The Quotable Reich

@Baldimo,

Baldimo wrote:

Your theory falls apart at step 5, which is what you keep missing. Motor voter laws and the ability of illegal immigrants to get drivers license. ie: CA and other states. You're just assume they are using a fake name because they are an illegal immigrant, but you miss that they have a drivers license and it is at the DMV where you can register to vote.

I would like some more information on how you imagine this process would happen.

A regular driver license looks different from an AB-60.

An AB-60 driver license says, on the card itself "This card is not acceptable for official federal purposes. This license is issued only as a license to drive a motor vehicle. It does not establish eligibility for employment, voter registration, or public benefits."

So how, in your imagination, would someone with an AB-60 walk into a DMV office, and register to vote?

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@old europe,

My CA license has the statement, "This license is issued to drive a vehicle: it does not establish eligibility for employment, voter registration or public benefit."

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Robert Reich
12 hrs ·
With the greatest threat to American democracy in living memory, a Republican president who's seriously unhinged, and a Republican congress unwilling to stand up to his demagoguery, where's the Democratic Party?

Is it leading the resistance? Is it mobilizing the grass roots of America to take back the House and Senate in 2018? Is it loud and indignant and forceful?

No. With the exception of a few notable and courageous Democrats, the Party as a whole has practically disappeared. If the Democratic Party doesn't act, we will create a third party that will.

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@edgarblythe,

edgarblythe wrote:

Robert Reich
12 hrs ·
With the greatest threat to American democracy in living memory,

Exaggerate much? I wonder how much an author like Reich preaches to his audience and how much they actually believe.

1 Reply

@edgarblythe,

Been waiting on that third party for a decade.

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@old europe,

Quote:

An AB-60 driver license says, on the card itself "This card is not acceptable for official federal purposes. This license is issued only as a license to drive a motor vehicle. It does not establish eligibility for employment, voter registration, or public benefits."

So how, in your imagination, would someone with an AB-60 walk into a DMV office, and register to vote?

Did you miss the part about it being against Federal Law to verify ID when someone registers to vote? No ID is checked, it is s simple "check box" that is used to "verfiy" citizenship, under penalty of law. That's it, nothing more.

1 Reply

@McGentrix,

The only exaggeration is the third party threat. As badly as we need a liberal party, Democrats seem afraid to commit. Most elected Democrats are echoing their acts of GW Bush's term, when they voted for all his bad ideas.

1 Reply

@edgarblythe,

edgarblythe wrote:

The only exaggeration is the third party threat. As badly as we need a liberal party, Democrats seem afraid to commit. Most elected Democrats are echoing their acts of GW Bush's term, when they voted for all his bad ideas.

So, Trump is a greater threat to the US than the Cuban missile crisis? Than Germany and Japan in WW2? Than the cession of the south and the Civil War? Than Jimmy Carter?

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@McGentrix,

I read an opinion article the other day that suggests the world order, mostly created and sustained by the USA has begun to come apart and that Trump is likely to push it over the edge, leaving us with the sort of international politics that lead up to the two world wars. I lost the link, but it is bound to pop up again.

The Cuban missile crisis was all bluster. Jimmy Carter is the only ex president I have much affection for. The Civil War, much like Korea, never really ended.

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@edgarblythe,

Quote:

If the Democratic Party doesn't act, we will create a third party that will.

The democratic party is owned by the same people who own the republicans. Our only chance is a third party which I dont see coming anytime soon.The ACA could have been passed with a proper program except for a group of conservative democrats who gave in to the insurance and drug companies.

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@RABEL222,

Money has great influence on politicians if they hope to run again.

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@RABEL222,

RABEL222 wrote:

Quote:
If the Democratic Party doesn't act, we will create a third party that will.

The democratic party is owned by the same people who own the republicans. Our only chance is a third party which I dont see coming anytime soon.The ACA could have been passed with a proper program except for a group of conservative democrats who gave in to the insurance and drug companies.

edgarblythe wrote:

The only exaggeration is the third party threat. As badly as we need a liberal party, Democrats seem afraid to commit. Most elected Democrats are echoing their acts of GW Bush's term, when they voted for all his bad ideas.

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@Baldimo,

Baldimo wrote:

Quote:
An AB-60 driver license says, on the card itself "This card is not acceptable for official federal purposes. This license is issued only as a license to drive a motor vehicle. It does not establish eligibility for employment, voter registration, or public benefits."

So how, in your imagination, would someone with an AB-60 walk into a DMV office, and register to vote?

Did you miss the part about it being against Federal Law to verify ID when someone registers to vote? No ID is checked, it is s simple "check box" that is used to "verfiy" citizenship, under penalty of law. That's it, nothing more.

You mean Federal Law only allows for collecting enough identifying information as is necessary to verify eligibility to vote?

California motor voter laws allow the DMV to collect enough information to check eligibility, then electronically transmits that data from the DMV to the office of the Secretary of State. There, citizenship is verified and the name is added to the voter rolls.

How does that allow non-citizens to vote?

1 Reply

@old europe,

Quote:

You mean Federal Law only allows for collecting enough identifying information as is necessary to verify eligibility to vote?

