192
   

monitoring Trump and relevant contemporary events

 
 
blatham
 
  1  
Sun 13 Jan, 2019 12:41 pm
I hope some of you will consider purchasing my new book, "The Religious Right Sure Is One ************ Of A Demographic".
0 Replies
 
ehBeth
 
  3  
Sun 13 Jan, 2019 12:43 pm
@hightor,
hightor wrote:
But Trump is himself the very model of an "elitist".


I think #45 is a member of US elite . He is a child of money.

Whether he is an elitist is a different question, and I can't decide (for myself) if he fits into the definition. He certainly values $ over education, socializes with princes/entertainers/money people not working class people.
hightor
 
  1  
Sun 13 Jan, 2019 12:49 pm
@ehBeth,
Quote:
...and I can't decide (for myself) if he fits into the definition.

He has a penchant for surrounding himself with corporate elitists when it comes to cabinet choices. Which makes me think he probably feels they are most entitled to hold power and shape policy.
0 Replies
 
livinglava
 
  -3  
Sun 13 Jan, 2019 01:00 pm
@ehBeth,
ehBeth wrote:

hightor wrote:
But Trump is himself the very model of an "elitist".


I think #45 is a member of US elite . He is a child of money.

Whether he is an elitist is a different question, and I can't decide (for myself) if he fits into the definition. He certainly values $ over education, socializes with princes/entertainers/money people not working class people.

What are you talking about? Most working class people are raised to care about money and money alone. If that doesn't make them "children of money," what does?

Why is it that if you already have money and focus on other things, the left will accuse you of greed; but if you have little money and only focus on getting more, that's not considered greed?

What ever happened to the best things in life being free?
0 Replies
 
blatham
 
  1  
Sun 13 Jan, 2019 01:06 pm
@hightor,
Quote:
The Dem's problem is that they overestimate the electorate's interest and intelligence [and thus] they overestimate the popularity of their candidates and policies
I think that is surely so. But where does it leave us?

Let's presume (I think the evidence is pretty clear here) that the modern GOP strategists are quite aware that the level of their party's popularity/unpopularity is such that they aren't going to win many elections unless they do a whole lot of stuff that is self-evidently destructive to democratic governance and to broad civic well-being. Cliches like 'you don't bring a knife to a gunfight' are pretty much worthless except as a handy means to stop thinking about a complex set of problems.

Do we want the Dems to forward nominees like George W Bush? Like Sarah Palin? Like Donald Trump? Do we want a character like McConnell - a man devoid of integrity - at the helm of a Dem-led Senate? Do we wish to duplicate the obvious successes of Murdoch/Ailes communication strategies?

If the Dems turn into a copy of the modern GOP - dishonest, corrupt, under-educated, constantly deceitful - I doubt that is going to work out very well.
coldjoint
 
  -3  
Sun 13 Jan, 2019 01:20 pm
@ehBeth,
Quote:
I think #45 is a member of US elite .

Which is much better than a Canadian elite from what I have been seeing in a country you seem to care nothing about, Canada.
0 Replies
 
Below viewing threshold (view)
gungasnake
 
  -2  
Sun 13 Jan, 2019 02:29 pm
Again, a nationalist Christmas:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=12&v=GoJSuenvJ4M

Christmas in a Christian city... That really freaks some of you losers,doesn't it?

I mean, you could claim 40% of angelinos are catholics, but that's not really the same thing as claim there are lots of Christians running around in LA, is it?

A few things nobody will ever see in St. Petersburg Russia:

Crips, bloods, MS-13....

People pooping on the sidewalks

Low-rider cars with Gates jacks and magnesium under the transaxle for fireworks shows at night on the highway or, alternately, to tie some rival gang member under the transaxle and lower the suspension gradually i.e. grate
the idiot down like a piece of cheese...

Satan worship

The Kalergi plan (the criminalization of yellow hair and blue eyes)

A muslim takeover, banning things like Christmas to avoid offending slammites

Rogue political parties in open rebellion against a duly elected national government......

But you get the idea.....



hightor
 
  4  
Sun 13 Jan, 2019 02:33 pm
@gungasnake,
Hey gungasnake, why don't you regale us with some more of those really clever and convincing "walkaway" stories?
0 Replies
 
hightor
 
  2  
Sun 13 Jan, 2019 02:49 pm
@blatham,
Quote:
But where does it leave us?

For now, not being "them" is going to have to be good enough.

Part of the problem, from my perspective, is the primary system. A fraction of the party, mostly the so-called "activists" choose the candidate they like. So yeah, thoughtful people are impressed by an intelligent progressive like Warren and vote for her in the primaries only to have some oaf like Trump tar her so badly that she can never overcome the caricature. I think they should move the primaries around — **** entitled New Hampshire's "first in the nation" distinction. Make them regional primaries and revise the order in which they're held every election. It's ridiculous that states like NH and Iowa have such an outsizes influence on the selection process.
Quote:
If the Dems turn into a copy of the modern GOP - dishonest, corrupt, under-educated, constantly deceitful - I doubt that is going to work out very well.

