farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Fri 23 Jun, 2006 06:39 am
Quote:
I don't think that is true and even if it is the students might prefer such an outcome to being marginalised at home and in their community. City people might not experience such social marginalisation due to the superficiality of urban relationships and will thus be able to corner all the best jobs in the scientific world.

Another of spendis ill informed opinions outgassing from a lower orifice
0 Replies
 
spendius
 
  1  
Reply Fri 23 Jun, 2006 06:42 am
You don't accept what I said as a fair point do you not?

I wonder why. At least I don't have the obviously useless habit of simply making assertions.

Could you explain why the point I made has no relevance to the debate rather than just pulling your tongue out and going "Mruuuuh" like little girls do which is all your post adds up to.
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Fri 23 Jun, 2006 06:47 am
OK, gobshite--people who provide employment requiring genuine scientific credentials are not concerned with the superficiality of urban relationships as alleged by dipsomaniacs who spend the most part of their conscious day slurping up cheap booze in the local. They rely upon the evidence of scientific knowledge provided by a degree in the relevant field from an accredited institution--an accredited institution is not one which sells pints to self-important, blathering irrelevancies.

Once again, Spendi has found another thread to clog with his contrarian drivel.
0 Replies
 
spendius
 
  1  
Reply Fri 23 Jun, 2006 06:55 am
You are making a fool of yourself Setanta.

If you won't explain we will all draw our own conclusions.
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Fri 23 Jun, 2006 06:58 am
You are the one making a fool of himself. I explained quite plainly that obtaining a job in a scientific field requires genuine credentials. I have no doubt that you will draw your own conclusions, without the least relevance to the topic at hand, and culminating by a reference to the idiot from Hibbing, Minnesota who makes so many millions selling meaningless drivel of the kind you love to lap up to those so credulous that they rely upon such sources for wisdom.
0 Replies
 
spendius
 
  1  
Reply Fri 23 Jun, 2006 07:04 am
Bluster to try to cover up. Have you not even worked out yet that it has no effect on me.

Here's the point again with the "think" and the "might" being offered simply to open up possibilities you refuse to deal with.

Quote:
I don't think that is true and even if it is the students might prefer such an outcome to being marginalised at home and in their community. City people might not experience such social marginalisation due to the superficiality of urban relationships and will thus be able to corner all the best jobs in the scientific world.


And this one-

Quote:
Wachholz didn't say that all the students laid their heads down. He did generalise.
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Fri 23 Jun, 2006 07:08 am
No bluster at all--you are willfully ignoring, or, more likely, ignorant of the qualifiers which i used myself, which did not assert outright that scientific ignorance would be an outcome, only that it might be, and that if it were, the students whose education had been infered with in that manner would be at a disadvantage.

Once again, Spendi has found another thread to clog with his contrarian drivel.
0 Replies
 
spendius
 
  1  
Reply Fri 23 Jun, 2006 07:13 am
Setanta wrote-

Quote:
This is sad for the students themselves.




There are no qualifiers in that and it is the key to what followed.

Who are you to say Kansas students are sad simply in order to erect a dramatic theory of your own on the strength of it.
0 Replies
 
timberlandko
 
  1  
Reply Fri 23 Jun, 2006 07:14 am
spendius wrote:
At least I don't have the obviously useless habit of simply making assertions.


I'll grant you that, at least partially - you certainly don't make your assertions simply. I would say though, that in your case the converse of your present practice well might seem to the readers a more useful habit for you to acquire.
0 Replies
 
farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Fri 23 Jun, 2006 07:16 am
spendi, without so much as a smile said
Quote:
At least I don't have the obviously useless habit of simply making assertions.


Man, you are in a dream world since that is ALL you do.
No I dont accept it as a fair point because you are revealing how little you know about the way the schools are set up in US. They are local with local tax structures, They follow state guidelines but often loosely (hence the games with ID and school board fraud etc). Most of the better secondary schools are actually in highly taxed suburbs wherein faculties are "scouted" and offered slary bumpups based upon the teachers perceived qulity. In our area we have a cschool district called "Castle Rock" wherein many teachers earn easily over 100K. They are hired as teachers and the school district prides itself on its scholastic achievement . The people pay out the nose, the area is populated by people who buy "tract mansions" and when their larvae are graduated, they move out, thus opening the spot for another scholar. "Magnet schools" are also popular in the Philly suburbs, In these schools, each campus is a specialty provider. Some school;s are math and science, others are arts and others are more widely cultural. The kids must show aptitude and be able to ACE the PASatts tests (these are like our SATs where the schools take the 95 and highre percentile students). Where the Magnet school fail, they dont recogn ize that many of the lower scoring kids are actually high aptiude kids but with learning disabilities like ADD.

Your oversimplifiction is based on not knowing nor understanding about our schools systems and how we work it . Now, every state is different . In MAine, they have mostly rural schools because outside of southern MAine, its mostly woods. So there are lots of private academies with magnet school specialties like science or art. In the main, most urban schools nationwide are a mess, loaded with incomptetence and corruption.
0 Replies
 
spendius
 
  1  
Reply Fri 23 Jun, 2006 07:17 am
Setanta insists on repeating-

Quote:
Once again, Spendi has found another thread to clog with his contrarian drivel.


Explain why I am singled out for this.

