Baldimo
 
Reply Sat 19 Mar, 2005 12:53 am
NEW YORK - The United Nations (search) soon will release a report on how to hold accountable peacekeepers accused of sexual abuse and other violations in strife-torn parts of the world.
The report's release later this month is the culmination of months of investigative work by Prince Zeid Ra'ad al-Hussein (search) of Jordan. Its release is supposed to help the United Nations regain an even keel after being rocked by reports of the rape of women and children by peacekeepers in the Democratic Republic of Congo (search). Peacekeepers have also been linked in the past to sex crimes in East Timor and prostitution in Cambodia and Kosovo.
The allegations are not the only problem facing the United Nations. They come as several investigations probe what happened to the U.N. Oil-for-Food program, a multi-billion dollar scandal that has led some to question the very legitimacy of the organization.
"It's devastating. It's a terrible set of allegations, that peacekeepers sent to keep the peace in poor, weak countries with vulnerable people who have not been able to have their rights protected for years, that some of them behave in this way. I mean, it completely undercuts our mission, and we recognize that," Mark Malloch Brown, U.N. Secretary General Kofi Annan's chief of staff, told FOX News.
"He's [Annan] coming down on it hard, and he's sent the equivalent of his vice president, the deputy secretary-general, out to the main missions over the last few weeks to lay down the law, make sure everyone understood it."
Building a 'Culture of Accountability'
A major challenge for U.N. officials is imposing punishment on the guilty. Because of sovereignty issues, the United Nations doesn't have the authority to discipline peacekeepers who hail from its member states. And most countries don't want to give the world body that authority.
"It gets down to accountability and, the U.N. being an international body without sovereignty unto itself … It can't prosecute acts of heinous crimes of personnel and soldiers given to it by member states," Robert McClure, an American Army colonel who commanded an engineer battalion in Haiti to support a U.N. peacekeeping contingent, said.
McClure spent two years on the U.N. peacekeeping staff keeping watch over U.N. missions in Sierra Leone and the Republic of Congo.
"If you [allow the U.N. to prosecute international personnel], then you supercede laws of the international nations … how much sovereignty does a state want to give up to the United Nations? And the answer is, not much," McClure said.
When Annan tapped al-Hussein last November to work with countries that offer up peacekeepers, he charged him with not only making sure peacekeepers on the ground are following the U.N.'s code of conduct but also that their home countries deal with any criminal acts.
"[Al-Hussein] is putting forward a report, which will be out shortly, which will have a number of very strong recommendations dealing with these issues and we look forward to putting them forward and working with the member states to get these things accomplished," a U.N. official told FOXNews.com.
In the Congo, all but two of the 65 military personnel accused of sexual abuse or misconduct have been sent back to their home countries. Among civilian personnel, 17 are being investigated for illicit behavior. One of the accused individuals is currently in a French prison facing charges and accused of running a pedophile ring.
U.N. officials maintain that member states are beginning to take the matter of abuse by peacekeepers seriously. In Morocco, for example, authorities announced the arrest of 16 peacekeepers accused of sexually abusing local Congo girls and they discharged the contingent's commander. South Africa has followed suit, while Nepal has relieved some senior commanders in the Congo.
In the Congo, U.N. officials say they already have taken a number of steps to prevent more abuse. They have issued a non-fraternization policy, banning peacekeepers from having consensual sex with adult locals and discouraging social interaction unless it's part of their daily duties. U.N. officials maintain there's a strict curfew in place but a recent FOX News investigation discovered that the curfew was being ignored by some.
Annan has asked member states to provide 100 more military police to the Congo mission to help sift through abuse allegations, as well. Other steps apply to all U.N. peacekeeping operations and include establishing a "personal conduct unit" and installing code-of-conduct officers in all missions.
In-Country Courts Martial?
Since the United Nations can't impose punishment on criminal peacekeepers, one possible solution to this problem is to establish courts martial for military personnel within the country where the peacekeeping mission is taking place. The home country of the accused peacekeeper would do the investigating instead of the country where the alleged activities took place, since nations such as Haiti and Sierra Leone have little semblance of any effective law and order system.
"These are countries that want to be viewed as [having] professional militaries. It is very difficult to conduct a legal inquest thousands of kilometers from where it happened because you don't have access to witnesses and chains of evidence are broken," the U.N. official told FOX News.
Adding another degree of pressure to the United Nations is the U.S. State Department.
American officials are pushing for a number of changes to require:
�- Instituting advance training for U.N. peacekeepers that makes it clear that sexual abuse and exploitation will be quickly investigations and dealt with appropriately.
�- Requiring troop-contributing countries to commit, in writing, to provide such training and to deal swiftly with abuse allegations and report back to the U.N. on the results.
�- Establishing a roster of people who have committed sexual abuse or exploitation while serving with the United Nations, promising to bar them from future service.
"The United States takes its responsibility with respect to U.N. peacekeeping missions very seriously. I believe other Security Council members do as well," Kim Holmes, assistant secretary for the State Department's Bureau of International Organization Affairs, said during a recent House committee hearing on the issue.
"Sexual exploitation of civilians is intolerable and we will place its prevention and punishment as a top priority in all U.N. peacekeeping missions," Holmes said.
But perhaps the most effective way to root out this type of behavior, McClure suggested, is the intense media attention being given to peacekeeping abuses.
"The exposure of crimes will in and of itself cause states and the practice to at least slow down and hopefully stop," McClure said.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Why haven't people protested in the streets and demanded the heads of the leaders of these people. This is worse then torture when you rape little kids because the adults might get you AIDS. I demand that the peace protestor's parade through the streets and burn UN flags in protest of the heinous crimes of these UN soldiers.
  • Topic Stats
  • Top Replies
  • Link to this Topic
Type: Discussion • Score: 0 • Views: 7,692 • Replies: 148
No top replies

