Kerry's Words Used by Enemy Against Tortured US POWs

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When John Kerry appeared before the U. S. Senate Foreign Relations Committee in the spring of 1971, his testimony sent shock waves throughout America and the world. Here was a young, articulate Ivy-Leaguer, a highly decorated Naval officer who had seen combat in Vietnam. Now, driven by conscience and lofty ideals, Lt. Kerry said he felt compelled to break his silence and tell the unvarnished truth about the Vietnam War and those who fought it. The war, he said, was a criminal endeavor driven by a "policy of atrocities." The 2.5 million men who served in Vietnam were akin to "Genghis Khan's barbaric hordes," thugs and psychopathic war criminals who wantonly plundered the Vietnam countryside, murdering, raping and bombing hundreds of thousands of innocent civilians - old men, women and children -- each and every day.

Lt. Kerry's widely televised statements were dramatic and persuasive, made all the more credible by the fact he had been there, said he had witnessed many of these same atrocities. His testimony catapulted him to international prominence and the ranks of leadership in the American anti-war movement, launching his once failing political career. It also permanently branded in the American psyche the image of Vietnam veterans as murderous "baby killers" and "drugged out losers," a perception that persists today, one deeply embedded in our history.

That single act earned for Kerry the lasting enmity of Vietnam veterans, especially those who had borne the brunt of his accusations, that small percentage of soldiers, sailors, marines and airmen who actually served on the frontlines. Many of these combat veterans would carry the scars of their service for life. Kerry's repudiation of their sacrifice represented yet another war wound, one that would never heal. As compelling as Kerry's Senate testimony was, these men knew it was lacking in one key element truth. They knew from their own combat experiences virtually all his allegations were lies; the U.S. military would never countenance such brutality. And, they also knew his actions were a deliberate betrayal of all of them, especially the more than 58,000 who lost their lives in the Vietnam War.

But, perhaps, more than any living group of combat veterans, it was the America 's POWs who suffered most, forced to endure the immediate consequences of Kerry's treacherous falsehoods. In 1971, some 700 of these men were reported as captured or missing in action, most presumed held prisoner by the North Vietnamese Communists in such places as the notorious Hanoi Hilton. Already subjected to years of torture, solitary confinement and unspeakable psychological and physical abuse, their lives were literally hanging by a thread when Kerry issued his damning testimony. In mere moments, Kerry had willingly given the Vietnamese Communists what they had spent years of torture and blood-letting to drag out of their American hostages, an unqualified "confession" they were all war criminals.

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For the production of the Stolen Honor documentary, interviews were conducted with 17 Vietnam POWs whose time in prison amounted to 109 years and three months. These distinguished, highly decorated individuals share their experiences and perspective in this compelling program.

1. Name: Kenneth W. Cordier
Hometown: Canton , OH
POW time: 6 yrs, 3 mos, 1 day
Awards:

* Two Silver Stars
Defense Superior Service medal
Legion of Merit
Distinguished Flying Cross
Bronze Star
Purple Heart

2. Name: George E. "Bud" Day
Hometown: Sioux City, Iowa
POW time: 5 yrs, 7 mos, 13 days
Entered 1967- Discharge 1973
Awards:

Medal of Honor
Air Force Cross
Distinguished Service Medal
Silver Star
Legion of Merit
Distinguished Flying Cross

3. Name: Jack H. Fellowes
Hometown: Virginia Beach, VA
POW time: 6 years, 6 months, 6 days
Awards:

Silver Star
Two Legions of Merit
Distinguished Flying Cross
Three Bronze Stars
Five Air Medals
Two Purple Hearts

4. Name: Ralph E. Gaither
Hometown: Miami, FL
POW time: 7 years, 3 months, 23 days
Entered 1962 - Discharge 1986
Awards:

Two Silver Stars
Two Legions of Merit
Distinguished Flying Cross
Four Bronze Stars
Six Air Medals
Two Purple Hearts

5. Name: Paul E. Galanti
Hometown: Lodi, NJ
POW time: 6 years, 7 months, 24 days
Awards:

Silver Star
Two Legions of Merit
Bronze Star
Nine Air Medals
Two Purple Hearts

6. Name: Carlyle S. "Smitty" Harris
Hometown: Tupelo , MS
POW time: 7 years, 10 months, 8 days
Awards:

Two Silver Stars
Three Legions of Merit
Distinguished Flying Award
Two Bronze Stars
Two Air Medals
Two Purple Hearts

