Evolution? How?

Your use of mitochondria and chromosomes is an embarrassing (at least, embarrassing to anyone not talkint out his @ss) example of apples to oranges. We expect no less of you Rex.

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Setanta wrote:

Your use of mitochondria and chromosomes is an embarrassing (at least, embarrassing to anyone not talkint out his @ss) example of apples to oranges. We expect no less of you Rex.

DNA are within the mitochondria. So what is the rub? I used those words correctly. Talk about straw horses.

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Quote:

Where is your evidence that evolution made matter

“It's too bad that stupidity isn't painful” (Anton LaVey.)

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megamanXplosion wrote:

Quote:
Where is your evidence that evolution made matter

“It's too bad that stupidity isn't painful” (Anton LaVey.)

Mr 12:10
And have ye not read this scripture; The stone which the builders rejected is become the head of the corner: (Jesus Christ)

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RexRed wrote:

Setanta wrote:
Your use of mitochondria and chromosomes is an embarrassing (at least, embarrassing to anyone not talkint out his @ss) example of apples to oranges. We expect no less of you Rex.

DNA are within the mitochondria. So what is the rub? I used those words correctly. Talk about straw horses.

You really are hilarious--the expression is strawman, not straw horse.

The mitochondria are bodies within the cell which convert organic chemicals into energy by means of oxidative phosphorylation. Chromosomes, however, are "macromolecules" into which DNA is built within the cell. This is like comparing the engine of a car (mitochondria) to the steel from which the parts of the automobile are manufactured. You really don't get it, and every time you post, you just demonstrate it further.

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cicerone imposter wrote:

There is no "mind of god." Only the imganiation and mind of man that has created god.

And what is your proof of this statement?

Just because people get crazy ideas in their minds (such as yours) does not make it right.

God is neither self ego nor low self image...

You seem to have a low self "image". So you impose this on others. Go figure.

Are you perfect inside or imperfect? What is your proof?

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wandeljw wrote:

real life,

Your example of the 14 year-old girl asking mild questions about evolution is denying the reality of what is actually going on. Incidents reported by science teachers all over the country involve blatant interruption of classes by hostile students mouthing creationist propaganda.

Hi wandeljw,

Well, as you know, one man's information is another man's 'propaganda'. And if they are 'mouthing' it , then that's obviously much worse than simply talking about it, isn't it? Laughing

Seriously , if a student is beyond the bounds of proper classroom behavior then disciplinary action should follow whether the discussion was evolution , George Washington, trigonometry, or metal shop.

However, we discussed previously the seminars for science teachers that focused on 'What are the main tenets of the evolutionary theory?' and 'Why is evolution important to scientific understanding?'

It sounds to me as if the teachers are not well versed in their field and are often frustrated when their lack of preparation and knowledge causes them embarrassment.

If evolution is such a well founded and easily provable theory, then a well prepared teacher should be able to blow the student out of the water.

The fact that this isn't happening, and that seminars are convened on basic foundational evolutionary nuts and bolts, indicates to me that the fault may often be with the teacher's level of knowledge or competence.

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Setanta wrote:

RexRed wrote:
Setanta wrote:
Your use of mitochondria and chromosomes is an embarrassing (at least, embarrassing to anyone not talkint out his @ss) example of apples to oranges. We expect no less of you Rex.

DNA are within the mitochondria. So what is the rub? I used those words correctly. Talk about straw horses.

You really are hilarious--the expression is strawman, not straw horse.

The mitochondria are bodies within the cell which convert organic chemicals into energy by means of oxidative phosphorylation. Chromosomes, however, are "macromolecules" into which DNA is built within the cell. This is like comparing the engine of a car (mitochondria) to the steel from which the parts of the automobile are manufactured. You really don't get it, and every time you post, you just demonstrate it further.

I have a working knowledge of mitochondria thank you very much...

I am not closed to learning more but I am sure off the top of my head I could ALSO teach you things about cells that you do not know...

So if you want to split hairs on mitochondria then what is the real purpose?

STRAW MAN...

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The real purpose is to show that you just babble on, spouting nonsense which you thinks looks intelligent because of the words you use--when, in fact, your use of terms such as mitochondria and chromosome as you have used them only serve to demonstrate that you don't know what you're talking about.