Are you seeking to close down all opposition and leave the site free for your own unhindered views?
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Fri 23 Jun, 2006 07:17 am
I did not assert that the students are, were or will be sad themselves. Just that such a situation is a sad situation for the students to be in. You can't even cobble your drivel together based on what i've written, you are obliged to willfully misrepresent what i've written.
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Fri 23 Jun, 2006 07:20 am
Once again, Spendi is intent on clogging yet another thread with his contrarian drivel. He does not come here armed with any knowledge of the subject, which explains why he makes ludicrous comments about the superficiality of urban relationships as though it were a valid consideration in the issue of scientific employment. He only comes here to disagree, and is not bothered by the painfully obvious invincible ignorance with which he approaches the topic. Even the religionists arguing here are better informed on the topic than is Spendi.
0 Replies
 
timberlandko
 
  1  
Reply Fri 23 Jun, 2006 07:26 am
spendius wrote:
Setanta insists on repeating-

Quote:
Once again, Spendi has found another thread to clog with his contrarian drivel.


Explain why I am singled out for this.

Are you seeking to close down all opposition and leave the site free for your own unhindered views?

I submit, spendi, you bring focus upon yourself. No one is seeking to hinder the expression of opposing point of view, its merely that no one finds value in your manner of unhinged rambling.
0 Replies
 
spendius
 
  1  
Reply Fri 23 Jun, 2006 07:32 am
fm wrote-

Quote:
Now, every state is different .


Right. So what does Setanta know about Kansas schools and communities.

He's simply trying to lay his city views on them and I'm sticking up for them. If the situation was reversed I'd stick up for his side.

Why am I "clogging up the thread" and not you lot?.

Setanta wrote-

Quote:
This is sad for the students themselves.


I don't accept your attempts to weasel out of that. It is a complete sentence. It is untrue. I would ask the students about that rather than just assume it. There is no proof offered for it and there is no garuantee that none of those students will eventually become scientifically inclined.It is just a statement which has been invented by Setanta from which to develop his post from. It is contrarian to its core. It is intemperate and bigoted and facile.As facts.Not as assertions.
0 Replies
 
spendius
 
  1  
Reply Fri 23 Jun, 2006 07:33 am
See you later fellow threaders. I gotta go so spray on.
0 Replies
 
rosborne979
 
  1  
Reply Fri 23 Jun, 2006 07:41 am
Setanta wrote:
Once again, Spendi is intent on clogging yet another thread with his contrarian drivel. He does not come here armed with any knowledge of the subject, which explains why he makes ludicrous comments about the superficiality of urban relationships as though it were a valid consideration in the issue of scientific employment. He only comes here to disagree, and is not bothered by the painfully obvious invincible ignorance with which he approaches the topic. Even the religionists arguing here are better informed on the topic than is Spendi.


It really gives me sympathy for those teachers who are experiencing exactly the same "clogging" of their science classes.
0 Replies
 
farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Fri 23 Jun, 2006 07:51 am
ros, Im sure spendi misses the elegant truth youve presented so elegantly.but spendi does say
Quote:
He's simply trying to lay his city views on them and I'm sticking up for them. If the situation was reversed I'd stick up for his side.

Why am I "clogging up the thread" and not you lot?.


It has to do with making sense. Being a contrarian (like you are) requires no thought since you go into an "autorefute mode" with almost every post. That, to me, defines clogging. Then, to icing it a bit, you offer nothing but a snide remark that you (alone I may add) find "witty".
0 Replies
 
rosborne979
 
  1  
Reply Fri 23 Jun, 2006 08:04 am
farmerman wrote:
ros, Im sure spendi misses the elegant truth youve presented so elegantly.but spendi does say
Quote:
He's simply trying to lay his city views on them and I'm sticking up for them. If the situation was reversed I'd stick up for his side.

Why am I "clogging up the thread" and not you lot?.


It has to do with making sense. Being a contrarian (like you are) requires no thought since you go into an "autorefute mode" with almost every post. That, to me, defines clogging. Then, to icing it a bit, you offer nothing but a snide remark that you (alone I may add) find "witty".


Imagine a classroom with Spendi and Rex in it. If the teacher were required to address each of their comments, as RL suggests, science education for the entire class would come to a grinding halt.

A2K of course is a chat board, with a bunch of adults seemingly wrangling for the pure pleasure of it. Every now and then, scraps of real knowledge slip into the mess, but at least this is a voluntary forum. School science classes deserve better.
0 Replies
 
RexRed
 
  1  
Reply Fri 23 Jun, 2006 08:09 am
Setanta wrote:
The article quoted by Pauligirl wrote:
The path has been a rougher one for John Wachholz, a biology teacher at Salina (Kansas) High School Central. When evolution comes up, students tune out: "They'll put their heads on their desks and pretend they don't hear a word you say."


This is sad for the students themselves. They will effectively marginalize themselves in all matters concerning science education. A theory of evolution and the pursuit of its implications had profoundly altered and enriched the understanding of not simply biology but of chemistry, geology and geophysics, bacteriology and medical biology and chemistry--either these students will be unable to effectively pursue science in higher education, or they will be obliged to work very hard to catch up if their higher education requires and understanding of the contemporary state of scientific knowledge.

The eventual result will be that employment in science in the United States will go to those students who have worked hard and paid attention, despite politically-motivated disruptions, or to foreign students who were not hampered in their science education. If this problem continues, and worsens, the effect radical religionists will have had on their children and many other children who don't deserve the handicap will have been to incidentally give an advantage to students who will compete with them in higher education and in the job market.


Sad but very true. Whenever a counterfeit is accepted for the truth there is a price to pay. This should indicate that God (radical religion vs spiritual truth) does impact life in a visible way.
0 Replies
 
 

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