7. Name: Gordon A. "Swede" Larson
POW time: 5 years, 10 months
Hometown: San Antonio, TX
Awards:

Silver Star
Legion of Merit
Four Distinguished Flying Crosses
Bronze Star
Purple Heart
Distinguished Service Medal

6. Name: Kevin McManus
Hometown: Oakton , VA
POW time: 5 yrs, 8 mos, 4 days
Awards:

Silver Star
Legion of Merit
Bronze Star
Distinguished Flying Cross
Air Medal
Purple Heart

7. Name: Thomas M. McNish
Hometown: Franklin, NC
POW time: 6 yrs, 6 mos
Awards:

Three Silver Stars
Legion of Merit
Distinguished Flying Cross
Three Bronze Stars
Two Purple Hearts
Three Meritorious Service Medals

8. Name: Thomas S. Pyle
Hometown: Wilmington, DE
POW time: 6 yrs, 6 mos 26 days
Awards:

Two Silver Stars
Three Bronze Stars
Two Purple Hearts
Legion of Merit
Air Medal
Meritorious Service Medal

9. Name: Robinson Risner
Hometown: Tulsa, Ok
POW time: 7 years, 4 months, 27 days
Awards:

Two Air Force Cross
Distinguished Service Medal
Two Silver Stars
Three Distinguished Flying Crosses
Bronze Star
Eight Air Medals

10. Name: Robert H. Shumaker
Hometown: New Wilmington, PA
POW time: 8 yrs, 1 day
Awards:

Distinguished Service Medal
Two Silver Stars
Four Legions of Merit
Distinguished Flying Cross
Bronze Star
Two Purple Hearts

11. Name: Thomas J. Sterling
Hometown: Fort Walton Beach, FL
POW time: 5 yrs, 10 mos 15 days
Awards:

Silver Star
Legion of Merit
Distinguished Flying Cross
Bronze Star
Two Purple Hearts
Two Air Medals

12. Name: Leo K. Thorsness
Hometown: Walnut Grove, MN
POW time: 5 years, 19 days
Awards:

Medal of Honor
Silver Star
Six Distinguished Flying Crosses
Ten Air Medals
Two Purple Hearts
Good Conduct Medal

13. Name: Jack L. Van Loan
Hometown: Corvalis , OR
POW time: 5 years, 9 months, 15 days
Awards:

Silver Star
Legion of Merit
Distinguished Flying Cross
Bronze Star
Meritorious Service Medal
Purple Heart

14. Name: James H. Warner
Hometown: Ypisalanti, MI
POW time: 5 years, 5 months, 1 day
Awards:

Silver Star
Legion of Merit
Two Bronze Stars
Two Purple Hearts
Eleven Air Medals
Navy Commendation Medal

15. Name: Ronald J. Webb
Hometown: Gary, IN
POW time: 5 years, 8 months, 22 days
Awards:

Two Silver Stars
Defense Superior Service Medal
Two Legions of Merit
Distinguished Flying Cross
Two Bronze Stars
Two Purple Hearts

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YAWN

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I agree with PKB.

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AID AND COMFORT TO THE ENEMY?

We have to go back to the Vietnam for a bit here. We have to go back because it looks like John Kerry has been caught in yet another lie .. and this one may be quite serious.

Here's the story:

In 1970 John Kerry went to visit the communist delegation to the Vietnamese peace talks. Then he went to visit them again. The congress of the United States was not informed of these visits until almost a year later. By the way, Kerry was a Navy Reserve Officer at the time. Finally ... then the leftist media found out the truth about Kerry's trips, they failed to correct their own stories on the subject.

You've probably heard some of this before, but it was presented to you in such a way as to make Kerry's visit and the motivations behind the visit seem entirely benign.

The charges that Kerry traveled to Paris to commiserate with the Communists first surfaced in the Swift Boat Veteran's television ad campaign. The Swiftees said that Kerry traveled to Paris to "secretly" meet with the enemy. The New York Times and the Washington Post quickly jumped to Kerry's defense ... saying that he informed the congress immediately of his visit. Later these newspapers found out that Kerry's visit was in 1970, not '71, and that he didn't tell the congress until almost a year later. That makes the meeting a secret indeed.

