0
   

Islam’s ideology is immoral to its core. Should we ask the Haigue and U.N. to rule

 
 
Fil Albuquerque
 
  1  
Reply Sun 19 Mar, 2017 05:12 pm
@Greatest I am,
Bluntly, get you sorry ass out of this forum n get back to the hole you came from idiot!
0 Replies
 
Greatest I am
 
  1  
Reply Sun 19 Mar, 2017 05:16 pm
@perennialloner,
perennialloner wrote:

I think if you're going to call Islam an ideology, you have to first define ideology. Then, you have to define other religion's ideologies. Like, Christianity and Judaism. Because the term ideology is usually used in reference to political or economic systems, it's harder for me to think of something that could or has formed the basis for Christianity's ideology, though I'm sure plenty of things exist. With Islam and Judaism it's much easier because I know of clear examples that qualify for the definition I've identified. There's Zionism, Israel, the idea of a "chosen people" for Judaism, which all tie into what might be called Judaism's ideology. Obviously, most people know that not all Jews believe in all those things, even though there's scriptural basis for that idea. With Islam, there's a slew of ideas like Sharia law that terrorists have used to justify their violence against nonbelieving people. Same as with Judaism, most people know that not all Muslims believe in these ideas that could nonetheless be called Islam's ideology.

Let's be honest with whom? People have already identified Islamism as a problem that needs to be dealt with. I will concede that perhaps more can and should be done to deal with Islamic terrorism. What I don't understand is some people's need to conflate a clearly destructive belief system with the faith that millions of people practice.

If you didn't get that last part: the faith that millions of people practice.

So, should we declare war against this immoral ideology?

If by ideology you mean the faith that millions of people practice, the answer is obviously no.





Do you think, after looking at these stats, that Islam is a worthy ideology?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=pSPvnFDDQHk

Is a slave holding ideology like what Islam and Sharia represent, thanks to their child bride policies, a worthy religion or government system?

Regards
DL
perennialloner
 
  1  
Reply Sun 19 Mar, 2017 06:50 pm
@Greatest I am,
I disagree with your premise. And as I said before, a long time ago, you have to define ideology otherwise I find it incredibly unfair for you to be picking and choosing every single thing in which you find morally abhorrent that formerly existed or presently exists in Muslim communities and say each and every one of those things are part and parcel of Islam's ideology. I disagree with practices that exist in some or even many Muslim communities, because they clearly do not belong in the twenty-first century.

However, practices such as these should not delegitimize Islam and the people who practice Islam, believing in their God and his message. But that's exactly what's happening. People like you are constantly trying to separate religion from Islam, to proclaim it is just a political ideology.

But Islam is not unique and never has been. It is not the only religion in the world that is politicized.

I'm not sure what you mean by asking if Islam is worthy? Worthy of what? I can tell you it is worthy of much more consideration than it has been given. It is worthy of more than being reduced to child brides and slaves, because it is more than those things. And Muslim people deserve the protection granted to them by the first amendment in the United States which unfortunately hasn't been honored.


cicerone imposter
 
  2  
Reply Mon 20 Mar, 2017 01:08 am
@perennialloner,
You're right, of coarse. Some people are unable to see the atrocities committed by their own religion.
http://www.truthbeknown.com/victims.htm
hightor
 
  3  
Reply Mon 20 Mar, 2017 03:43 am
I don't have much love or respect for the Islamic faith — or most of the others either — but history seems to show that people tend to cling to their religions more strongly when they feel their beliefs threatened or persecuted. I think there are a number of potential "worms" which might sow seeds of theological doubt in the minds of the more cosmopolitan Muslims but since the same sources of doubt would undermine Christianity I don't see them being promulgated by UNESCO or anything like that.

I'd like to think the worst aspects of Islam would lessen — the way the worst aspects of Christianity have — over time as Muslims are better integrated into the global economy and see the benefits of tolerance and cooperation. Only trouble is, we don't have that much time. So just add "Islamism" to the cavalcade of nightmares we've concocted, slowly driving us further into collective insanity.
saab
 
  1  
Reply Mon 20 Mar, 2017 04:11 am
@cicerone imposter,
You come up with a list of atrocities committed by Chrisitans.
This list is a rather clear anti Catholic list.
They mention rumours and there might have been.... it is partly without facts.
Of course there are Christians who have not lived a Christian life
This man here is mentioned as a Catholic - I have not found anyhting which points to him doing these things because he is a Catholic.
Ante Pavelić ; was a Croatian fascist dictator who led the Ustaše movement and the Independent State of Croatia (NDH), established in parts of occupied Yugoslavia during World War II with the support of both Fascist Italy and Nazi Germany. While in power, Pavelić pursued genocidal policies against ethnic and racial minorities such as Serbs, Jews, and Romani

To be fair you cannot just start to list things which happened hundred of years ago and compare them with what is going on now.

