bin Laden Endorses Kerry

Soz-- How do the American people affect foreign policy?

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Quote:

I'm sure everyone would work especially hard to get things ready and have the transition go smoothly.

Soz- I certainly would hope so. I think that the next few weeks or months will be very dangerous ones for us in the US.
I am not too optimistic because of the rancor that has occurred during this election.

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eh?

The actions that America takes, no matter who is at the helm.

As has been said already, the main audience for this was not the American electorate, but the Muslim world. There's a power vaccuum, OBL is fairly popular, he took a much more statesmanlike tone, more calm and less rhetorical flourishes, more governmental surroundings rather than the outdoorsy gun-toting man on the run. The digs at Bush work in this context, too -- lots of people in the Muslim world hate Bush.

He's trying to lay a claim to influencing the election, and is leaving the door open so he can make that claim no matter who wins.

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Phoenix, I would certainly hope so, too.

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sozobe wrote:

Right. And his conclusion as to how America can avoid another attack? It doesn't matter who is at the helm -- what matters is what actions America takes in the Middle East. ("Toying" or "playing" with their security.)

States don't take actions in the Middle East. America as a whole does.

How does America as a whole affect foreign policy?
If you reject my opinion that OBL is trying to influence the vote, then what is he saying Americans should do?

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Americans should stay out of the Middle East and stop supporting Israel.

Neither Bush or Kerry is promising that.

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OH and I TOTALLY think he's trying to influence the vote -- he is ESPECIALLY trying to say after the fact, "See, I influenced the vote!" Prime motivation.

Just, it doesn't actually matter if it's Bush or Kerry.

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OBL is indeed saying what soz said.

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Today, he complains about Israel.

In his Letter to America in 2002, he says his number one goal is to convert Americans to Islam. #2 goal? Stop us from all our debauchery, formication, gambling...

And, don't be fooled. THAT IS his goal.

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Soz is right- OBL is setting himself up for a win-win situation that will solidify his power in the Muslim world. I agree with those who say that his message is as much for Muslims as for Americans.

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Lash- Sure, he complains about Israel. Israel is a sty in the eye of a person who would turn the world back to the ninth century. In the middle of all this primitiveness, there sits a country that is a model of westernization, and therefore a threat to his allover plan.

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Considering polling in Muslim countries, he has 99% support in Jordan, high nineties in Indonesia, incredibly high among Arab states... What, he's going for two Muslims in a shack outside Baquba?

I hear you, but it was directed at us a couple of days before an election. To imagine the timing of this rare tape wasn't calculated to affect the election--since it is all about the election--is just 'head in the sand' to me. No offense intended.

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Answer: Americans affect foreign policy BY VOTING!

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"In conclusion, I tell you in truth, that your security is not in the hands of Kerry, nor Bush, nor al-Qaida. No.

Your security is in your own hands. And every state that doesn't play with our security has automatically guaranteed its own security"

In the context of these two paragraphs I stand by my assertion that OBL is warning Pakistan and Israel not Rhode Island.

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I refer you back to This Post, Panzade, specifically the following:

Quote:

... "Your security is not in the hands of Kerry or Bush or Al-Qa'ida. Your security is in your own hands, and any U.S. state that does not toy with our security automatically guarantees its own security."

* Yigal Carmon is the President of MEMRI.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[1] Al-Jazeera (Qatar), October 27, 2004.

[2] "Wilaya" refers specifically to a U.S. state; it would never refer to an independent country. The term for such a country is "Dawla."

[3] https://www.qal3ati.com/vb/showthread.php?t=115812

[4] To illustrate this principle, he uses Sweden as a model of a country that was never attacked by Al-Qa'ida.

[5] See MEMRI Special Dispatch No. 695, April 15, 2004, "Osama Bin Laden Speech Offers Peace Treaty with Europe, Says Al-Qa'ida 'Will Persist in Fighting' the U.S." http://memri.org/bin/articles.cgi?Page=archives&Area=sd&ID=SP69504

[6] www.islahi.net/vboard/showthread.php?t=116432

bin Laden specifically used the word "wilaya", which translates most closely to "province", "territory", or "state" in the sense of federal state, it is a word which denotes a subdivision within a nation or entity as opposed to an individual geopolitical subdivision-encompassing entity, not the word "dawla", which translates to "nation".

Now, of course my allusion to a bin Laden endorsement of Kerry was a bit hyperbolic; it was intended to stir discussion, and it certainly has. IMO, the fact remains, bin Laden would prefer "Anybody but Bush".

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timberlandko wrote:

IMO, the fact remains, bin Laden would prefer "Anybody but Bush".

We've been over this already. Rolling Eyes

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cavfancier wrote:

I suppose the conservatives now feel that if they vote for Kerry, Osama has won. Good job Osama. I guess nobody thought about the fact that having Bush in for another term actually benefits Bin Laden politically.

I stick to my opinion as well Timber. Bush will benefit Osama. This smells like a smokescreen to me. Bin Laden is smart enough to know that riling folks up to vote Kerry will bring out more Bush voters. Please...this is pretty typical political spin. Given that Osama's extended family are friendly with the Bush folks, don't you kinda think this looks a little funny?

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Lash, do you have any figures for those polling stats? The Arab scholar I saw on the Newshour said something like, "unfortunately, if you took a poll tomorrow in [the Mideast, forget what terminology he used], OBL's popularity will have gone up by 50%." This indicates to me that his popularity is not already that high. (99% and such.)

Will look around.

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Thanks for the post Timber...I guess I don't get it...if Bush and Kerry can't have any effect on the security of the US and we're basically a two party system...then it follows(in my mind) that OBL wants us to vote green or whatever else....and therefore(to get back to the thread) his statement is not a pitch for Kerry.

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I looked for it. Not in print, that I can find. But, I heard it on the news yesterday.

Jordan 99% support for OBL
other countries in the high 90's.

Maybe it will pop up today. I'll look periodically.

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bin Laden Endorses Kerry

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