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rex

Quote:

Every day we observe evolution. Somewhere some place on the earth something is acquiring a new immunity. We are all made of a jumble of numbers in our DNA. The probability that these numbers do not obtain diversity are so high that evolution is an ongoing process in every species and kind of living creature. DNA is like a house of cards that is constantly being re-shuffled. Evolution is mutation and morphism and we observe this in life every day. The ties between species become broken over time and they no longer are compatable with older models of DNA. Tribes of organisms mutate away from each other by isolation. This we have observed also with microscopic organisms that are made of the exact things that our DNA are made of. We can observe these mutations in the mitochondria and the chromosomes that go back into our DNA past.

CAn I hAVE YOUR PERMISSION TO USE THIS POST?
rl, if the science teacher being asked those questions couldnt answer and then discern the source of the questions, I wouldnt say that the teache shouldnt be teaching. I would say that the teacher needs some remeidal instruction to become adequately prepared for the agenda driven questions.

HAs anyone seen evolution? yes of course. We provide references and then ask the kid to read and report back. The Creationists strongly count on the fact that its easy to confuse someone untrained in a subjsect. A teachers job is to provide the training.

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farmerman wrote:

rex
Quote:
Every day we observe evolution. Somewhere some place on the earth something is acquiring a new immunity. We are all made of a jumble of numbers in our DNA. The probability that these numbers do not obtain diversity are so high that evolution is an ongoing process in every species and kind of living creature. DNA is like a house of cards that is constantly being re-shuffled. Evolution is mutation and morphism and we observe this in life every day. The ties between species become broken over time and they no longer are compatable with older models of DNA. Tribes of organisms mutate away from each other by isolation. This we have observed also with microscopic organisms that are made of the exact things that our DNA are made of. We can observe these mutations in the mitochondria and the chromosomes that go back into our DNA past.
CAn I hAVE YOUR PERMISSION TO USE THIS POST?
rl, if the science teacher being asked those questions couldnt answer and then discern the source of the questions, I wouldnt say that the teache shouldnt be teaching. I would say that the teacher needs some remeidal instruction to become adequately prepared for the agenda driven questions.

HAs anyone seen evolution? yes of course. We provide references and then ask the kid to read and report back. The Creationists strongly count on the fact that its easy to confuse someone untrained in a subjsect. A teachers job is to provide the training.

'Discern the source'?

'Agenda driven questions'?

Sounds like a real bunker mentality. Are America's teachers really that timid or paranoid?

Shouldn't the teacher just know his subject, and then it matters not the 'source' of the question?

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rl

Quote:

'Isn't most evidence for evolution circumstantial?'

Most all evidence is circumstantial. You try to deflate the meaning of circumstantial and put it in the same barrel that Creationists have reserved for "theory"

Circumstantial evidence includes a Killers fingerprints on the murder weapon.
Or the possession of the stolen goods lifted in a robbery. Its strong evidence. THE key word is EVIDENCE. Science doesnt rely upon legends or myths or bullshit like "the appearance of age". If it cant be tested and shown to be robust, its dumped into the dustbin where it belongs.

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The MRSA bug that is plaguing UK hospitals is an example of evolution and it exists, they have evolved to survive antibiotics which once worked, go figure...

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rl

Quote:

Discern the source'?

'Agenda driven questions'?

Sounds like a real bunker mentality. Are America's teachers really that timid or paranoid?

Shouldn't the teacher just know his subject, and then it matters not the 'source' of the question?

Please do not play dumb with me. You know damn well that the Creationist bloc loads kids up with bogus questions to disrupt classwork whenever evo.devo is taught. The plan of the Highland Baptist Church "teens for Biblical SCience" is to Load up with those types of questions (probably from the Convention HQ) , The teachers are selected out by their failures in debate skills to answer loaded question. .Theres not a "bunker " mentality, there is , instead a mobil attack strategy by the Creationist fraud groups.
As a result, Once in a while a non teacher professional is asked to help out as a proctor in a class or a "guest" lecturer and the kids are taken on because they dont really have any follow ups beyond one or two of the scripted queries. Dont think that youve just made up those questions and dont think that the groups like NCSE arent aware that another strategy is "if we cant have Creationism and ID taught, well disrupt the hell out of the classes" Dont try to yell unfair when it is clearly the Creationist activist groups who are the thugs

