"The value of nihilistic thinking."

Jasper, Are you saying you experience a manifest god as an everyday experience?

Jasper, Do you or any of your friends experience a manifest god, in your day-to-day life?

Would you say/not say that if God/Devil exists then they would be embroiled within EVERYONES day to day experiences? Everything is interconnected/embroiled as in the physical...how can this not be the case? If there is a spiritual element to it all then would this spiritual element not be interconnected/embroiled as well? As no one can prove definitely that God/Devil do or don't exist then it is foolish to just take stance that they don't based purely on the fact the no definite proof is available to confirm that they either do or don't.

Jasper, From your statement there, then is no reason not to believe any fictional character, and it drastically mutates ones thinking. It is a full-time job dealing with reality, without jumping into the supernatural to embrace a fantasy life.

The statement is logically sound.

The issue you have is that you remain a SPECTATOR.

JASPER, Please expand on your statement, I am a spectator to what?

Well one can just treat this as JUST a philosophical debate and remain separate (SPECTATOR) from the experience of it all OR one can truly acknowledge SELF and accept that every part of who you are IS embroiled (PLAYER) within the substance of what the philosophical debate speaks of including the possibility that there maybe a SPIRITUAL element to it. It is a well known FACT that this idea scares secular scientists. They REMAIN spectators therefore with their one sided views/opinions that they can't definitively PROVE.

Jasper, I do not wish to continue in dialogue with you. I do not debate religious people, I have found it a waste of time. By the way, you do know that preaching isn't allowed on this site don't you?

I am not preaching to you or anyone.

It has been said, that Christianity and of course Judaism are the first nihilistic belief systems. As they devalue the here and now of being and being in the world, for an imaginary world. The pie in the sky type of magical thinking, as opposed to reality.

There is positive and negative nihilism.You need to consider both.

Jasper, please expand on what you call positive nihilism. Do you mean a personal definition.

Listen don’t shoot the messenger.

The reasoning behind negative nihilism is that as one cannot prove definitively that God doesn’t exist then one cannot state as FACT that good is bad and bad is good and as a result no morals exist.I use the terms 1,0 for good and bad.

Good could be Good and Bad could be Bad.If this is true then morals would exist.

The reasoning goes that one needs to be open minded enough to accept that good and bad are different.Nihilism (+ve) can still be maintained as an alternative to negative nihilism.

At the end of the day it is only about recognising this possibility as this may affect ones overall reasoning outputs.

Hypothetically, if one designed a biological machine which has competing reasonings one could just programme it such that when one reasoning reads 0 the other reasoning only ever reads 1.

However,one could also programme it such that when one reasoning reads 0 or 1 the other reasoning can read either 0 or 1.

The first programming option above could be used to justify that free will does not exist.The second programming option could be used to justify that free will does exist.

NOTHING should come out of Nihilism NOTHING as in no further REASONINGS.The FACT is with man further reasonings do come out.These reasonings are either positive OR negative reasonings.

Some people choose NOT TO hope that God exists (some people will use other words) based upon no definitive carnal PROOF,however they do have the choice TO hope that God exists as well based upon no definitive carnal PROOF ...Why?….because NEITHER side of the fence has any definitive carnal proof.

There is no such thing as TRUE nihilism....one either has a positive or negative nihilistic view.

Hi jufa,
Nihilism is a stark reality, it is dangerous, it is depressing and all most worthless, but for the realizations it makes apparent, life and consciousness is what it's all about. All we have is each other, without our ability to give meaning to life and the world we will dry up and blow away. Nothing can survive in a nihilistic world. Through consciousness, we transform this world into something of sublime rapturous beauty, and the sublime terror of big fish eats little fish. We realize we are free to value what we wish, for we bestow meaning upon the world, don't let life just happen to you, but create your dream world, it is your birthright.

No....AWARENESS sits above consciousness.