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Reasons for optimism

 
 
Reply Thu 10 Nov, 2016 08:25 am
Two things that I keep reminding myself in this dark hour of despair:

1. Trump was the most moderate of all the Republican candidates running for president. So as impossible as it may sound, it could have been worse. And

2. Trump's victory has driven the final stake through the vampire heart of the Clinton famiglia, thus ending its baleful influence on American politics in general and the Democratic Party in particular. The blowjob curse has been lifted from the country, which is reason enough to rejoice.

ELIZABETH WARREN 2020!!!
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Type: Discussion • Score: 24 • Views: 32,413 • Replies: 377

 
boomerang
 
  2  
Reply Thu 10 Nov, 2016 08:55 am
@joefromchicago,
It seems emotion was running rampant yesterday at the high school Mo goes to. He said people were saying that Trump will never make it through his presidency -- that he'll be assassinated, or he'll have a heart attack, or he'll be impeached, or... something.

I don't think that will happen but it did get me thinking about a Pence presidency. I don't know a lot about him but what I do know is pretty scary. I think I'd rather see Trump who, at least, has been on both sides of almost every issue at some point in his life and who, by most accounts, is much more gracious and much less a blowhard in real life.
0 Replies
 
revelette2
 
  2  
Reply Thu 10 Nov, 2016 09:29 am
I suppose anyone can tell themselves reasons for optimism. Meanwhile while waiting for Elizabeth Warren, who is pretty old by the way, we will be stuck with Trump. Consider the following.

Moscow had contacts with Trump team, Russian diplomat says

Quote:
MOSCOW — Russian government officials had contacts with members of Donald Trump’s campaign team, a senior Russian diplomat said Thursday, in a report that could reopen scrutiny over the Kremlin’s role in the president-elect’s bitter race against Hillary Clinton.

Facing questions about his ties to Moscow because of his statements in favor of Russian President Vladi­mir Putin, Trump repeatedly denied having any contact with the Russian government.

But Russia’s Deputy Foreign Minister Sergei Ryabkov, in an interview with the state-run Interfax news agency, said that "there were contacts" with the Trump team.

"Obviously, we know most of the people from his entourage,” Rybakov said. “Those people have always been in the limelight in the United States and have occupied high-ranking positions. I cannot say that all of them but quite a few have been staying in touch with Russian representatives.”

"We have just begun to consider ways of building dialogue with the future Donald Trump administration and channels we will be using for those purposes," Ryabkov said.

Obama administration officials have blamed Russian hackers, possibly with high-level intelligence links, for infiltrating the email account of Clinton’s campaign chief, John Podesta. The emails were then disclosed by Wikileaks in an effort that Clinton supports claim was intended to damage her White House bid.


I doubt we will be having hearings since we democrats didn't manage to get the senate either. More reasons for optimism.
0 Replies
 
Lash
 
  0  
Reply Thu 10 Nov, 2016 10:21 am
I hope we can establish a good working relationship with Russia, especially regarding the Syrian issue. There's no longer a reason to automatically fear Russia now that the regime fanning fear has been put out to pasture.

There may be holdover spying issues on both sides, but I like the idea of putting Cold War baggage away.

I've always imagined new presidents with similar high hopes for improved relations with Russia being approached during the first days of their presidencies by some representative of the storied Industrial Military Complex-- the Shadow Government-- and being told in no uncertain terms that we will maintain current tensions with China and Russia. There's great money in war.

I know Bernie would've fought pressures to fall in line with antiquated Cold War policies fueled by big money kickbacks that await new presidents. I'm not sure about Trump. Was definitely sure about Clinton.

I do hope Trump can develop a positive relationship with Russia.

Brand X
 
  1  
Reply Thu 10 Nov, 2016 10:27 am
The two Party system is broken. The primaries almost worked this year to dismantle the parties. Trump is not a Republican and Sanders almost outdid the Democrat elites. Depending on how the next four years go, well, who knows....maybe the antiquated two Party system will soon die.
maxdancona
 
  3  
Reply Thu 10 Nov, 2016 10:32 am
@Brand X,
1) How is the two party system broken now in any way it wasn't broken when it was started 228 years ago?

2) Given that parties are what win elections, and that independents have such disadvantages, how do you think that parties will ever be dismantled?
0 Replies
 
maporsche
 
  3  
Reply Thu 10 Nov, 2016 10:40 am
@Brand X,
Brand X wrote:

The two Party system is broken. The primaries almost worked this year to dismantle the parties. Trump is not a Republican and Sanders almost outdid the Democrat elites. Depending on how the next four years go, well, who knows....maybe the antiquated two Party system will soon die.