 
Joe Nation
 
  2  
Reply Sat 19 Mar, 2005 08:53 pm
Lead the way.

J
0 Replies
 
Finn dAbuzz
 
  1  
Reply Sat 19 Mar, 2005 11:23 pm
Joe Nation wrote:
Lead the way.

J


Joe has a point Baldimo (Did I really write that?).

Clearly the UN receives something of a free pass, on its transgressions, from the left wing, but we should save our outrage for the UN rather than diluting it with anger at its left wing apologists. Hard to criticize a certain group for not marching in the streets against an outrage if one is not prepared to do so as well.

To be fair, the original hue and cry about UN sex scandals was raised by the Left: folks who were not willing to allow partisan politics to force them to turn a blind eye to the outrage. Unfortunately there are far too many other among the Left (including the US news media) who believe that attacking the UN plays into the hands of the real enemy - Conservative Republicans. When the fight is against Right Wing Extremists, what are a few victimized children?
0 Replies
 
Mr Stillwater
 
  1  
Reply Sun 20 Mar, 2005 12:49 am
Still laughing guys.

Let's see..... the UN outs it's own and punishes them.

The USA repeatably denies that abuse/extra-judicial toture and executions exists and then threatens anyone who uncovers it ans complains as 'helping the terrorists'. And when it does turn out to be true*... 'we can do what we like, to whomever we like, in what-ever way we like! So there!'


*like 'Torture Air'.
0 Replies
 
dlowan
 
  1  
Reply Sun 20 Mar, 2005 01:45 am
Lol- actually, the UN seems to feel, and deal with, the outrage itself.

Unlike you.

Hmmmmmmm?
0 Replies
 
Baldimo
 
  1  
Reply Tue 22 Mar, 2005 12:04 am
dlowan wrote:
Lol- actually, the UN seems to feel, and deal with, the outrage itself.

Unlike you.

Hmmmmmmm?


US soldiers have been court martialed and put in prision. How does the US not take care of the mess SOME soldiers made.

