192
   

monitoring Trump and relevant contemporary events

 
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  4  
Tue 16 Apr, 2019 02:09 pm
@livinglava,
livinglava wrote:
Property and lives are destroyed and wasted and you're worried about insults?
Yes, I find it more than sad when the victims of a war - here the Great War - are insulted.
InfraBlue
 
  4  
Tue 16 Apr, 2019 02:33 pm
@Olivier5,
Notre Dame was in ruins. Victor Hugo’s novel about a hunchback saved it.

Quote:
France has rebuilt its iconic cathedral before

Notre Dame has gone through a lot in its 856 years. It has endured ill-advised remodeling, revolutionary ransacking and pollution-induced decay. Hitler once had it slated for demolition.

On Monday, fire raged through the cathedral, consuming its roof and causing its central spire to collapse. The full scale of “colossal damage” is being assessed, but French President Emmanuel Macron vowed that the Paris landmark would be rebuilt, and donations to do so began pouring in from some of France’s richest families.

...

France has rebuilt it before. In the early 1800s, Notre Dame was half-ruined when a writer used the crumbling structure as the setting for one of his greatest works, setting in motion a rescue operation nearly as grand as its original construction.

“Parisians have had a direct relationship with their cathedral,” said Stephen Murray, an art historian and professor emeritus at Columbia University. “And I think it was largely because of the wave of interest because of the book."

During the reign of Louis XIV (1643-1715), Notre Dame underwent a rather unfortunate renovation. Stained glass was replaced with clear windows, a pillar was demolished to allow carriages to pass through, and the original rood screen — an ornate partition usually made of wood or stone that divides the nave from the chancel — was torn down.

The French Revolution era was even worse for it. Seized by revolutionaries, dozens of statues were destroyed. The bishop’s palace was burned to the ground and never rebuilt. The spire was deconstructed after it was damaged by wind. Lead from the roof was used for bullets, and bronze bells were melted down for cannon, according to National Geographic.

The cathedral was returned to the Catholic Church by 1802, but it continued to decay.

Then, in 1831, the writer Victor Hugo published his novel “The Hunchback of Notre Dame.” It tells the tale of Quasimodo, the deformed bell ringer of the cathedral, who becomes obsessed with the beautiful Esmeralda.

But beyond the star-crossed love, Notre Dame is the star of the show. Hugo wrote two chapters just describing it. And he notably set his novel in the 1400s, Notre Dame’s heyday. Hugo wrote: “It is difficult not to sigh, not to wax indignant, before the numberless degradations and mutilations which time and men have both caused the venerable monument to suffer.”

...

Restoration projects have continued through the years. In fact, another had just begun this month, funded in large part by the Friends of Notre Dame of Paris foundation, of which Murray is a member. He said he and other members were “in grief” Monday.

“In the Middle Ages, you would’ve believed that God sent the fire because God wanted a better cathedral. But you can’t hope for a better cathedral at this point,” he said. “The question is, how on earth are we going to find the resources to rebuild this one?”


more...
revelette1
 
  1  
Tue 16 Apr, 2019 03:26 pm
@InfraBlue,
Quote:
The question is, how on earth are we going to find the resources to rebuild this one?”


This might help a little. Maybe more will follow.

French billionaire pledges 100 million euros to rebuild Notre Dame
maporsche
 
  2  
Tue 16 Apr, 2019 03:28 pm
@revelette1,
revelette1 wrote:

Quote:
The question is, how on earth are we going to find the resources to rebuild this one?”


This might help a little. Maybe more will follow.

French billionaire pledges 100 million euros to rebuild Notre Dame


Does the catholic church not have enough money....or, insurance?

The money coming from private citizens to rebuild this could be used elsewhere and to much greater benefit.
livinglava
 
  -1  
Tue 16 Apr, 2019 03:53 pm
@Walter Hinteler,
Walter Hinteler wrote:

livinglava wrote:
Property and lives are destroyed and wasted and you're worried about insults?
Yes, I find it more than sad when the victims of a war - here the Great War - are insulted.

Accusing people of insult is repressive. I am not interested in insulting anyone. If you can't have a discussion without using accusations of insult to push others into a certain stance, I don't think you should be discussing.

To clarify, though, I was not talking about the specific church in question or Notre Dame or any other historically-specific event. I was only saying that when a church is destroyed and rebuilt, it creates economic opportunities and so some people have an interest in such destruction.

Personally, I think there has to be a way of living in peace and prosperity without destruction and waste to provoke economic activity; but history shows otherwise, doesn't it?

