Christian teachers are real Christians and have studied the Gospels a little.

One might say that all the ceremonies, and music, and art generally employed in the service of a religion are merely a sort of foreground illumination.

It's not my proposition. You said it (or at least something similar). Somewhere on page 718, I think.

Thing is, I fail to understand how your proposition would teach children about irreducible complexity in biological adaptations.

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Well Wolf-- I had no plans to teach children about irreducible complexity in biological adaptations. They have quite enough on their plate with these flipping adults.

They would be better off being taught to read and write and add up properly. Teachers who can't do that often head up incoherent byways and being "in a meeting".

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ID is basically, "If we find an irreducibly complex adaptation, that is, an evolutionary adaptation that could not have evolved naturally, then that is proof of an intelligent designer."

Is that so??? Well bless my cotton socks. You learn something new everyday. I'll look into it. Thanks.

It just goes to show how useful it is to ask an expert.

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ID is basically, "If we find an irreducibly complex adaptation, that is, an evolutionary adaptation that could not have evolved naturally, then that is proof of an intelligent designer."

Nothing to do with the matter.

And anyway--how can you find an ICA? On finding it it is reduced.

It has often been said that it is impossible to explain cricket to someone who has not been immersed in the game from a very early age. And that was before media got involved and brought the money men in.

Those who have been immersed in cricket and have seen media's coverage of it evolve from lowly beginnings might be aware of why I choose this metaphor to suggest the subtleties and charms of almost anything one has been so interested in from an early age. How there are many layers of meaning to such activities.

Even D.I.Y. looks fascinating from the outside to anyone who knows about layers of meaning in things.

What ID is, first and foremost, is not not ID. IDers may disagree on all sorts of sophistical fine points but they all agree about that.

But don't forget the money men. They evolve at faster rates than bats.

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Let's get this straight: 2 plus 2 = 4, but the answer is not 4.

Is that about right?

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It is quite a witty way of putting it I must admit.

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SOUTH CAROLINA UPDATE

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Biology textbooks stand at crossroad
(By BILL ROBINSON, McClatchy Newspapers, Dec. 25, 2007)

COLUMBIA, S.C. | The debate over how to teach the origin of species in public high schools could resurface in January, when the South Carolina Board of Education meets.

The divided state panel withheld its endorsement of two biology textbooks this month when board member Charles W. McKinney pointed to dozens of questions raised in critiques by Horace D. Skipper, a retired Clemson University professor.

Two years ago, the 17-member state school board wrestled with updating instructional standards that high school biology teachers follow when teaching evolution.

State Sen. Mike Fair, a Republican, successfully lobbied for revisions to include the term "critically analyze" as a link to a movement to elevate instruction about creationism and intelligent design to the status of evolution.

That modification of the state's widely acclaimed biology standards prompted criticism from national experts.

Fair's campaign angered many high school educators, including those who consider themselves devoutly religious but objected to being told to mix lessons about beliefs with science.

Next month's vote on the two biology books is whether they should be added to that list. Schools are not obligated to use them, however.

Skipper takes issue with passages about evolution in a biology textbook by Kenneth R. Miller and Joseph Levine. Miller's testimony in a highly publicized federal trial dealt a blow to proponents of teaching biology inspired by the Bible.

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Mr Popper wrote-

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"The better theory is the one that explains more, that explains with greater precision, and that allows us to make better predictions."

My theory is that the publishers of the two books haven't sent out enough brown envelopes yet.

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Intelligent Design Theory: Science or Religion?

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