192
   

monitoring Trump and relevant contemporary events

 
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  4  
Sun 21 Apr, 2019 11:42 am
Giuliani Says There Is ‘Nothing Wrong With Taking Information From Russians’
Quote:
PALM BEACH, Fla. — President Trump’s personal lawyer, Rudolph W. Giuliani, insisted on Sunday that it was acceptable for a political campaign to use hacked information about its opponent obtained from a foreign adversary — though he personally would have advised against it.

“There’s nothing wrong with taking information from Russians,” Mr. Giuliani said on CNN’s “State of the Union,” adding that he would have argued against using it, “out of excess of caution.”

“It depends on where it came from,” he said, adding on NBC’s “Meet the Press” that a political campaign’s decision to use stolen information from foreign adversaries “depends on the stolen material.”

Mr. Giuliani’s assertion, which built on similar previous remarks that he had later backed away from, was offered partly as a rebuttal to questioning about a meeting at Trump Tower in 2016 in which Trump campaign aides met with Russians offering dirt on Hillary Clinton. It also underscored another aspect of the special counsel’s report, released last week by the Justice Department, that the president has largely avoided addressing: that Russia secretly influenced the 2016 presidential election.
... ... ...
georgeob1
 
  -3  
Sun 21 Apr, 2019 12:02 pm
@Walter Hinteler,
What is your point here, Walter? Are you suggesting that there is something wrong with dealing with or taking information from Russians?

I suspect Giuliani is well aware that the so-called "dossier" purchased and financed by Hillary Clinton's campaign was itself based on "information " from Russians and almost certainly known to the Russian intelligence services.

Your Country, Germany, is also very supportive of Russian economic, and perhaps political, interests, and is also quite unwilling to meet its own military obligations to its NATO allies. Perhaps you should reflect on your evident hypocrisy.
Walter Hinteler
 
  3  
Sun 21 Apr, 2019 12:07 pm
@georgeob1,
georgeob1 wrote:
Your Country, Germany is also very supportive of Russian economic, and perhaps political, interests, and is also quite unwilling to meet its own military obligations to its NATO allies. Perhaps you should reflect on your evident hypocrisy.
I didn
't notice that this was the topic here.
However, I agree with your above.

I don't think that only because I'm a German it's a hypocrisy when I post a New York Times report.
But perhaps I'm too narrow minded here, too.
georgeob1
 
  -1  
Sun 21 Apr, 2019 12:10 pm
@Walter Hinteler,
I asked you to explain your intended point when posting the article. That, not the fact that you posted it, is the issue here.

I was surprised and disappointed at your apparent failure to consider the obvious contradictions in what was implied.
Walter Hinteler
 
  2  
Sun 21 Apr, 2019 12:17 pm
@georgeob1,
georgeob1 wrote:

I asked you to explain your intended point when posting the article. That, not the fact that you posted it, is the issue here.
The intended point is/was the topic of this thread ...
Quote:
https://i.imgur.com/PbQTgsP.jpg

... and this led to my above post.

I might have misunderstood the thread's title.
georgeob1
 
  0  
Sun 21 Apr, 2019 12:25 pm
@Walter Hinteler,
Walter Hinteler wrote:

The intended point is/was the topic of this thread …


I believe that is an evasion: the Topic of this thread is not itself a motivation for a particular post. However it is conceivable you were merely helping us all stay abreast of the current reporting in the New York Times.

I'll accept that and write the rest off off to my Irish temper.
0 Replies
 
izzythepush
 
  3  
Sun 21 Apr, 2019 12:43 pm
Quote:
Ukrainian comedian Volodymyr Zelensky has won a run-off election to become the country's next president by a landslide, exit polls suggest.

The polls give him more than 70% support. He dominated the first round of voting three weeks ago when 39 candidates were on the ticket.

Mr Zelensky challenged incumbent president Petro Poroshenko.

Mr Poroshenko has admitted defeat but told supporters gathered in Kiev that he will not leave politics.

"I will never let you down," Mr Zelensky told supporters on Sunday.

He added: "While I am not formally president yet, as a citizen of Ukraine I can tell all post-Soviet countries: 'Look at us! Everything is possible!'"

If polls are correct, he will be elected for a five-year term.

Ukraine's president holds significant powers over the security, defence and foreign policy of the country.