You accuse me of insulting these people or those, but isn't the reality that throughout the history of humans and others species, there is a failure to achieve sustainable prosperity? Are you now going to accuse me of insulting everyone who has ever been involved in any kind of violence in any way, human or non-human?
0 Replies
 
Baldimo
 
  -1  
Tue 16 Apr, 2019 03:53 pm
@maporsche,
It isn't owned by the Catholic Church, it's owned by the France. If someone wants to donate their money to fix something, should it be allowed?
maporsche
 
  2  
Tue 16 Apr, 2019 03:55 pm
@Baldimo,
Baldimo wrote:
If someone wants to donate their money to fix something, should it be allowed?


Of course. What did I say, specifically, that made you question me on this?
livinglava
 
  -2  
Tue 16 Apr, 2019 03:58 pm
@Baldimo,
Baldimo wrote:

It isn't owned by the Catholic Church, it's owned by the France. If someone wants to donate their money to fix something, should it be allowed?

Maybe it ends up stimulating further destruction, though. It's like paying ransom to terrorists; when you do it, it stimulates more hostage-taking, i.e. because it becomes proven as a successful strategy for fund-raising.
Baldimo
 
  -2  
Tue 16 Apr, 2019 04:00 pm
@maporsche,
Quote:
Of course. What did I say, specifically, that made you question me on this?


Quote:
The money coming from private citizens to rebuild this could be used elsewhere and to much greater benefit.


maporsche
 
  1  
Tue 16 Apr, 2019 04:04 pm
@Baldimo,
Baldimo wrote:

Quote:
Of course. What did I say, specifically, that made you question me on this?


Quote:
The money coming from private citizens to rebuild this could be used elsewhere and to much greater benefit.



Strange that you think my statement somehow leads to you believe the question you asked me to be relevant.
0 Replies
 
oralloy
 
  -2  
Tue 16 Apr, 2019 04:50 pm
@livinglava,
livinglava wrote:
It's like paying ransom to terrorists; when you do it, it stimulates more hostage-taking, i.e. because it becomes proven as a successful strategy for fund-raising.

Does it have to stimulate more hostage taking though?

We have bank tellers comply with bank robbers instead of resisting. Does that stimulate bank robbery? Or does the fact that the police will hunt down bank robbers make an adequate deterrent?

What if we followed the same model with hostage taking? We could pay money to save the lives of hostages, and then just hunt down hostage takers after the fact.
0 Replies
 
Brand X
 
  2  
Tue 16 Apr, 2019 06:57 pm
@AP

'BREAKING: President Trump vetoes resolution calling on U.S. to withdraw support from Saudi-led war in Yemen.'
Setanta
 
  1  
Tue 16 Apr, 2019 09:06 pm
@Brand X,
You're not surprised, are you?
glitterbag
 
  2  
Tue 16 Apr, 2019 09:12 pm
@Setanta,
I'm not surprised, the craven bastards.
0 Replies
 
georgeob1
 
  -1  
Tue 16 Apr, 2019 09:15 pm
@Brand X,
Smart move. Yemen is an unstable place beset with competing tyrannical contenders for power and divided by irreconcilable North South differences. The Saudi influence certainly does not promise anything approaching our democratic expectations. However it does portend something far better than anything Yemen has seen since WWII. In approaching the affairs of Middle eastern and North African Islamic governments, whether Pakistan, Yemen, Syria Libya a or Algeria the choices are between bad and worse.
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  1  
Tue 16 Apr, 2019 10:11 pm
Right, so we just stand by while the Saudis throw gasoline on a raging fire--because George says one side is as bad as the other. Oh hell I'm convinced.
glitterbag
 
  1  
Tue 16 Apr, 2019 10:17 pm
@Setanta,
Yeah, Me too. Plus the Saudis invest in a ton of real estate in the US.
Setanta
 
  1  
Tue 16 Apr, 2019 10:23 pm
Well, there you have it--the lives of women and children don't matter like heavy investment.
0 Replies
 
coluber2001
 
  3  
Tue 16 Apr, 2019 10:31 pm
Trump parody to the melody from Gilbert and Sullivan's, "I am the very model of a major-general".

0 Replies
 
izzythepush
 
  1  
Wed 17 Apr, 2019 01:10 am
Quote:
Ecuadorian President Lenin Moreno has told the BBC why his government decided to revoke Julian Assange's asylum.

The Wikileaks co-founder was arrested in London on 11 April after seven years in the Ecuadorian embassy.

Mr Moreno accused Mr Assange of rubbing excrement on the embassy walls. Mr Assange's lawyer has accused Ecuador of "outrageous allegations".


https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/world-latin-america-47956607/assange-smeared-faeces-in-ecuador-embassy-says-president

Video at link, (of Moreno being interviewed, not Assange smearing his **** on walls.)
0 Replies
 
 

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