Comfort level with your child's friends

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This is kinda new for me. We just moved; in our old town, we'd known most of sozlet's friends from when they were all very little. She was getting to the stage where they'd go off and play together while the grown-ups talked, but that was after years of constantly keeping an eye on the kids while they were playing, and I knew the kids thoroughly.

There is a family next door here, a 5-and-a-half yr old girl (6 in March) and a 2-yr old boy. Sozlet and the 5-and-a-half yr old -- I'll call her um Jane -- like to play together. They always go running off. I haven't been able to really connect with Jane; she doesn't really make much eye contact, seems to want to get out of sight. When I check on them, she always looks at the floor and doesn't respond to general questions I'm asking.

The first time she came over to play, I asked sozlet what they did and she said, "that's just for me and Jane." She wouldn't answer questions. That's unusual but not the only time it's happened, sometimes she just wants to keep things private. That's fine.

The most recent time Jane came over to play, I went in to check on them and sozlet (who has fair skin that shows anything) had a red mark on her forehead. (Not blood, just impact mark/ bruise.) I said "did you bonk your head?", expecting that she just ran into the wall or something. And she said, too emphatically, "no, no, I didn't." On a hunch, I said, "did someone bonk you on the head?" And she said, again too fast and emphatically, "No." I gave her a mom look -- you know the one -- and she said "Well yes but it was some other kid. It wasn't Jane."

Jane was looking at the floor, no eye contact.

There wasn't any other kid around.

I just said, well, it's about time to go (it was) so why don't you guys clean up and then we'll walk Jane back to her house.

I talked to sozlet afterwards and she was steadfast in insisting Jane didn't do anything. We talked about how important it was to let me know if anyone does anything she doesn't like, ever. Etc.

The people who used to live here have a daughter who's about five -- I talked to the mom about kids in the neighborhood, and she said there aren't really many, and talked about some kids 4 houses down who are older. I asked about the next-door neighbors, and the mom said that they didn't really play together. She muttered something about maturity. I didn't really get it, but the neighbors have confirmed in a different context that the kids didn't play together (Jane and the 5-y-o who used to live here.)

I'm not sure how, if at all, to proceed. My husband says she probably bonked her on the head, big deal, that's what kids do. I agree with that. If it wasn't the next-door neighbor I'd probably feel better about just going ahead with it, seeing what happens, and then stopping things if it doesn't work out.

Am I over-thinking this? Should I talk more to the mom who used to live here? I'm not quite sure how, if so -- that conversation was when we happened to meet (old owners were visiting next-door neighbors on the other side.) This seems weird and awkward to talk about via email.

I do like Jane's parents, they seem really nice. Talk to the parents? How?

- Signed, New to this in Columbus

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I'd let it ride for now.....my kids have always had a myriad of different types of friends...some outgoing, some introverted, some sweet and polite, a couple of Eddie Haskells...a couple of genuine little asswipes.....as long as no ones getting any serious damage done to them...this is training ground for your child to learn to deal with different types of people later.....just make sure you demand a level of respect for yourself from all her friends hold them to the same level you hold your own child when they're around you....that's really all the influence you can exert over someone elses child.....

These pearls of wisdom form A2k's undisputed Ward Cleaver Rolling Eyes

:wink:

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I agree with what BPB said, however if there is a considerable difference in size and strength between the two, I would keep an eye on them when she comes over.

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I'd get to know Jane's parents as part of the "learning the neighborhood and making new friends" process of settling in. For openers, ask about neighborhood policy on trick or treating.

In the same spirit, I'd keep an eye on Jane--she's going to be part of the local landscape for awhile.

The deceit is a bit worrysome--but just a bit. The girls aren't of an age to rob banks--or even shoplift--and you know your daughter well enough to sense Real Trouble before it happens.

It takes a village....

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Well, what Bear said is true for this household, however if one appeared to be injuring my cub I'd change the play arrangements around. Decide to busy yourself cleaning up in sozlet's room when the friend is over and ask them to play in the family room or whatever room you would then have to walk through constantly for cleaning materials, vacuum, etc.

