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Why there is 'C'(English learner troubles)?

 
 
Reply Sat 16 Sep, 2017 01:46 pm
I am living in a country in which English is taught as a second language in school. I have finished my university having a great hope of finding a scholarship here or there. However, when starting my search it appears that you have to have an English language proficiency test results to be able to get any. I have started my preparation a few days ago. What shocks me is that dictation is so important aspect and it has a great focus in all tests parts.
And here the story begins. In English, spelling is mostly arbitrary, there are no solid roles depending on which you can feel confident to spell correctly. for example why 'different' is correct while 'defferent' and 'diffirent' and .... are wrong? why 'beautiful' is written like that? and the most annoying part why is there a letter 'C' the (most problematic one in the language)? this letter which occurs in so many words sometimes pronounced as 'K' and others as 'S'. And no way to guess if it is 'C' or 'S', 'C' or 'K'. when googling the problem i have found that this letter has a long history and that it had a use in the past. but why not to get rid of it. The only role it plays is making you trapped amidst the uncertainty whenever you come to a word that has its sound should it be written like 'C' or 'S' or....?
You may view my way of thinking as a kind of craziness, but I am really tired and depressed. I am looking forward to hearing a good explanation, support or objections.
 
fresco
 
  6  
Reply Sat 16 Sep, 2017 02:23 pm
@iamtooconfused,
The spelling of a word in English often reflects the fact that modern 'English' developed from a combination of Latinate and Scandinavian roots according to the colonization history of the British Isles by invaders. From a similar rule in French (Norman invasion), generally speaking c followed by e or i is 'soft' (/s/) and hard (/k/) at other times.
Standardizations and simplifications do gradually occur as a result of social pressure and are opposed by traditionalists who value historical linkages. ESL learners may indeed grumble about spelling, but they csnnot complain about the relatively simple grammar of English which I suggest more than makes up for it.
roger
 
  1  
Reply Sat 16 Sep, 2017 04:11 pm
@fresco,
Excellent.
fresco
 
  1  
Reply Sun 17 Sep, 2017 12:24 am
@roger,
Appreciated.
0 Replies
 
gungasnake
 
  -3  
Reply Sun 17 Sep, 2017 05:24 am
@iamtooconfused,
The English spelling system is a sick joke.
0 Replies
 
gungasnake
 
  -2  
Reply Sun 17 Sep, 2017 05:29 am
@iamtooconfused,
One possible solution:

http://bearfabrique.org/EnglishAlphabet/English_Alphabet.htm
0 Replies
 
jespah
 
  3  
Reply Sun 17 Sep, 2017 10:14 am
@fresco,
The letter C before a Y is also generally a soft C (it sounds like an S).
cycle
infancy

etc.
fresco
 
  2  
Reply Sun 17 Sep, 2017 11:10 am
@jespah,
Ah yes 'i' is 'ee', and y is 'ee-grek' in French.
0 Replies
 
chai2
 
  2  
Reply Sun 17 Sep, 2017 11:48 am
I've always wondered why in French so many words end in letters that are not pronounced.

English is hardly alone in confusing spelling "rules"

InfraBlue
 
  1  
Reply Sun 17 Sep, 2017 06:02 pm
@iamtooconfused,
One thing that makes 'c' problematic is that there was a shift in the pronunciation of Latin some time in the early Middle Ages.

'C' represented the hard sound /k/, and 's' represented the soft sound /s/. A shift from /k/ to /s/ before the sounds /e/ and /i/ lead to the pronunciation of, for example, the name Caesar from /kaesar/ ( much like the German word "kaiser," which derives from the name Caesar) to /sizər/ in English, and /sesar/ in Spanish. Other shifts resulted in pronunciations such as /sh/ in words like "ocean."
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Sun 17 Sep, 2017 09:45 pm
@chai2,
The terminal letter (and sometimes letters) are not pronounced in French. What is called the "schwa" in German, a barely pronounced "eh" sound, or a completely silent vowel in unstressed syllables, doesn't exist in French. So, letters are added to the ends of words to give what might be called a correct pronunciation, but which are not pronounced themselves. For example, chat means cat, and is pronounced "shah." The "t" is silent. The word chatte means pussy (in both the innocuous meaning as well as the salacious meaning). The extra "t" with an "e" after it means that the "t" is pronounced, and pronounced forcefully. The "te" added to the word chat creates a hard "t." The French don't pronounce consonants forcefully as is the case in Germanic languages, incluing English. Therefore, you put a silent "e" on the end of a word so that the last consonant will be pronounced, and you double the consonant if it is to be a hard, or explosive consonant. As with all languages, there are exceptions, and many of them. By and large, though, there is a logic to the spelling of French words, and it has to do with the pronunciation of the word.

It also has to do with gender. All adjectives must agree in gender and number with the nouns being modified. So homme parasseux means a lazy man (and the "x" is not, of course, pronounced, so it's pah-rah-soo--approximately, there is no English equivalent to the French pronunciation of "eu"). But femme parasseuse means a lazy woman. In that case, it is pronounced pah-rah-sooze (approximately). As awkward as that seems, children learn their languages by usage, long before they learn to read, and develop the logic of the language without formal instruction. How words are pronounced will tell the listener the gender and number of the noun being modified, even if they have never heard it before.

I have always been entertained by French, which I learned to read long before I learned to speak it. The differences and similarities between French and English taught me a great deal about English. In English, we have other fish to fry--the French have d'autres chats a fouetter (other cats to flog).

If you've actually read this far, I suspect you're not as amused as I.
chai2
 
  1  
Reply Sun 17 Sep, 2017 09:55 pm
@Setanta,
Actually other cats to flog made me smile.

Hard to to catch a chat. I know. All I have to do is open the drawer where the Advantage pipettes are kept, and they are gone baby, gone.
0 Replies
 
izzythepush
 
  1  
Reply Mon 18 Sep, 2017 01:16 am
At the moment schools are judged on GCSE passes from A*-C. Getting rid of C would mean schools would be judged on passes from A*-D, a real drop in standards and quite frankly completely unacceptable, back in my day, bleeding disgrace, you couldn't make it up, political correctness gone mad, they don't make 'em like they used to etc. etc.
fresco
 
  1  
Reply Mon 18 Sep, 2017 03:00 am
@izzythepush,
Sorry Izzy, GCSE has just gone back to a number system.
But nice post anyway ! Smile
izzythepush
 
  1  
Reply Mon 18 Sep, 2017 07:57 am
@fresco,
Not the retakes........yet.
0 Replies
 
centrox
 
  1  
Reply Wed 20 Sep, 2017 11:32 am
@Setanta,
Setanta wrote:
Therefore, you put a silent "e" on the end of a word so that the last consonant will be pronounced

I once saw an article about Hergé in Le Monde which mentioned that the English pronounce Tintin "Tine-tine".
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Wed 20 Sep, 2017 12:12 pm
@centrox,
Well, they don't pronounce it correctly, I suspect, but wouldn't they pronounce it "tihn-tihn?"
centrox
 
  1  
Reply Wed 20 Sep, 2017 12:49 pm
@Setanta,
Setanta wrote:
Well, they don't pronounce it correctly, I suspect, but wouldn't they pronounce it "tihn-tihn?"

The English think that each syllable of "Tintin" is identical to the word "tin" (the metal).
chai2
 
  1  
Reply Wed 20 Sep, 2017 02:32 pm
@centrox,


0 Replies
 
 

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