The media also reported that Kerry was actually on his vacation in Paris at the time, so the trip was not made for the explicit purpose of meeting with the communists. That turns out to be false also. His honeymoon was in the Caribbean. It seems that he did, indeed, travel to Paris just to meet with communists ... to meet with the communists negotiating with the United States for a settlement to the Vietnam war.

Wait! There's more! There was another Kerry trip to meet with the communists, this one in 1971! And according to Joshua Muravchik in The Weekly Standard, a third trip was planned.

Perhaps you've heard somewhere along the way that when Kerry went to Parris he actually met with both sides, not just the communists. That would certainly put him in better light, wouldn't it? You probably got that from The New York Times.

The Times was quite upset that the Swiftees said that Kerry had gone to Paris to meet with the enemy. Not so, said the Times. Kerry actually testified that he met with "both sides." Well .. the Times then found out that by "both sides" Kerry meant that he had visited with both communist delegations to the peace talks. In fact, "both delegations" was the phrase Kerry used in describing his visit. The next week the Times ran a small correction saying that it had "misidentified" the parties Kerry went to visit.

America was at war. We were at war against the communist enemy in Vietnam. Tens of thousands of Americans soldiers were dying. John Kerry, while still a reserve officer in the U.S. Navy, makes several trips abroad to visit with the enemy. That's right, the enemy. He waits almost a year before he bothers to inform the congress of his visit. He then makes a second trip, and is planning a third that was cancelled. The media is giving him a pass. They're giving him a pass because they know that if Kerry's actions are highlighted for the voters it would cost him votes.

link

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Snore...

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Quote:

Snore...

The left is real interested in Bush's boring National Guard records, but not at all concerned that their boy Kerry commiserated with the enemy during wartime. Interesting ....

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Tico, have a look around this forum and see how many threads are about Bush's national guard records.

One other thing. Just because someone is to not far right, does not make them part of 'the left'.

There's just no factual evidence to show that prisoners of war were somehow worse off because Kerry testified to something that was true.

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You mean other than POW's saying they were worse off because Kerry testified?

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Harmed, over and above the torture they were already going through?

Again, Kerry testified to the truth. Who's to blame for the plight of the POWs -- the politicians who made the mistake of sending them there, or the guy who has the balls to say that the politicians made a mistake in sending him there?

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Well stated, FreeDuck.

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FreeDuck wrote:

Harmed, over and above the torture they were already going through?

Again, Kerry testified to the truth. Who's to blame for the plight of the POWs -- the politicians who made the mistake of sending them there, or the guy who has the balls to say that the politicians made a mistake in sending him there?

No, he testified to what he was told to be the truth. That's what some of this fuss is about. Many feel the Kerry out and out lied.

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But his claims have been proven. Atrocities were committed.

http://www.factcheck.org/article244.html

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FreeDuck wrote:

Tico, have a look around this forum and see how many threads are about Bush's national guard records.

One other thing. Just because someone is to not far right, does not make them part of 'the left'.

There's just no factual evidence to show that prisoners of war were somehow worse off because Kerry testified to something that was true.

FreeDuck, my reference to the National Guard records was a general observation, while my reference to "the left" was certainly intended to include you. I suppose my labeling you as "left" or "liberal" if you in fact aren't might annoy you -- I know it certainly would annoy me. Perhaps you could straighten me out by clarifying this for me?

For my future reference, do you consider yourself a democrat? Are you a liberal? Are you left of center? What I've seen you post so far would tend to put you in most, if not all of those categories.

You choose not to believe the many veterans who have come back and told the stories of being presented with the fact that Kerry testified before Congress and accused the American soldiers of committing war crimes, and having that fact used against them as evidence that they had committed war crimes, and taking torture as a result? You choose not to believe those veterans?

No, you just want to explain it away and say "testified to the truth." Yet Kerry himself (or at least his handlers) are quick to point out that Kerry wasn't speaking about his own personal observations. He was only passing on information that had been told to him by others. Kerry made a choice to tell the world he thought American troops were war criminals, and he consciously decided to do that while we were still at war. Whether he spoke the truth or not (and I don't think he did) is immaterial. What is important is the effect that his words had on the men who had been captured on the battlefields of Vietnam, and had to endure torture because of his decision to denigrate the American soldier.

