I just voted...

hamburger and i were talking about this last night. trying to figure out what was up with the lines, and peculiar registration process in the u.s.

our system in Canada is very similar to the one nimh's described. i don't think i've ever waited 5 minutes to vote - there are usually about 10 - 20 voting booths at each poll station - and they're everywhere.

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nimh wrote:

Ticomaya wrote:
Can't say I know the exact answer, but I think the fact that the population of your country is roughly that of New York City's might have something to do with some of the differences.

Well, yeah, I'm sure that plays a role in some stuff.

But waiting in line for hours, for example? Isnt that a question of just making sure there are enough precincts to vote at? If there's a problem there, it seems mostly one of sufficiently funding & manning your electoral process?

And a uniform national ballot? The larger your country's population, the more efficient (cost-wise, too) it would be to have one, right?

I had this conversation with A. once, and one crucial cultural difference (OK, chasm) turned out to be central registration. Every Dutch citizen can automatically be sent his voting card because every Dutch citizen registers his address with the city. You move, you notify the city. Its obliged. If you're not registered with the city, you cant get a passport, drivers licence, rent subsidy, sofi (tax) number (which you need to get a job) - or voting card; thats the fundament of the system. I understood from A. that the very notion of everyone being centrally registered by address is absolutely scandalous to Americans. Cant really understand why, though.

I'm not defending our processes, but also remember we have 50+ states, and everywhere you vote there are tons of state races going on, county races, not to mention local referendums and issues, in addition to the 1 national vote. Elections are properly regulated at the State level.

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nimh:

Our evergrowing vitriolic political process has created our voting mess. The fact that we are the most powerful nation on the planet pretty much equates to much higher stakes than any other country or civilization on the planet, as our corporations drive both our domestic and foreign policies.

If we abided more by your system, the neocons would cry "socialism" and "communism," because many of them are that stupid to actually make such baseless anologies.

Fortunately for me, I live in one of the most progressive communities in our country, and got to enjoy a painless walk three doors down to my local voting place.

People are waiting in long lines because for the first time in MANY years, at least since 1968, there is so much at stake, as our nation is more polarized than ever. Plus, with the advent of corporate media and neoconservative ownership of these monopolies, the ability for GOP operatives to manipulate the masses and create their own distorted reality is truly stunning.

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Ticomaya wrote:

... Elections are properly regulated at the State level.

Absolutely. Far too many variables from state to state and even from county to county - there really can't be uniform ballots. As for uniform voting methods (touch screen, whatever), that depends on local budgets.

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nimh wrote:

Why do you have to register first in order to vote, in the first place, in America? Why don't all citizens just automatically get their voter card? I dont know of any other country where citizens first have to register separately in order to vote.

I'm not exactly sure, but I would guess that it has something to do with the way we administer elections here. There is only one type of ID for every American citizen (the Social Security card), and that is administered by a federal agency. Voting, however, is administered by state bureaucracies, which don't have access to the Social Security information, so there would have to be a separate registration (we don't require people to register their addresses with the local authorities, as is the case in many European countries).

nimh wrote:

Why are there such long lines? People waiting for 1,5, 2 hours, that's prepostorous!

In the last Dutch election, nimh, how many different votes did you cast? In a typical parliamentary election, a voter casts one or maybe two votes (in the UK, one vote for MP; in Germany, one vote for a regional electoral list and another for an individual candidate). In the US, we consolidate our elections, so we don't just vote for president on Nov. 2, we vote for a wide range of candidates and issues. In my case, for instance, I voted for president, senator, congressman, state legislator, three water commissioners (?), county clerk, county recorder of deeds (??), and about fifty judges. Other voters might also cast votes for ballot initiatives, local referenda, and other statewide or local offices. I cast roughly 60 separate votes; it took me approximately five minutes to complete my ballot, and I think I did it pretty fast. Now, multiply that by hundreds of voters, and you can begin to understand why people wait in lines.

nimh wrote:

Why all the different kinds of ballots? I know you combine different elections, but couldn't you make one separate, nationally uniform presidential ballot?

Every state has different ballots because every state has different elections.

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Quote:

Every state has different ballots because every state has different elections

.

Which made election 2000 such a glaring issue, as state's rights were circumvented by the USSC. The Federal Government and hte USSC in 2000 effectively nulled and voided the whole concept of state's rights for the sole purpose of placing a GOP candidate in the White House.

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Dookiestix wrote:

Quote:
Every state has different ballots because every state has different elections
.

Which made election 2000 such a glaring issue, as state's rights were circumvented by the USSC. The Federal Government and hte USSC in 2000 effectively nulled and voided the whole concept of state's rights for the sole purpose of placing a GOP candidate in the White House.