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rl's recent tack confirms the urgent, critical necessity of rigorous, standards-based scientific education in accordance with the accepted tenets of science and of science alone, not just in secondary and pre-secondary classrooms, but also, and most emphatically in post-secondary institutions, particularly as regards preparing and adequately grounding those who will undertake to educate the youth of tomorrow. Indeed it is unacceptable a licensed, accreditted educator might be inadequate to the task of correcting misimpressions, dispelling superstition, debunking pseudoscience, and instilling legitimate critical thinking skills. When, only when, and not untill our educators are as matter-of-course given the skills and tools to combat effectively and decisively the pernicious, luddite, religionist agenda of the ID-iot crowd may we hope to put an end to their duplicitous, ignorance-and-superstition-based campaign to inflict their beliefs on society as a whole. Maintaining focus on the the issues of exposing, discrediting, and ending the ID-iots' crusade is vitally important. The upshot is that the ID-iots, despite, or perhaps even thanks to, their single-minded persistence and energy, consistently manage, by their transparent dishonesty, to provide their foes the means by which to defeat them.

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OK then, let's assume that EVERY kid in EVERY science class is fresh from a creationist 'propaganda' meeting the night before.

My question still is:

Isn't a college educated, professional science teacher supposed to be prepared to teach his subject?

These seminars for teachers ('What are the basic tenets of evolution?' 'Why is evolution important?') are held by the National Science Teachers Association not for occasional substitute or part time stand-ins or proctors. The seminars are for professionally certified career science teachers.

Let's not kid ourselves. The teachers are supposed to know their subject.

--------------------------------------------

Creationists are 'thugs' ?

The teachers are 'selected out' by their failure in debate skills..... ??

I can't believe you said that.

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And the kids can be brainwashed on creationism/ID early in life to grow up just like you!

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While not all ID-iots are thugs, their movement frequently, even typically, is pressed in thuggish manner; fear, uncertainty, doubt, ignorance, superstition, and intimidation are the only tools they have.

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BDV wrote:

The MRSA bug that is plaguing UK hospitals is an example of evolution and it exists, they have evolved to survive antibiotics which once worked, go figure...

The MRSA bacteria is still a bacteria, is it not?

Evolution, it seems in this case, is in the eye of the beholder.

Since the bacteria started and ended a bacteria, why is it assumed that 'evolution' has taken place, rather than an expression of genetic variance which was ALREADY present?

If I am a 98 pound weakling and I have a kid that looks like Schwarzenegger, has evolution taken place?

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RexRed wrote:

megamanXplosion wrote:
Quote:
Where is your evidence that evolution made matter

“It's too bad that stupidity isn't painful” (Anton LaVey.)

Mr 12:10
And have ye not read this scripture; The stone which the builders rejected is become the head of the corner: (Jesus Christ)

Jesus is the personification of the Sun. The Egyptians noticed how the Sun would stop budging over slightly on December 22nd to the 24th (farthest away from the northern hemisphere.) On December 25 the Sun started budging in the opposite direction (spring was on its way.) Because these were the shortest and coldest days of the year they linked the 22nd with the death of the Sun of God and that it was resurrected on the 25th. The constellation virgo became visible at this time so Virgo was linked to being the virgin mother of the Sun of God. The twelve disciples of Jesus were personifications of the twelve constellations. The twelve constellations were arranged in a circular diagram to create the twelve months of the year and the Sun of God was in the center of the diagram. The circular diagram was divided with a cross to represent the seasons. Thus, when winter season was ending the Sun of God was "dying" on the cross (of the diagram.) Through misinterpretation, mistranslation, or rampant imagination the Sun of God eventually became the Son of God. That God's name was Amen-Ra. (The "Eye of Horus" on the reverse side of a dollar bill is symbolic of how Amen-Ra is supposed to watch over the people.) That is just a glimpse into the beginning of the tradition of Christians going to church on Sun-Day and ended their prayers with "Amen."

First you wonder how evolution created matter. I could not help but laugh. Then you try justifying your opposition to evolution (and your ignorance of it) with an astrology-inspired work of fiction. Again, I cannot help but laugh. You need to try harder than that Rex.

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