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I consider it far worse that Bush does not tell the truth about Iraq while our troops ARE dying everyday over there.

FAR more egregious.

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Dookiestix wrote:

I consider it far worse that Bush does not tell the truth about Iraq while our troops ARE dying everyday over there.

FAR more egregious.

You think Bush lied about Iraq because he passed on information he felt was true, but turned out not to be? Why shouldn't I think Kerry lied when he testified to the Senate because he passed on information he thought was true, but wasn't?

Bush's actions were taken to defend America. Kerry's were taken to tear it down.

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Quote:

No, he testified to what he was told to be the truth. That's what some of this fuss is about. Many feel the Kerry out and out lied.

That's a rather contradictive statement, McGentrix. And do you really think that Kerry is a thing vs. an actual person?

Laughing

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That breaks down, Ticomaya -- FreeDuck's link shows that Kerry passed on information that WAS true.

Quote:

Kerry's critics point to that as evidence that he was irresponsibly passing on false atrocity stories. However, there's no question that events such as Kerry described did happen, as Lewy himself stated:

Lewy: Incidents similar to some of those described at the VVAW hearing undoubtedly did occur. We know that hamlets were destroyed, prisoners tortured, and corpses mutilated.

Some atrocities by US forces have been documented beyond question. Kerry's 1971 testimony came less than one month after Army Lt. William Calley had been convicted in a highly publicized military trial of the murder of the murder of 22 Vietnamese civilians at My Lai hamlet on March 16 1968, when upwards of 300 unarmed men, women and children were killed by the inexperienced soldiers of the Americal Division's Charley Company.

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Ticomaya wrote:

FreeDuck, my reference to the National Guard records was a general observation, while my reference to "the left" was certainly intended to include you. I suppose my labeling you as "left" or "liberal" if you in fact aren't might annoy you -- I know it certainly would annoy me. Perhaps you could straighten me out by clarifying this for me?

For my future reference, do you consider yourself a democrat? Are you a liberal? Are you left of center? What I've seen you post so far would tend to put you in most, if not all of those categories.

It doesn't annoy me as I will be voting with the 'left' this year. It amuses me that you are so transparent in your desire to quickly label and write off people whose opinions differ from yours.

If you want to know the answer to your questions -- and for more than just me -- you could have a look here: http://www.able2know.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=16622

I am not a Democrat as I've never registered under any political party. I believe I would be considered an independent. Perhaps now you would answer the same questions about yourself? Are you a neo-conservative? A tighty-righty? Are you a little to the right of Newt Gingrich? Actually I don't care. I choose to evaluate what you say, not what you are.

Quote:

No, you just want to explain it away and say "testified to the truth." Yet Kerry himself (or at least his handlers) are quick to point out that Kerry wasn't speaking about his own personal observations. He was only passing on information that had been told to him by others. Kerry made a choice to tell the world he thought American troops were war criminals, and he consciously decided to do that while we were still at war. Whether he spoke the truth or not (and I don't think he did) is immaterial. What is important is the effect that his words had on the men who had been captured on the battlefields of Vietnam, and had to endure torture because of his decision to denigrate the American soldier.

I think it's assinine to believe that the POWs would not have been tortured if Kerry had not spoken. I stand by my opinion. It is better to speak the truth. I'm not saying all the vets are lying -- though it's been proven that some of them are. But here, 35 years later, it's time to get over Vietnam.

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sozobe wrote:

That breaks down, Ticomaya -- FreeDuck's link shows that Kerry passed on information that WAS true.

I'm sure "some" of those things happened. War is "hell" after all. But please make note of my main point:

Quote:

Whether he spoke the truth or not (and I don't think he did) is immaterial. What is important is the effect that his words had on the men who had been captured on the battlefields of Vietnam, and had to endure torture because of his decision to denigrate the American soldier.

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partisan crap. old partisan crap. old been discussed a thousand times already partisan crap. That's not your fault, but if you come late to the party, you might bring up things that have already been talked about ad nauseum. At this point, all we need are our Kerry or bush buttons.

Do we need any more threads about Kerry in the nam or bush not in the nam?

Let's talk about the real live important hapopening right now things like what's happened to the economy, healthcare, the job market, personal freedoms, stuff at home.

I'm sure we can find plenty of really important things to talk about.

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Kerry's Words Used by Enemy Against Tortured US POWs

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