Can you point to a single "winner-take-all" system, worldwide, in ALL of history that has had more than 2 effective parties?
revelette2
 
  1  
Reply Thu 10 Nov, 2016 10:46 am
@Lash,
I do too. I can't wait to jail up gays and shoot reporters. Rolling Eyes

Russian Federation 2015/2016
0 Replies
 
Brand X
 
  1  
Reply Thu 10 Nov, 2016 11:05 am
@maporsche,
I don't know what it will look like, there would be an evolution....and it would likely not compare to any other system in history.
0 Replies
 
izzythepush
 
  1  
Reply Thu 10 Nov, 2016 11:18 am
@maporsche,
Britain in the early 20th Century had three big parties before the working classes wised up to the fact that the Liberals aren't much different from the Conservatives and started voting Labour, so 3 became 2.

The problem with first past the post is that it means people are less likely to vote with their hearts because your candidate hasn't a hope in hell so you tactically vote for the least worst option.

The Constituency I live in is Liberal/Conservative, but I've always voted Labour. I really don't like the Liberals.
0 Replies
 
Lash
 
  -2  
Reply Thu 10 Nov, 2016 12:54 pm
Listen, I can see you writhing around bitterly trying to create drama with me. Try to pull yourself together. Meanwhile, I'm going to just swat your irritating buzzing off my radar.
revelette2
 
  1  
Reply Thu 10 Nov, 2016 12:59 pm
@Lash,
Fine, but I am honest, I am scared of those things with good reason as more information comes out.

To repeat which started this line about Russia, I didn't make it up out of my bitterness.

Moscow had contacts with Trump team, Russian diplomat says
Foofie
 
  -1  
Reply Thu 10 Nov, 2016 03:24 pm
@Lash,
Lash wrote:

I hope we can establish a good working relationship with Russia, especially regarding the Syrian issue. There's no longer a reason to automatically fear Russia now that the regime fanning fear has been put out to pasture.

There may be holdover spying issues on both sides, but I like the idea of putting Cold War baggage away.

I've always imagined new presidents with similar high hopes for improved relations with Russia being approached during the first days of their presidencies by some representative of the storied Industrial Military Complex-- the Shadow Government-- and being told in no uncertain terms that we will maintain current tensions with China and Russia. There's great money in war.

I know Bernie would've fought pressures to fall in line with antiquated Cold War policies fueled by big money kickbacks that await new presidents. I'm not sure about Trump. Was definitely sure about Clinton.

I do hope Trump can develop a positive relationship with Russia.




Don't worry madel.
0 Replies
 
Kolyo
 
  2  
Reply Thu 10 Nov, 2016 04:40 pm
@joefromchicago,
joefromchicago wrote:

1. Trump was the most moderate of all the Republican candidates running for president. So as impossible as it may sound, it could have been worse.


On the issues? That's correct. He is certainly not rightwing. It's impossible to locate him on the political spectrum.
izzythepush
 
  6  
Reply Thu 10 Nov, 2016 04:44 pm
@revelette2,
Syria is far more complicated than support Russia and the bad old IS will be defeated. Assad is every bit as bad and brutal as IS. If he is allowed to continue as before it will need an outside military presence to keep it locked down. The majority Sunni population may well be tempted to start viewing IS as a solution again.

Then there's the knock on effect throughout the region, instead of promoting democracy they're keeping a dictator in power and getting into bed with the Russians. Add to that the ban on Muslims entering the US and the jihadis will have no end of angry young men wanting a piece of paradise.
0 Replies
 
Finn dAbuzz
 
  1  
Reply Fri 11 Nov, 2016 05:13 pm
@joefromchicago,
Good for you.
0 Replies
 
RABEL222
 
  1  
Reply Sat 12 Nov, 2016 01:38 pm
@Kolyo,
How about a closet communist who will appoint Putin as an unannounced cabinet member?
RABEL222
 
  5  
Reply Sat 12 Nov, 2016 01:57 pm
@joefromchicago,
Right Joe. We got rid of those rotten Clinton's. We also got rid of a middle of the road supreme court and replaced it with a ultra consertave republican court that legislates from the bench, Remember the corporations are people with the right to vote court legislation? We will be stuck with this shut for the next 20 years. Good job all you people who voted for the tRump Putin collation,
izzythepush
 
  2  
Reply Sat 12 Nov, 2016 03:51 pm
Basil Brush was on the telly last night. He did a bloody good turn as well.

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/c/cc/Basil_Brush.jpg
0 Replies
 
joefromchicago
 
  4  
Reply Sat 12 Nov, 2016 04:31 pm
@RABEL222,
RABEL222 wrote:

Right Joe. We got rid of those rotten Clinton's. We also got rid of a middle of the road supreme court and replaced it with a ultra consertave republican court that legislates from the bench, Remember the corporations are people with the right to vote court legislation? We will be stuck with this shut for the next 20 years. Good job all you people who voted for the tRump Putin collation,

Do you realize how hard it is to take you seriously when you continue doing that "tRump" thing. Are you planning to keep that up for the next four years?
 

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