A name, an address and what, a check mark that says you are a citizen and can vote? It doesn't require anyone to verify anything. Have you ever gone on a voter registration drive before? You don't ask for ID's.

Quote:

California motor voter laws allow the DMV to collect enough information to check eligibility, then electronically transmits that data from the DMV to the office of the Secretary of State. There, citizenship is verified and the name is added to the voter rolls.

Sorry but having lived in CA, they are not as efficient as you want them to be. Do you want to bet the election process on their efficiency? I don't. This is why I'm interested to see the results of an investigation, that targets every state and their registration rolls.

Quote:

How does that allow non-citizens to vote?

It doesn't allow them to vote but that doesn't mean that they can't. We shall see what any investigation does or doesn't come up with.

CA brought online their decade late single database registration system. They said they cleared it for duty, but only time will tell if the system is actuate and maintained properly. It seems they are at least on the right path. Now if they can implement Voter ID, it will secure their election system that much more.

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@Baldimo,

Doesn't make any difference on what "you" think about voter fraud.
http://www.factcheck.org/2016/10/trumps-bogus-voter-fraud-claims/

Pew Research's 14% was voter registration were outdated, not voter fraud.

1 Reply

@cicerone imposter,

When are you going to get the idea that I don't care about Trumps claims, I have had an issue with our voter system for many years now. I didn't vote for the guy so why keep asking me to defend him and his statements? Do you think you are going to get me with some sort of "gotcha" moment so you can call me a racist and a bigot like you do Trump on an hourly basis? We get it, you think anyone who isn't a left of center person is a racist and a bigot, we get it. The problem is for some of the things you call him out on are not really what you want them to be and most reasonable people can see that.

1 Reply

@Baldimo,

Baldimo wrote:

A name, an address and what, a check mark that says you are a citizen and can vote? It doesn't require anyone to verify anything. Have you ever gone on a voter registration drive before? You don't ask for ID's.

So? That alone doesn't allow anyone to vote. It's just information that gets collected in order to check if someone is actually eligible. Do you expect people to carry around their birth certificates, just in case someone wants to see their papers?

Also, why are you mixing up voter registration drives, AB-60s, and registration at the DMV through motor voter laws? Are you just throwing random points out there to create fear, uncertainty and doubt?

Baldimo wrote:

Sorry but having lived in CA, they are not as efficient as you want them to be. Do you want to bet the election process on their efficiency? I don't. This is why I'm interested to see the results of an investigation, that targets every state and their registration rolls.

So your core point here is: I don't trust the government to follow their own laws - better get in the government?

Baldimo wrote:

It doesn't allow them to vote but that doesn't mean that they can't.

No, that's exactly what it means: non-citizens can't vote.

Earlier, you made an authoritative claim that illegal immigrants can get a drivers license, and that this allows them to register to vote at the DMV. That's obviously and blatantly false, and now you're dithering and wiggling around, throwing out things like voter registration drives and Federal Law, claiming that the election process may be undermined by California's inefficiency in verifying voter eligibility, or arguing that the registration database system may be nonfunctional.

All of that without any evidence whatsoever.

1 Reply

In NYS all you need to is sign your name and it has to sort of resemble the signature next to it.

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@McGentrix,

That's the system we have in our county in California. How does that prove voter fraud?
My legal signature doesn't look the same every time I sign it.

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@old europe,

Quote:

So? That alone doesn't allow anyone to vote. It's just information that gets collected in order to check if someone is actually eligible.

Once entered into the system, what prevents them from voting? How does CA secure the vote at the next level? Checking ID's when you vote? Nope. Where is the next level of protection?

Quote:

Do you expect people to carry around their birth certificates, just in case someone wants to see their papers?

I expect people to have a proper form of ID. How do you get by without an ID? Do you feel as if you have to have your "papers" on you when you go about town?

Quote:

Also, why are you mixing up voter registration drives, AB-60s, and registration at the DMV through motor voter laws? Are you just throwing random points out there to create fear, uncertainty and doubt?

These are all valid ways in which to register to vote, shouldn't they all be mentioned in such a discussion? Do we only discuss one way of registering to vote?

Quote:

So your core point here is: I don't trust the government to follow their own laws - better get in the government?

I don't trust a state that seems to invest more in the protection of non-citizens then it does the actual people they are suppose to care for. So no, I don't trust the state of CA any farther then an Ewok can throw them.

Quote:

No, that's exactly what it means: non-citizens can't vote.

I'll agree on principle, but not in practice.

Quote:

Earlier, you made an authoritative claim that illegal immigrants can get a drivers license, and that this allows them to register to vote at the DMV.

That is not what I said. I said the process takes place at the same time and there is nothing preventing them from checking the box on the form saying they are a US citizen.

Quote:

That's obviously and blatantly false, and now you're dithering and wiggling around, throwing out things like voter registration drives and Federal Law, claiming that the election process may be undermined by California's inefficiency in verifying voter eligibility, or arguing that the registration database system may be nonfunctional.

All of that without any evidence whatsoever.

Dithering and wiggling around. Interesting choice of words. I haven't done any of those things, I've simply pointed out the laws and methods used to register to vote. I will say I didn't know about the Votecal project, which is new this past election cycle. We will have to see if it works out as they claim.

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The Quotable Reich

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