A lot changed over the centuries.
Christians were against slavery - just to mention one thing.
Politicians with a Christian background have been behind an equal life for their citizens what education, social benefits, healthcare - the list is long.

If you want to fair compare a list of bad and good things and see which one wins.
perennialloner
 
  1  
Reply Mon 20 Mar, 2017 08:13 am
@cicerone imposter,
That's not really the point I was trying to get at. I don't wish to compare religions by which has done the most damage. I wish for people to not deligitimize Islam as a religion because it supposedly does not have the same basis as all others. It does. God is at the center of the Muslim's life as He is the center of the Christian's and Jew's. The Muslim's life is guided by faith as much as any other practitioner of a monotheistic religion.
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  2  
Reply Mon 20 Mar, 2017 12:48 pm
@hightor,
I see that too! My sister is a staunch christian, and everything that happens to her is because of "god." We spent time with her in Hawaii the past ten days. "God's been good to me!" OMG, a belief in an invisible nobody!
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  2  
Reply Mon 20 Mar, 2017 12:51 pm
@saab,
We can only observe what has happened in history. Group atrocities doesn't mean 100% of the people supported what their group or culture has done.
However, there have been experiments done at Stanford and Yale Universities that show that "normal" people can end up causing pain to innocent people.
saab
 
  2  
Reply Mon 20 Mar, 2017 01:39 pm
@cicerone imposter,
We do not need some Stanford and Yale experiments to prove that normal people can be nasty under special given circumstances. That has been known since way back.
The thing is, you talk about what Christians did say 500 years ago and then blame Christians now for it ,it is absurd. Often it was politics behind it anyway.
The rulers in many countries certainly were no angels - and it had nothing to do with being Christians but being cruel and power sick people.
Would you blame now living people for something which happened in their country long ago? Probably not. So why blame Christians for things that happened long long ago?
It is like blaming the Danes for what the Vikings did. The Danes certainly do not sail around and attack other countries now adays.
Or do you expect the Danes to invade GB and get it under rule of the Danish Queen and then back into EU again.?

cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Mon 20 Mar, 2017 06:43 pm
@saab,
I didn't know the extent to which regular/normal people could exact such cruelty in this day and age - at a couple of the top universities in this country.

Quote:
The thing is, you talk about what Christians did say 500 years ago and then blame Christians now for it ,it is absurd.


Your claim is absurd.
saab
 
  1  
Reply Tue 21 Mar, 2017 12:22 am
@cicerone imposter,
The Swedish King Gustav II Adolf was very much as a Lutheran involved in the war 1618-48, which was a war between Protestants and Catholics.
According to you it would be ok to say that Lutherans and Swedes to-day are to blame for what happened 400 years ago.
I would say it is absurd. Sweden has not been in any war for about 200 years and the Lutherans have not started a war because they are Lutherans.
0 Replies
 
Baldimo
 
  1  
Reply Tue 21 Mar, 2017 01:16 pm
@saab,
How about them Barbary Pirates, those guys should still be paying the price for the people they took off of US ships and turned into slaves in the ME...
0 Replies
 
saab
 
  1  
Reply Wed 22 Mar, 2017 06:38 am
@cicerone imposter,
Quote:
There are many branches of the Christian religion. Even the Mormons believe in Jesus.


There are about 30 000 Christian denominations.
To believe in Jesus does not make you a Christian. You have to believe in Jesus as Christ.
Even the Muslims believe that Jesus lived, but he was a profet.
Jehovas Witnesses are in a very strict sence not Christians as they do not use the N.T and do not believe that Jesus is Christ.
The Mormons believe in Jesus Christ. Again in a very specific theologian way they are still not Christians as their wiev of God and the Bible differ far too much from Christians to really be accepted as Christians.
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Wed 22 Mar, 2017 09:41 am
@saab,
I've visited Salt Lake City and the Morman church. They have the picture of Jesus on their property.
http://www.mormonnewsroom.org/article/what-mormons-believe-about-jesus-christ
saab
 