It's not that you don't trust sozlet, it's that this other child may have threatened if she told you. "That's between us" at 5 is not acceptable to me. Sounds like she was threatened in some way or knows she was doing something of which you would not approve. Doesn't mean it IS bad, just means for some reason she was made to feel it was.

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And, don't foreget to follow and trust your gut. That's the strongest Mommy Meter you have!

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I also tend to agree with BPB.

We've had similar experiences, especially with a little
boy who moved down 2 houses from us. He was quite shy and couldn't look me into the eyes either which I contributed actually to his shyness only. When playing with my daughter alone, he could be "Dennis the Menace" though, and they would argue and sometimes fight - a real power struggle. However, when I tried to intervene, neither one admitted
that there is anything wrong as both were afraid, I could forbid them to play together.

In time they learned how to cope with each other and
now, a few years later, they're still close.

We did have classmates over though, where the chemistry
just wasn't there with me, and lo and behold, my daughter soon felt the same way. Like mother, like daughter! Smile

I also would advise you to get to know the parents of Jane
and monitor their playtime more closely, but for now, I wouldn't read too much into it.

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Thanks, guys!

I know the parents better than the kids -- have spent more time with them while the kids are off playing. I do like them.

My daughter is not yet 4 by the way, so significant age difference.

The monitoring thing is one thing I'm having trouble with -- Jane is very emphatic about wanting to go off and play in private. She shuts the door. (OK, the door is shut when I check on them but don't know who shuts it -- not something sozlet usually does.) When I've offered activities, they just want to go off and play. (Jane does, sozlet agrees.) I'm deaf so can't monitor anything through a shut door.

Should I insist that the door stays open?

Do you guys make anything of the fact that former owners, with a girl closer in age to Jane, didn't have them play together?

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Oh missed you there squinney! Great advice, thanks.

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Not yet 4? Playing with a 5 1/2 year old that closes the door? Playing with a 5 1/2 year old that may have hurt her? Told her not to tell?

I wouldn't panic or become overly protective, but would certainly NOT allow the door to be closed (Sorry, I totally forgot you were deaf or would have addressed that before) Also, keep in mind that the parents may seem fine, but how many times do you find something out and go "Wow. They seemed so... normal."

Again, your gut is telling you something or you wouldn't be asking here. You are your daughters only protector at this age. She does not have the necessary skills to negotiate every possible scenario, so you have to be her guide. You are the one teaching her what is acceptable as far as how she is to allow others to treat her.

At that age, with a friend that I didn't care for and who was bossy, abusive and overpowering, I had a conversation with daughter cub that let her know she could say no. That she could say stop. That it was important for her to set her own bounderies and discussed what those bounderies might be. (Went something like "If Daddy hit Mommy would that be okay? If Daddy said mean things... If Mommy pulled Daddy's hair... If Mommy bit Daddy for not wanting to play the same game... etc. And, then asked if any of those things would be okay for her friends to do to her and what would she do if they did.)

Hope this helps. I'd just hate to see sozlet harmed and know there is a huge difference in development between those ages.

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Squinney makes good sense.

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I agree with the lovely wife about the door business.....that's part of showing your daughter what you expect and showing her friends the same thing....also when you hold her friends to the same accountability standards as you hold her she will be more likely as she becomes older to hold her friends to the standards she's been taught......that will help her avoid peer pressure later.....

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Quote:

At that age, with a friend that I didn't care for and who was bossy, abusive and overpowering, I had a conversation with daughter cub that let her know she could say no

squinney, I couldn't find any passage where sozobe metioned Jane was bossy, abusive and overpowering.
One can make a mountain out of a mole too. No offense. Wink

Sorry sozobe, I didn't know that you're deaf, and in this
case I would explain your rules to Jane, that in your house
doors remain open because of your hearing imbalance.

Kids at my house know what they're allowed to to and
what not - it's my house and the rules are mine. Whoever
doesn't obey by it, has a choice to leave.

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Reading along here, I am no expert, but felt my uh-oh meter sort of jump, especially re the door business, together with my sense that sozlet had coaching re what she should let you know.

Hmmmm.

