Comfort level with your child's friends

(Jack is the same age as sozlet btw, but learned the "or I won't be your friend..." from the older girl that they both played with...)

I agree with your husband that the other girl could have bonked her on the head and kids sometimes do things like that. But it is true by the age of 5 this should not happen much. 5 year olds should have started to learn not to hit others. The first time something like that happened to my daughter I freaked out a bit. The kids were a little younger than 5 though, I think it was when they were about 3. I heard my daughter scream and I ran into the room where the kids were playing. There was a huge red mark on my daughter's forehead (she is also fair skinned) and the little boy had a bat in his hand. 5 minutes later they were playing fine together again.

I guess in reading this my only concern would be if it is true that your daughter got bonked, the mom at the house should have told you before you saw it. It does seem that the mom is hiding this a little. Maybe concerned that you will not let your daughter play over there any more. I think what I would do is invite the girl over your house or go over there when they are playing so you can supervise a little more until you at least feel comfortable about it. You could always instill a rule that in your house that the door always remains open. If the door is shut then the little girl has to go home. That is our house rule. Use whatever gives you a level of comfort

As far as the girl not talking to you and looking down, that is just a sign that she is probably shy around adults. My daughter is exactly like this and she plays very nice with other children. She only bonks her sister and cousin, but not any of her friends.

Hee hee... (Sorry, the last line was kinda funny...)

Thanks for your take, Linkat. If boomer weighs in, I think I will have heard from everyone I was hoping to. (Jane was at our house btw, the bonking didn't happen at Jane's house.)

It is funny sozobe, but oh so true!

I've actually typed several responses into this thread only to delete them because they just seemed all over the map. So, I'll just dive in....

I think the reason I'm having a hard time is because I worry that Mo can be a bit of a bully. He's big for his age, and strong, and sturdy, sometimes he has problems controlling his temper.

I hope I don't sound like I'm bad-mouthing Mo.

I'm always really honest with the other neighborhood moms. They know Mo deals with some unusual circumstances and when we are dealing with the more extreme behaviors I just don't let the other kids come over to play (our house is where the kids all congregate).

Once in a while Mo will do something to make one of the smaller kids cry but he always, and I mean always, tells me the truth about what happened - even when he knows he is in the wrong.

So the secretive thing with Jane bothers me a lot.

My gut would be telling me that there is something wrong here, just like your gut is.

Like so many other's have said here I would insist on an open door policy and keep a very close eye on Jane.

Does Jane make eye contact with her own parents?

Boomerang--

Not to worry about bad mouthing Little Mo. My younger son was the Terror of the 103rd Street sandbox. Little girls would smile....Dos would smile...little girls would come closer and Dos would bash 'em with his shovel. The ones he really liked, he bit.

I survived.

Thank you, Noddy.

My little terror is not in the mood for a rainy day, and just did some sort of a flip on the couch as we were sitting there reading, kicking me in the nose hard, which led me to rip off my glasses and clutch my nose (it HURT!), and she had the grace to apologize but I was spending too much time groaning and clutching my nose (it REALLY hurt!) and so she went back to her acrobatics, I had a sudden realization about my glasses, jumped up to try to find them, yep... she'd stomped all over them. Both lenses out of the frames.

So more yelling and more apologies (at some point I said "apologies are really really nice but I'd rather you didn't DO it in the first place!!"), I went upstairs to either put contacts in or wrestle the lenses back into the frames, took a while but I got 'em back in (whew), came downstairs and she had cut off the plastic packaging for a DVD from the library because she was "having a hard time opening it". ARGHHHHH!!!

Gymnastics class in 45 minutes, if I can last that long that will be a perfect outlet.

I agree with the uh-oh uneasy feelings - the lack of eye contact could be shyness - but the secrecy bit is disturbing and if it is ongoing then it isn't the Sozlet's normal open behaviour and could be because she is being bullied or manipulated.

bright children often enjoy the company of slightly older children

Incidentally she will soon get to that 'if you are her friend you can't be my friend' stage and you'll have all that fun to deal with!