Ukraine's choice was between an experienced politician with five years as president on his CV and a comedian wielding little more than a blank sheet of paper. That so many people have opted for Volodymyr Zelensky is a humiliation for Petro Poroshenko.

Thirty-seven candidates were removed from the ballot paper from the first round and yet the president only picked up about 9% more votes this time. Mr Zelensky gained almost 45 percent.

This feels like a massive protest vote and for now Mr Zelensky and his campaign team are celebrating.

It's hard to see the feeling lasting long. The hard work will come when they have to start fleshing out what are at the moment vague policies.

It's one thing to have bold ideas but quite another to implement them.

Polls gave Mr Poroshenko, who has been in power since 2014, 25% of the vote.

The billionaire was elected after an uprising overthrew the country's previous, pro-Russian government.

"The outcome of the election leaves us with uncertainty [and] unpredictability," he said after exit polls were released.

"I will leave office but I want to firmly stress - I will not quit politics," he added.

Mr Zelensky, 41, is best known for starring in a political satirical drama called Servant of the People in which his character accidentally becomes Ukrainian president.

He ran under a political party with the same name as his show.

With no previous political experience, his campaign focused on his difference to the other candidates rather than on any concrete policy ideas.

Despite this, he won the first round with more than 30% of the vote - almost double what Mr Poroshenko got when he finished in second place with 15.95%


https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-48007487
0 Replies
 
Lash
 
  0  
Sun 21 Apr, 2019 01:08 pm
Glenn Greenwald
@ggreenwald
·
1h
The WashPost also said the landslide victory of this comedian in the Ukrainian presidential race "reflected the disdain with which many Ukrainians see their political establishment five years after their pro-Western revolution." At some point this lesson will have to be learned
———————
The establishment is over—one way or another.

He had not one shred of political/governmental experience. I think some people prefer to go down the tubes with an innocent, authentic human being.
0 Replies
 
glitterbag
 
  2  
Sun 21 Apr, 2019 02:49 pm
@georgeob1,
I'm very anxious to hear you explain why its business as usual to accept assistance from the Russian Govt on a Presidential Campaign. Now you have my Irish up.
georgeob1
 
  -1  
Sun 21 Apr, 2019 03:22 pm
@glitterbag,
Has It been established that the Trump Campaign knowingly accepted an offer of help from the Russian Government??? I'm not aware of that.

We do, however, know that the Clinton campaign knowingly and purposefully paid for a hit piece on Trump that originated with Russian sources (very likely with the knowledge and help of Russian Intelligence services).

I'm sure you are aware of the importance of considering the needs and motivation of the targets of intelligence operations. Putin had ample knowledge of and experience with the flaccid Obama Clinton Administration, while he had much to fear from the announced energy policy of then candidate Trump.

I suspected you might be Irish (now why would I think that?) . It saddens me to learn it's true. My sainted mother was a ballsy, well endowed Irish redhead, but I loved her.
neptuneblue
 
  3  
Sun 21 Apr, 2019 04:26 pm
@georgeob1,
georgeob1 wrote:
I suspect Giuliani is well aware that the so-called "dossier" purchased and financed by Hillary Clinton's campaign was itself based on "information " from Russians and almost certainly known to the Russian intelligence services.


Why are you even talking about the dossier again?

Why?

Because Trump put it out there. He wants to set the looky-over-here narritive. And you fell for it. Again.

"The dossier is back in this news this week for a couple of reasons. First, a snippet of a deposition with Steele, the former British spy who put together the dossier, was unsealed last week. The deposition makes clear that Steele “used internet searches and unverified information to support details he had gathered about a web company mentioned in the dossier,” CNN reported — a revelation buttressing the notion that the document wasn’t reliable enough to form the basis of an FBI investigation.

But it’s also in the news because Trump is putting it there. He’s making it a central part of his bizarre, one-sided feud with the late John McCain — in which Trump has slammed him for the role he played in alerting the FBI to the dossier.

“They gave it to John McCain, who gave it to the FBI for very evil purposes. That’s not good,” Trump told Fox Business in an interview that aired Friday morning. “I’m not a fan.”