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I'm with osso. The red light in my brain started blinking, too.

I'd have a talk with sozlet about the "that's for me and Jane only" stuff. No, that isn't normal for a 3-1/2 year old who's close to her mother like sozlet. I told my son years ago that anytime his friends didn't want me to know something, it probably means something's wrong. My son is 10-1/2 and has never closed the door when his friends come over.

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I understand that defining yourself as different from your parents is part of developing a self identity. Still....

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Oh yes, osso...but still.....

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Your accout of Jane is giving me the creeps, soz.

I agree with the lovely couple here, stick to your open door policy.

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CalamityJane wrote:

Quote:
At that age, with a friend that I didn't care for and who was bossy, abusive and overpowering, I had a conversation with daughter cub that let her know she could say no

squinney, I couldn't find any passage where sozobe metioned Jane was bossy, abusive and overpowering.
One can make a mountain out of a mole too. No offense.

Sorry sozobe, I didn't know that you're deaf, and in this
case I would explain your rules to Jane, that in your house
doors remain open because of your hearing imbalance.

Kids at my house know what they're allowed to to and
what not - it's my house and the rules are mine. Whoever
doesn't obey by it, has a choice to leave.

I agree with CJ (btw, welcome to a2k. :wink: ) (And Soz, didn't know you were deaf! Sorry to hear that- was it from birth, or should I mmob? Embarrassed

) I think having secrets can be normal behavior for some 5 year olds, but only ones who've been playing with older children a lot. Not normal for the younger crowd, not at all. But it does take a village to raise children, and you don't know who in the village has been raising "Jane" just yet, whether she's had good experiences from life or bad ones (her behavior leads me to believe not all have been so positive... Idea

) I would let her come over, let her play w/sozlet, but watch them. You may be the one who makes a difference in her life, for all you know...

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No need to myob! I lost my hearing between the ages of 13 and 18 -- fluctuated all over the dang place, then leveled off at profoundly deaf. I'm off the charts -- most audiograms have 100 db as the bottom (loudest sound they test for), I have about a 120 db loss (something has to be 120 decibels before I can hear it.)

I've talked to sozlet a lot about privacy, especially in terms of her right to it. She has said before about a phone conversation with her old best friend that is was just for the two of them, that's fine. That came up in a presentation given by her new preschool too, that when parents grill their kids when they come home about what happened that day and the kids aren't as forthcoming with details as the parents would like, that sometimes the kids want to take ownership of the preschool experience, it's THEIR time. And that's OK.

So I don't object to that as a concept.

But yeah, squinney (and others) have nailed it in terms of why I even opened this thread, and the title -- I'm plain not comfortable with the status quo, and am trying to figure out whether to give that gut feeling credence or not.

I spoke to sozlet last night about open doors, and she agreed readily. It's not an absolute solution, as her room is upstairs and I don't really have much reason to be up there. Guess I'll be cleaning a lot. :-D But more likely I will just make sure they ARE in my line of sight.

Sozlet had a friend who was exactly the same age as Jane in our old town, and they got along really well. She does play well with older kids for whatever reason. The first time we all went out to do something (the kids and the moms went out for lunch) Jane's mom asked when sozlet's birthday was, I told her, and she said so she'll be 5 right, and I said no she'll be 4, and her jaw dropped to the floor. She couldn't believe sozlet was still 3. That happens pretty often. (The mom thought if she wasn't turning 5 she might be turning 6.)

In terms of the whole secrecy and influence thing, I reminded sozlet of an incident I described here:

http://www.able2know.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=540533#540533

Which ended well:

http://www.able2know.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=541957#541957

(Never updated that they did bring chocolate chip cookies, and Jack gave her a big card that said "I'm sorry", and gave her a big hug and a big kiss, and they are still fast friends.)

So I reminded her that it was important to tell a grown-up and why, and she said "yes I KNOW".

Anyway, thanks so much for the feedback and perspective, I'm gonna go the "watch them!" route. My mention of the moms-and-kids lunch makes me think maybe I'll suggest that for the next get-together. (Everyone, out doing something where Jane can't corral sozlet...)

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Comfort level with your child's friends

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