Agreed. But how do you turn it around when the tide seems to be washing up on that particular shore?
Sturgis
 
  2  
Sun 13 Jan, 2019 03:51 pm
@hightor,
Quote:
The Dems problem...they overestimate the electorate's interest and intelligence, ...the popularity of their candidates...prospective turnout.


That sums it up rather nicely.
0 Replies
 
gungasnake
 
  -3  
Sun 13 Jan, 2019 03:53 pm
Walkaway stories??

Actually, I could talk about my own but it's sort of dated. I walked away in 1980 when it became obvious that the demopoops had entirely lost touch with reality and all become racists. My parents were both die-hard new-deal dems from the FDR era and I was raised that way, and it took me about six or seven years of living in the real world to grow out of it, but I DID grow out of it.

The conclusion I come to is that FDR represented some sort of an aberration which lasted around 20 years and ended after JFK was assassinated by Lyndon Johnson and Ed Clark and the gangster wing of the dem part retook control of the party. During all of the history of the party outside of that 30 year period, the dem party has been a crime syndicate, which is what it is now.

FDR and JFK would be Republicans in today's world.


0 Replies
 
Real Music
 
  2  
Sun 13 Jan, 2019 04:25 pm
Trump and GOP taking messaging hit on shutdown


Published January 13, 2019
Quote:
President Donald Trump and Republicans are losing the messaging war on the government shutdown.

The shutdown is now the longest in U.S. history, entering its 23rd day, and there appears to be no end in sight. As Trump repeatedly declares he won't reopen the government unless he gets funding for his border wall, House Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) and Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer (D-N.Y.) are adamant that they will not fund the project.

Trump’s message on the shutdown — blaming Democrats for refusing to concede on his border wall — isn't convincing the American public. Instead, the majority of Americans think Trump and Republicans are at fault for the shutdown, according to two new polls. A Washington Post-ABC News found that 53 percent of respondents blamed Trump and Republicans in Congress for the shutdown, while 29 percent blamed Democrats. Thirteen percent of respondents said both sides were equally to blame.

Another poll from CNN found that 55 percent of respondents blamed Trump, while 32 percent blamed Democrats. Nine percent blamed both sides.

Trump's disapproval ratings are also rising, with the CNN poll showing his overall rating getting worse by 5 percentage points since the shutdown started.

With Democrats refusing to approve any money for the wall — while insisting Trump reopen the government even while negotiations continue — Hill Republicans are now trapped in a situation where their lead messenger's appeal is designed for base voters and isn't speaking to the broader American public.

Yet in what could be a troubling omen for any deal to end the stalemate, Trump's message on the wall is growing more popular with Republicans, according to both polls.

That means that while the broader American public doesn't like what it's hearing from the White House, GOP voters do. Thus, crossing the aisle and voting with Democrats may become even harder for wobbly Republicans who want to reopen the government. So far, only a dozen House Republicans have done so, as well as three GOP senators.

Despite the bad poll numbers, Trump isn't showing any signs of giving in, even as some of the 800,000 federal employees hit by the shutdown have had to go to food banks to eat, begun driving for Uber, or even selling household goods online to pay their bills.

The president took to Twitter on Saturday to blast news reports that the White House doesn't have a plan to end the government shutdown.

“The Fakes always like talking Chaos, there is NONE,” Trump tweeted. “In fact, there’s almost nobody in the W.H. but me .... I do have a plan on the Shutdown. But to understand that plan you would have to understand the fact that I won the election, and I promised safety and security for the American people. Part of that promise was a Wall at the Southern Border.”

But it’s unclear what the president's plan is to end the government shutdown — or to convince Democrats to yield. Trump has changed his position several times in the last week on whether he would go around Congress to get his border wall and declare a national emergency. Last week, Trump told reporters: “I may decide a national emergency depending on what happens over the next few days.” But by Friday, he appeared to be less convinced, telling reporters “what we’re not looking to do right now is national emergency.”

In a Fox News interview with Jeanine Pirro on Saturday, Trump said that he was waiting on Democrats before he would declare a national emergency.

“I have the absolute right to call a national emergency,” he said. “I'd rather see that Democrats come back from their vacation and act. They're not acting and they're the ones that are holding it up. It would take me 15 minutes to get a deal done and everybody could go back to work, but I'd like to see them act responsibly.

Trump added that he has not left the White House “in months,” despite a trip last week to the southern border.

If there is a strategy, it’s unclear what that is. Sen. Lindsey Graham (R-S.C.) told Fox News’ Chris Wallace on Sunday that he advised Trump to temporarily reopen the government for three weeks and try to negotiate with Democrats. If those talks fail, Graham said Trump could then declare a national emergency. But the president reiterated wants to make a deal on the wall, before re-opening the government, according to Graham.