Last Sunday, Trump tweeted that McCain “sent the Fake Dossier to the FBI and Media hoping to have it printed BEFORE the Election.”


https://www.vox.com/2019/3/22/18277089/fox-news-steele-dossier-lie-trump-witch-hunt

Wake up.
0 Replies
 
oralloy
 
  -1  
Sun 21 Apr, 2019 04:46 pm
@revelette1,
revelette1 wrote:
In matters of state, yes. In moral and legality, no.

OK, good.

Note that not only did Trump not commit obstruction, but he also did not act out of any treasonous motive. He was merely annoyed at the claim that he didn't get elected fairly.


revelette1 wrote:
Like Nep said, no one murdered anyone. Thank goodness.

There were, however, multiple counts of obstruction by Bill Clinton:
a) sending Betty Currie out to conceal the gifts that he had given Lewinsky before investigators could find them
b) coaching Betty Currie on how she should testify

and conspiracy to obstruct:
c) having an understanding with Lewinsky that they would cooperate to conceal their relationship from investigators
0 Replies
 
oralloy
 
  -3  
Sun 21 Apr, 2019 04:47 pm
@livinglava,
livinglava wrote:
oralloy wrote:
Wow. I just heard about this on the news. It looks like the Tamils don't consent to be genocide victims.

What could it possibly mean to "consent to be genocide victims?"
How can you consent to others being killed because they share the same ethnicity with you?
That's like saying you have the right to kill others or have them killed as long as they are "your own people."

http://www.a-human-right.com/takesome.JPG
0 Replies
 
RABEL222
 
  3  
Sun 21 Apr, 2019 06:59 pm
@georgeob1,
Hell yes it wss for those who read the report as opposed to those who let fox news report their version.
0 Replies
 
glitterbag
 
  2  
Mon 22 Apr, 2019 01:09 am
@georgeob1,
You're an obstinate man George, but Gulliani should know better than to state it's perfectly fine to accept information (intell) from the Russians. Sure, lets invite them to the GOP convention, while we are at it...send them invitations to the inauguration....they deserve a little consideration....it's great...invite them into the Oval Office and back slap those chortling bastards while they measure the windows for drapes. Perhaps it's small potatoes to you, but I'm alarmed that this Administration is so careless with the Russians. I think your opinion of the situation is flaccid and irresponsible.
oralloy
 
  -1  
Mon 22 Apr, 2019 01:22 am
@glitterbag,
glitterbag wrote:
Gulliani should know better than to state it's perfectly fine to accept information (intell) from the Russians.

Why? It is in fact perfectly fine to do so.

What's so bad about telling the truth?
glitterbag
 
  2  
Mon 22 Apr, 2019 01:36 am
@oralloy,
Oh really, I was unaware of the intelligence sharing arrangement between the Workers paradise and the United States of America. You must have some magical insight of regarding national security that slipped by me during my 32 years of DOD service. If you continue to make statements like that, people will wonder if you have the intellect that God gave to bullfrogs.
oralloy
 
  -1  
Mon 22 Apr, 2019 02:27 am
@glitterbag,
glitterbag wrote:
Oh really, I was unaware of the intelligence sharing arrangement between the Workers paradise and the United States of America.

Who says there has to be a special intelligence sharing arrangement in order for the Russians to hand intelligence to someone?


glitterbag wrote:
You must have some magical insight of regarding national security that slipped by me during my 32 years of DOD service.

No magic. I just pay attention to facts.


glitterbag wrote:
If you continue to make statements like that, people will wonder if you have the intellect that God gave to bullfrogs.

Leftists maybe. Leftists always react childishly when they are confronted with facts.
hightor
 
  6  
Mon 22 Apr, 2019 04:31 am
@oralloy,
Quote:
It looks like the Tamils don't consent to be genocide victims.


It doesn't look like that at all.

It looks a lot more like you don't know what you're talking about and hastily jumped to your own conclusions before waiting to hear the facts.

Quote:
I just pay attention to facts.


Not in this case.
snood
 
  3  
Mon 22 Apr, 2019 04:42 am
@glitterbag,
glitterbag wrote:

Oh really, I was unaware of the intelligence sharing arrangement between the Workers paradise and the United States of America. You must have some magical insight of regarding national security that slipped by me during my 32 years of DOD service. If you continue to make statements like that, people will wonder if you have the intellect that God gave to bullfrogs.


I don’t wonder
0 Replies
 
 

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