Just as a side note, I still don't think it was torture.
0 Replies
 
gravy
 
  1  
Reply Tue 22 Mar, 2005 12:27 am
baldimo wrote:
Just as a side note, I still don't think it was torture.


As a side-reply, the US law thinks so:

Quote:

"any act by which severe pain or suffering, whether physical or mental, is intentionally inflicted on a person for such purposes as obtaining from him or her or a third person information or a confession, punishing him or her for an act he or she or a third person has committed, or intimidating or coercing him or her or a third person, or for any reason based on discrimination of any kind, when such pain or suffering is inflicted by or at the instigation of or with the consent or acquiescence of a public official or other person acting in an official capacity."


source

(but back to the thread at hand...)
There should be equal outrage, rightly pointed out in this thread. Hope the UN behaves with the transparency and severity this issue deserves...
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Tue 22 Mar, 2005 12:30 am
Another aside:

can someone give me a link, since when the USA supports UN legislation over foreign citizens? Shocked

I mean, this would be really interesting, if UN peacekepers from the USA would be under "UN legislation" from now onwards as well.
0 Replies
 
Baldimo
 
  1  
Reply Tue 22 Mar, 2005 12:54 am
Walter Hinteler wrote:
Another aside:

can someone give me a link, since when the USA supports UN legislation over foreign citizens? Shocked

I mean, this would be really interesting, if UN peacekepers from the USA would be under "UN legislation" from now onwards as well.


As far as I know they are. I have a friend who is in Kosovo for the 2nd time and he has told me they are under UN rules. Will they be punished by the UN? I doubt it.
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Tue 22 Mar, 2005 01:26 am
Baldimo wrote:


As far as I know they are. I have a friend who is in Kosovo for the 2nd time and he has told me they are under UN rules. Will they be punished by the UN? I doubt it.


That's really interesting, and I seriously didn't know this.
Gives a new perspective on the reasons why the USA refuses taking part in the International Criminal Court.
0 Replies
 
ossobuco
 
  1  
Reply Tue 22 Mar, 2005 01:50 am
Troops have lost control, if some was established before hand, over millennia. It is soooo not useful, from UN troops or US troops or anyone else.

Let me just go ahead and surmise all troops, un or us, or martian, have lost control at some point.

What we have, I gather from much reading, is in training, on all sides, a kind of enemy devil kill thing.

Thus, occasional loss of control by a company in fear is reasonable. And this occurs in further reaction as well.

I am loathe to blame any troop person.

'tis the leaders and the war games that need to just stop.
0 Replies
 
Mr Stillwater
 
  1  
Reply Tue 22 Mar, 2005 02:31 am
"It's fun to shoot some people"

Quote:

Lt. Gen. James N. Mattis, who commanded the 1st Marine Division in the 2003 Iraq invasion, told a conference in San Diego.








The day the leader of the United Nations makes such a public utterance - you have a good reason to close it down.
0 Replies
 
dlowan
 
  1  
Reply Tue 22 Mar, 2005 02:32 am
Baldimo wrote:
dlowan wrote:
Lol- actually, the UN seems to feel, and deal with, the outrage itself.

Unlike you.

Hmmmmmmm?


US soldiers have been court martialed and put in prision. How does the US not take care of the mess SOME soldiers made.

Just as a side note, I still don't think it was torture.


Ah - but the UN appears to have investigated fully, and punished quickly, and come up with a lot of ideas to try to prevent it happening again. Without the "oh, it never happened. you just hate us" and the "oh, it isn't important" and the "it was just a few rogues" and the "oh, but they deserved it" stuff.
0 Replies
 
Mr Stillwater
 
  1  
Reply Tue 22 Mar, 2005 02:42 am
Greetings oh Wabbit of the South (n'West). How goes it?
0 Replies
 
McGentrix
 
  1  
Reply Tue 22 Mar, 2005 07:46 am
dlowan wrote:
Baldimo wrote:
dlowan wrote:
Lol- actually, the UN seems to feel, and deal with, the outrage itself.

Unlike you.

Hmmmmmmm?


US soldiers have been court martialed and put in prision. How does the US not take care of the mess SOME soldiers made.

Just as a side note, I still don't think it was torture.


Ah - but the UN appears to have investigated fully, and punished quickly, and come up with a lot of ideas to try to prevent it happening again. Without the "oh, it never happened. you just hate us" and the "oh, it isn't important" and the "it was just a few rogues" and the "oh, but they deserved it" stuff.


So, let me get this straight, it's OK when the UN investigates itself, punishes those they find guilty of wrong doing and then try to move on. Does that about sum up what you are saying?