Oy! ;-)

Anyway, thanks so much for your take, boomer, and Vivien too -- I think that's what I was going for beyond all else, whether I should just relax already or go ahead and give credence to my gut feeling. Seems like there are three possible courses of action, keep up the status quo (they can play in sozlet's room with door closed), let them keep playing but keep a closer eye on things, or just stop the girls from playing together at all. This all has helped clarify the issues and the course of action I want to take -- the middle one. Thanks.

(Gymnastics class helped.)

I would separate Sozlet being able to close her door when alone, from a neighbor child being able to do it or talk sozlet into doing it, in, ahem, your house. Given your understanding with sozlet, at some point you may want to empower her privacy by letting her close the door, perhaps with commensurate discussion down the line. I'd be aware that once the privilege is a given to her, it is a little hard to take back, say when she is fourteen.
So I wouldn't make it an absolute thing, but a right given that she doesn't give you cause to countermand it for certain conditions.. more of an adultish discussion. This, you know, is not my expertise.

I just know that so far my teen niece always leaves the door open a smidge when visiting me, and tends to come out of her room (the murphy bedroom!) either that night or, since I tend to sleep after midnight, the next day, to get my take on various situations. The same niece whose father, my exbroinlaw, has repeatedly removed the door from her room.

Not that I entirely blame him, she can be hell on wheels.
And I have the cush job of not being the parent figure...






You might enjoy that I used spellcheck this time, and it told me I should reconsider SOZLET and suggested SOZZLED.

Yeah, I do think it's all part of the same picture. I want her to feel that she has a right to privacy and a right to question authority, no matter who that authority may be. I certainly don't think anyone who has authority over her would do anything untoward, but who ever does?

Hee hee, just saw the spell check note.. :-D

At her age she needs to question Jane's authority--while accepting yours.

Friends have suggestions--parents have clout.

Sure.

Hmm, how to explain... Basically, it is about instilling critical thinking. I don't mind being questioned -- "I don't want to go to bed. It's not my usual bedtime. Why do I have to go to bed NOW?" My answer would be "Because we're getting up earlier than usual tomorrow", not "Because I say so." That's usually plenty for her. If it ISN'T, if the logic is out there but she's feeling ornery, then it gets into more strong-arm tactics. Luckily, doesn't happen very often. But my first line of approach is always giving her a reason for things.

Therefore you are teaching her that life has reasons--not simply "because I say so" authority.

Wow. Squinney and osso really spoke very closely for me in the 'empowering conversation'.

To merely plan to watch her keeps all the knowledge on the side of the mommy--and doesn't really teach the little one.

I would have a talk with sozlet about why it is against your rules to hit, and be hit. Talk to her about self-respect (in 5 year terms). Now is a great time to begin to teach an adult-in-progress about how to stick up for herself, and repel/handle people who would hurt her. (Will come in handy for any possible abuse later.)

The other child may be holding some cache in sozlet's eyes, that may cause her to put up with getting bopped once in a while. I would have felt better if she's said to you, "Yeah, Jane hit me, but she won't do it again"--or "I told her not to do it again."

It may not happen again--but some of these minor crisises (sp) are great teachable moments.

Seems to me she is doing both, giving reasons, to promote critical thinking, but also holding onto parental authority past that, with sozlet's growing understanding that this particular clout has reasons behind it.

Not applicable to this neighbor child.
Although it wouldn't hurt the neighbor child to be learning these lessons re potential abusers.. but this child seems to be into sneaky, or .. something.

Still....

I was thinking she (neighbor girl) may be shy with adults... This 'no eye contact thing', sometimes, I think, may be overanalyzed.

Still, the situ does bear an eye.

Yes, I agree it's hard to tell. I was the shyest five year old on earth, probably, and I can't remember if I looked down or not. I was probably twitchy in some way.