  1  
Reply Wed 22 Mar, 2017 10:42 am
@cicerone imposter,
I am not suprised - after all the believe in Jesus and call themselves Jesus Christ latter day saints.
But if you see them strictly from a theological aspects LDS doctrines regarding the nature of God and the potential of mankind differ significantly from mainstream Christianity. That is why they are not seen as Christians by many theologians.
Sorry, but I am not interested in Mormon propaganda, but about factual
theology.
0 Replies
 
Greatest I am
 
  1  
Reply Sat 25 Mar, 2017 03:52 pm
@perennialloner,
perennialloner wrote:

Quote:
I disagree with your premise. And as I said before, a long time ago, you have to define ideology otherwise I find it incredibly unfair for you to be picking and choosing every single thing in which you find morally abhorrent that formerly existed or presently exists in Muslim communities and say each and every one of those things are part and parcel of Islam's ideology. I disagree with practices that exist in some or even many Muslim communities, because they clearly do not belong in the twenty-first century.


If you really need ideology defined, try the dictionary. I am not inventing new words or interpretations of that word.

Quote:
However, practices such as these should not delegitimize Islam and the people who practice Islam, believing in their God and his message.



So you would not delegitimize the message and God that is depicted in this link?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T9bEkGd1AVo

Regards
DL
Greatest I am
 
  0  
Reply Sat 25 Mar, 2017 03:59 pm
@saab,
saab wrote:

You come up with a list of atrocities committed by Chrisitans.
This list is a rather clear anti Catholic list.
They mention rumours and there might have been.... it is partly without facts.
Of course there are Christians who have not lived a Christian life
This man here is mentioned as a Catholic - I have not found anyhting which points to him doing these things because he is a Catholic.
Ante Pavelić ; was a Croatian fascist dictator who led the Ustaše movement and the Independent State of Croatia (NDH), established in parts of occupied Yugoslavia during World War II with the support of both Fascist Italy and Nazi Germany. While in power, Pavelić pursued genocidal policies against ethnic and racial minorities such as Serbs, Jews, and Romani

To be fair you cannot just start to list things which happened hundred of years ago and compare them with what is going on now.

A lot changed over the centuries.
Christians were against slavery - just to mention one thing.
Politicians with a Christian background have been behind an equal life for their citizens what education, social benefits, healthcare - the list is long.

If you want to fair compare a list of bad and good things and see which one wins.



Look at the big picture for both Christianity and Islam.

They are both intolerant, homophobic and misogynous and both used violence, Jihads and Inquisitions to grow their religions instead of good deeds.

I see little different even though we have brought Christianity to heel and forced it to be more civilized.

Regards
DL
0 Replies
 
perennialloner
 
  1  
Reply Sat 25 Mar, 2017 05:39 pm
@Greatest I am,
Well, okay. Ideology, according to the google dictionary, is a set of ideas. Cicerone already told you the five pillars of Islam. They're called pillars because they're fundamental.

1.1 Shahada: Faith.
1.2 Salat: Prayer.
1.3 Zakāt: Charity.
1.4 Sawm: Fasting.
1.5 Hajj: Pilgrimage to Mecca.

You tell me which is immoral to its core.
Krumple
 
  1  
Reply Sat 25 Mar, 2017 07:18 pm
@perennialloner,
perennialloner wrote:

Well, okay. Ideology, according to the google dictionary, is a set of ideas. Cicerone already told you the five pillars of Islam. They're called pillars because they're fundamental.

1.1 Shahada: Faith.
1.2 Salat: Prayer.
1.3 Zakāt: Charity.
1.4 Sawm: Fasting.
1.5 Hajj: Pilgrimage to Mecca.

You tell me which is immoral to its core.


Pilgrimage to Mecca.

Its immoral to imprison an asteroid and worship it.
0 Replies
 
 

Related Topics

Obama '08? - Discussion by sozobe
Let's get rid of the Electoral College - Discussion by Robert Gentel
McCain's VP: - Discussion by Cycloptichorn
Food Stamp Turkeys - Discussion by H2O MAN
The 2008 Democrat Convention - Discussion by Lash
McCain is blowing his election chances. - Discussion by McGentrix
Snowdon is a dummy - Discussion by cicerone imposter
TEA PARTY TO AMERICA: NOW WHAT?! - Discussion by farmerman
 
Copyright © 2024 MadLab, LLC :: Terms of Service :: Privacy Policy :: Page generated in 0.03 seconds on 04/30/2024 at 12:19:48