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Pope's Last Hours On Earth: Your Reaction?

 
 
Eva
 
  1  
Reply Sat 2 Apr, 2005 02:21 pm
Amen.
0 Replies
 
au1929
 
  1  
Reply Sat 2 Apr, 2005 02:26 pm
Papal Power
What no one else will say about John Paul II.
By Christopher Hitchens
Posted Friday, April 1, 2005, at 2:51 PM PT



The papacy is not, in theory, a man-made office at all. Its holder is chosen for life, by God himself, to hold the keys of Peter and to be the vicar of Christ on earth. This is yet another of the self-imposed tortures that faith inflicts upon itself. It means that you have to believe that the pope before last, who held on to the job for a matter of weeks before dying (or, according to some, before being murdered) was either unchosen by God in some fit of celestial pique, or left unprotected by heaven against his assassins. And it means that you have to believe that the public agony and humiliation endured by the pontiff was also part of some divine design. In the case of a presidency, or even a monarchy, provision can be made for abdication and succession when physical and mental deliquescence occur. But there could obviously not have been any graceful retirement in the case of John Paul II. The next vicar of Christ could hardly be expected to perform his sacred duties knowing that there was a still-living vicar of Christ, however decrepit, on the scene. Thus, and as with the Schiavo case, every last morsel of misery has been compulsorily extracted from the business of death. For the people who credit the idea, apparently, heaven can wait. Odd.
Continue at.
http://www.slate.com/id/2116085/#ContinueArticle
0 Replies
 
groszi
 
  1  
Reply Sat 2 Apr, 2005 02:29 pm
;( our dear papa has died... I'm crying ;( SadSad
0 Replies
 
nimh
 
  1  
Reply Sat 2 Apr, 2005 03:21 pm
Christopher Hitchens wrote:
Thus, and as with the Schiavo case, every last morsel of misery has been compulsorily extracted from the business of death.

I overheard someone in the coffeehouse recounting what someone on radio had been talking about. That the Pope (any Pope) does something noteworthy by remaining visible and in office until the very end. He rehabilitates, so to say, suffering, old age, illness, death itself. In our modern world, those are things we sanitise away into unseen dimensions: curtained beds in the hospital, quiet retirement in a suburbian old age people's home. You're not supposed to be old in public, not supposed to be on TV when you're gravely ill, weak or decrepit. Our modern age does not believe in suffering - we deny it or airbrush it away, and believe in positive thinking instead. You can be whatever you want to be! (And if you're weak or unable, it's thus your own fault). DIY books tell you how to save yourself from any suffering or even awkwardness - just say no to it, change your job, change your wife, do up your face with botox, fight the teeth of time and insist on adhering to the ideal of everlasting beauty and youth. And once you cant anymore, please get out of our face and hide yourself in retirement. Well, said this guy: the Pope reminded us that suffering is part of life. That as sure as we are born, we will grow old, we will suffer and we will die. By doing so in public, without shirking back, he showed us that one can accept it with self-respect - and die without being ashamed of it.

Something like that. Thought it was an interesting take.
0 Replies
 
Steve 41oo
 
  1  
Reply Sat 2 Apr, 2005 03:30 pm
cheer up groszi

there will be a new one soon

Or does it mean the end of Roman Catholicism?
0 Replies
 
ehBeth
 
  1  
Reply Sat 2 Apr, 2005 03:41 pm
John Paul was Pope for almost all of my entire adult life. For many people, like Groszi, he was the only Pope they've ever known. For people in Poland, like Groszi, he was more than simply Papa.

There are a lot of people feeling a significant loss right now.
0 Replies
 
Eva
 
  1  
Reply Sat 2 Apr, 2005 03:54 pm
nimh wrote:
Christopher Hitchens wrote:
Thus, and as with the Schiavo case, every last morsel of misery has been compulsorily extracted from the business of death.

I overheard someone in the coffeehouse recounting what someone on radio had been talking about. That the Pope (any Pope) does something noteworthy by remaining visible and in office until the very end. He rehabilitates, so to say, suffering, old age, illness, death itself. In our modern world, those are things we sanitise away into unseen dimensions: curtained beds in the hospital, quiet retirement in a suburbian old age people's home. You're not supposed to be old in public, not supposed to be on TV when you're gravely ill, weak or decrepit. Our modern age does not believe in suffering - we deny it or airbrush it away, and believe in positive thinking instead. You can be whatever you want to be! (And if you're weak or unable, it's thus your own fault). DIY books tell you how to save yourself from any suffering or even awkwardness - just say no to it, change your job, change your wife, do up your face with botox, fight the teeth of time and insist on adhering to the ideal of everlasting beauty and youth. And once you cant anymore, please get out of our face and hide yourself in retirement. Well, said this guy: the Pope reminded us that suffering is part of life. That as sure as we are born, we will grow old, we will suffer and we will die. By doing so in public, without shirking back, he showed us that one can accept it with self-respect - and die without being ashamed of it.

Something like that. Thought it was an interesting take.


It's more than an interesting take, nimh. It's a powerful example of aging, suffering and dying with grace and dignity. I hope to do half as well when my turn comes.
0 Replies
 
dlowan
 
  1  
Reply Sat 2 Apr, 2005 04:42 pm
Yep - I hold little truck with so many things this Pope did (though I deeply admire his apologies, for instance) - but I agree with the take Nimh referenced, and with Eva's comment.

It was a sad and terrible - but inspiring - thing to see him struggle to speak at that window - the will so strong, and his body so frail.

Though - there is the problem of having a Pope so unwell for so long - in that others take up a stronger role in deciding what is to happen - the politics of the papacy continue in the way politics do when there is something of a vacuum.

Just one of the contradictions of the office, I guess.
0 Replies
 
JPB
 
  1  
Reply Sat 2 Apr, 2005 05:34 pm
Eva wrote:
nimh wrote:
Christopher Hitchens wrote:
Thus, and as with the Schiavo case, every last morsel of misery has been compulsorily extracted from the business of death.

I overheard someone in the coffeehouse recounting what someone on radio had been talking about. That the Pope (any Pope) does something noteworthy by remaining visible and in office until the very end. He rehabilitates, so to say, suffering, old age, illness, death itself. In our modern world, those are things we sanitise away into unseen dimensions: curtained beds in the hospital, quiet retirement in a suburbian old age people's home. You're not supposed to be old in public, not supposed to be on TV when you're gravely ill, weak or decrepit. Our modern age does not believe in suffering - we deny it or airbrush it away, and believe in positive thinking instead. You can be whatever you want to be! (And if you're weak or unable, it's thus your own fault). DIY books tell you how to save yourself from any suffering or even awkwardness - just say no to it, change your job, change your wife, do up your face with botox, fight the teeth of time and insist on adhering to the ideal of everlasting beauty and youth. And once you cant anymore, please get out of our face and hide yourself in retirement. Well, said this guy: the Pope reminded us that suffering is part of life. That as sure as we are born, we will grow old, we will suffer and we will die. By doing so in public, without shirking back, he showed us that one can accept it with self-respect - and die without being ashamed of it.

Something like that. Thought it was an interesting take.


It's more than an interesting take, nimh. It's a powerful example of aging, suffering and dying with grace and dignity. I hope to do half as well when my turn comes.


Also, for those with faith (I wish I had more), it shows how one can be at peace with dying and serene with the thought of going to the hereafter.
0 Replies
 
 

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