Why then, do the same rules not apply to the US I wonder?
0 Replies
 
gustavratzenhofer
 
  1  
Reply Tue 22 Mar, 2005 07:50 am
Baldimo wrote:
Just as a side note, I still don't think it was torture.


Baldimo, are you in the Cheerleaders all over the world build pyramids club?
0 Replies
 
Mr Stillwater
 
  1  
Reply Tue 22 Mar, 2005 07:31 pm
Because McG - when the USA does it it is part of a plot to take over the f@cking world by the super-rich with multi-millionaires like George W Bush leading the charge. They don't give a goddam about what US troops are doing to anyone who is not an citizen of the USA and if it can't be covered up it can be shrugged off ('Stuff happens') and failing that a new 'terror threat' can be spun out of thin air and the public clamours for more dead ragheads or slopes or dagoes.
0 Replies
 
McGentrix
 
  1  
Reply Tue 22 Mar, 2005 07:40 pm
Mr Stillwater wrote:
Because McG - when the USA does it it is part of a plot to take over the f@cking world by the super-rich with multi-millionaires like George W Bush leading the charge. They don't give a goddam about what US troops are doing to anyone who is not an citizen of the USA and if it can't be covered up it can be shrugged off ('Stuff happens') and failing that a new 'terror threat' can be spun out of thin air and the public clamours for more dead ragheads or slopes or dagoes.


Can anyone give a non-retarded answer?
0 Replies
 
Joe Nation
 
  1  
Reply Tue 22 Mar, 2005 08:30 pm
Have you a clue about how your nation is regarded by the rest of the world? Have you considered the difference of the significance between the actions of a sovereign, democratic country and those of a bureaucratic organization comprised of more than 100 nations? What is your honest appraisal of the opinions of the rest of the world? And if your first inclination is not to say "What the hell do I care what they think?" you may be on the road to recovery from the effects of the America hegemony.

Joe(You looking at me?)Nation
0 Replies
 
georgeob1
 
  1  
Reply Tue 22 Mar, 2005 08:49 pm
Walter earlier made a good point in that, while the UN sets policy and provides general guidance for the operations of peacekeeping forces, it is the officials of the countries providing those forces that are responsible for the maintenance of discipline. Primary responsibility for the punishment of transgressions rests with both the country whose military forces are involved and with the country in which the the transgression happened. Generally the presence of UN peacekeepers also accompanys a situation in which the judicial and police processes in the country they are assisting are not functional. As a result the primary responsibility rests with the nation whose soldiers or personnel committed the crimes in question. Laying all the blame on the UN is quite unfair.

The historical practice of the UN has been that members of the Security Council do not normally provide peacekeeping forces. There have been a few exceptions, but this has been the general rule.

Many developing nations actively seek peacekeeping roles because this provides a substantial financial offset for the cost of maintaining their military forces - in effect they "rent" their military personnel, generally for more money than it actually costs them to maintain the forces.

The United States accepts the jurisdiction of host nations over its military forces there, subject to the bilateral agreements generally worked out for them. However we resist situations in which our forces might become subject to the jurisdiction of the International Criminal Court, an entity we do not recognize.

The problem of the lack of discipline of the military forces generally belongs to the country providing them. Lapses in discipline and criminal behavior occurs at some level in all military organizations, however the gross violations that have been reported in these situations are a reflection of the poor state of political and organizational development of many of the member states of the UN. This is an important point to recognize and should give serious pause to anyone who looks to the UN as a form of international government.
0 Replies
 
 

Related Topics

Obama '08? - Discussion by sozobe
Let's get rid of the Electoral College - Discussion by Robert Gentel
McCain's VP: - Discussion by Cycloptichorn
Food Stamp Turkeys - Discussion by H2O MAN
The 2008 Democrat Convention - Discussion by Lash
McCain is blowing his election chances. - Discussion by McGentrix
Snowdon is a dummy - Discussion by cicerone imposter
TEA PARTY TO AMERICA: NOW WHAT?! - Discussion by farmerman
 
  1. Forums
  2. » Where's the outrage!
Copyright © 2024 MadLab, LLC :: Terms of Service :: Privacy Policy :: Page generated in 0.18 seconds on 12/03/2024 at 09:28:27