"Before he pulls the plug on the legislative option and I think we’re almost there," he said. "I would urge him to open up the government for a short period of time, like three weeks before he pulls the plug. See if we can get a deal if we can’t at the end of three weeks, all bets are off.”

House Minority Leader Kevin McCarthy (R-Calif.) also defended the president Sunday and blamed Democrats for being unwilling to compromise.

“It is unacceptable that 800,000 U.S. employees are not being paid,” McCarthy said on CBS' “Face the Nation.“ “You know what we're arguing over? One-tenth of one percent of the federal budget. And it's not as though we're asking Democrats to do something they haven't done before. They voted for border wall and fencing.”

He added that the shutdown could be resolved “in minutes” but said that “when the Democrats will not even make a counteroffer, it’s unacceptable.”

Democrats stuck by their position that Trump and Republicans should allow the government to reopen first, then try to reach an accord on the border wall.

“I will say this: we first should reopen government. Why punish people who are applying for food stamps because the president is having a temper tantrum?," Sen. Tim Kaine (D-Va.) said on NBC's "Meet The Press."

"What we don't want to do is waste taxpayer money on a vanity project that's ineffective, that the president said Mexico would pay for.

But spending massive amounts on border security to keep us safe, Democrats do it over and over again and it's been Republicans that have been blocking it."

http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/trump-and-gop-taking-messaging-hit-on-shutdown/ar-BBSb3k9?li=BBnbcA1&ocid=UE13DHP
0 Replies
 
coldjoint
 
  -1  
Sun 13 Jan, 2019 04:31 pm
Quote:
project that's ineffective,

How is it ineffective, for a wall to be ineffective is nearly impossible.
0 Replies
 
Real Music
 
  2  
Sun 13 Jan, 2019 04:38 pm
Trump’s disapproval rating higher since shutdown began: poll

http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/trump%e2%80%99s-disapproval-rating-higher-since-shutdown-began-poll/ar-BBSbDx8?ocid=UE13DHP
coldjoint
 
  -2  
Sun 13 Jan, 2019 04:55 pm
@Real Music,
Quote:
disapproval

Does he look scared?
Real Music
 
  4  
Sun 13 Jan, 2019 04:57 pm
@coldjoint,
Since you ask.
Yes, he does look scared about everything that's happening in his presidency.
coldjoint
 
  -2  
Sun 13 Jan, 2019 05:15 pm
@Real Music,
Quote:
Yes, he does look scared about everything that's happening in his presidency.

Don't quit your day job, he is more than fine with what he does.
0 Replies
 
blatham
 
  1  
Sun 13 Jan, 2019 05:32 pm
@hightor,
Re how the primaries are organized... I can't speak to that with any worthwhile level of knowledge.
Quote:
For now, not being "them" is going to have to be good enough.
That's the necessary starting point. And in this, Trump is something of a gift to the left. But then choices have to be made as we approach 2020 and then beyond. A passive "those other guys are so bad" won't build the sort of passionate movement that seems clearly needed (again, I'll defer to Perlstein's take on this).
Quote:
But how do you turn it around when the tide seems to be washing up on that particular shore?
I once laced a philosophy essay with as many instances of sea imagery/metaphors as I could manage. I'd previously written some pretty good essays for this prof so I got away with the gag.

But I'm not sure of your meaning. Dems too are comparably corrupt, deceitful etc? Or perhaps that the nature of the modern GOP demands a sort or a level of robust and fresh politics not seen for a long while? I assume you mean something like the second. If so, I concur absolutely. And on this, I'm actually quite optimistic due to the notable rise in political involvement by women, minorities and young people.

Still, institutional facts are going to make this far more difficult than young folks, say, are likely to comprehend. The right wing "smart" people have been playing the long game and that's the main reason why we are where we are, I believe.

I just don't think that a Dem candidate who matches the requirements of a successful entertainer (eg Oprah) is going to provide anything but a short gain and a very dangerous continuation of some of the worst trends we're seeing in the nexus between politics and media. It is in this sense that I distrust an insistence on charisma. Certainly better to have it but someone who has it yet shows little personal history of the personal characteristics we understand really must be in place to avoid tragedy is bound to **** things up really badly.

And I'll add a separate but somewhat relevant point re media. My fear is growing that the electoral removal of Trump is going to leave a huge vacuum in news media content. Daily drama, conflict, sex, spies, corruption - with Trump gone, how do commercial media entities (many on a long trend towards insolvency) fill their pages and draw viewers? How do they cope with a boring, efficient, hard working, honest administration? This worries me a lot, actually.
blatham
 
  1  
Sun 13 Jan, 2019 05:42 pm
@ehBeth,
Quote:
I think #45 is a member of US elite .
yeah, I think we can say that without too much hesitation. Recall Barbara Bush speaking on her reservations re Jeb's run.
Quote:
There are a lot of great families, and it's not just four families or whatever.

0 Replies
 
 

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