*yawn*

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Joe's point is well taken. There is an additional problem, as well. Bond issues. I voted on twelve separate bond issues and tax levies, in addition to the national executive, Congress, State Senate and House, numerous judges, the county commissioners, the Sherriff, the Clerk of the Courts, State Supreme Court judges, and a "defense of marriage" amendment to the state constitution. Until quite recently, many ballot initiatives and proposed amendments were intentionally worded in such a manner as to make the vote desired by the proponents, one voted "no" rather than yes--poling had shown that a reliable majority of baffled voters simply marked "no" on any proposition.

Now, due to an attempt to sneak slot machines at race tracks past Ohio voters, the ballots are required to read "Vote for the proposition" or "Vote against the proposition."

I voted for national executive and legislative candidates; state legislative representatives, state Supreme Court justices; state Appeals Court justices; county judges; municipal judges; state bond issues and tax levies; county bond issues and tax levies; municipal bond issues and levies; a municipal smoking ban proposition; a special tax levy for the city zoo; and one scurrilous attempt to amend the state constitution.

This ain't no disco, this ain't no party, we don't be foolin' aroun' . . .

I've just heard the Ohio Secretary of State on television stating that this is the highest voter turn-out in the history of the state. Maybe, Habibi, in addition to the complexity of the process, the long waits in line reflect that people feel that there is much at stake . . .

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In my small district there were 5 polling booths and 3 were empty when I walked in. There were only two offices with more than one option: president and the represtentative to the general court. The only republican on my ballot was Bush. God I love cambridge.

We did have 2 questions to vote on.

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At least part of my confusion, and possibly that of some others, arises from the fact that my government (and previous governments) don't make us vote on anything. We vote 4-5 yearly for our MPs in parliament, for MEPs in the European Parliament, and for councillors on the county/city/district councils. And that's it. No votes on tax levies, smoking bans, police chiefs, amendments to this and that. We vote for representatives and they do all the rest of the voting on our behalf. It makes the electoral process much simpler, but maybe we are just being taken for mugs?

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There's more than one way to skin a cat . . . and there's more than one way to take a mug . . .

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Evenin' Boss. Again I fail to understand your humour, but I've got used to it after all this time.

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Well, in rural NH, I walked in and announced my name - three of the five checkers didn't know me - was handed my paper ballot, and went to an open booth. I made my choices, handed my ballot to a man who put it in the big, ol' wooden box, and I walked out after supporting the fire department's turkey raffle, the 8th grade's class trip fund-raiser, and the after school A+ program by buying some brownies. Maybe ten minutes total....

I love it here!

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Polls in VA opened at 6 am and when johnboy marched in at 6:15 there were 6 people ahead of him at the check-in table for people whose last names began with A-D and no one in the lines for the rest of the alphabet. Odd, johnboy thought, this isn't WVA where everyone has the same last name. Are A-D's more politically active or more likely to be early risers.
We don't have to sign anything but we now (since 2002, I believe) have to show an I.D. A lady apparently didn't have an I.D. (a middle aged black lady in a Repub precinct) but there didn't seem to be a problem. She moved to another table, filled out a form, and went into the voting booth ahead of me. There didn't seem to be any friction; the voter and the poll-worker were talking and laughing. Anyway, johnboy was #43 of the A-D's to vote in a precinct that only has about 1200 voters and the touch-screen machine was simple to use.
One of my employees voted in a different jurisdiction. There, upon check-in, he was given a 3x5" card with a number on the back (in his case #243) and his name on the front. He went to the next table where #243 was punched into a machine and a small piece of paper spitted out with a number on it; a random number he was told (say 1159). When he got into the voting booth he first had to enter that number and then vote.
We tried to figure out what that was all about in terms of preserving some sort of "paper" trail while preserving the secrecy of the ballot.
About 10 am there was a wide-spread power outage caused, not by some sort of conspiracy, but by a tree limb that came down. It didn't affect the polling machines we heard on the radio.

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Hey bermits, my sister went up to canvas in Londonderry today.

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I won't ask for whom....

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I'll tell ya anyway - Kerry. We're from MA after all.

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Everyone warned me not to wait until after work to vote. That the lines would be awful, nowhere to park, etc. etc. I figured I'd bring a magazine (and an umbrella) and wait it out.

I had no problems at all. I brought my voter registration card. No picture ID required. The place was swarming with people - there were about sixty partitioned touch screens. I didn't have to wait at all. Had to vote on about a hundred different races (no joke) plus three propositions.

I just voted...

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