McCain condemns ad, Kerry's commander backs off

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McCain condemns 'dishonest' anti-Kerry ad
Associated Press

WASHINGTON -- Republican Sen. John McCain, a former prisoner of war in Vietnam, called an ad criticizing John Kerry's military service "dishonest and dishonorable" and urged the White House today to condemn it as well.

The White House declined.

"It was the same kind of deal that was pulled on me," McCain said in an interview with The Associated Press, comparing the anti-Kerry ad to tactics in his bitter Republican primary fight with President Bush.

The 60-second ad features Vietnam veterans who accuse the Democratic presidential nominee of lying about his decorated Vietnam War record and betraying his fellow veterans by later opposing the conflict.

"When the chips were down, you could not count on John Kerry," one of the veterans, Larry Thurlow, says in the ad. Thurlow didn't serve on Kerry's swiftboat, but says he witnessed the events that led to Kerry winning a Bronze Star and the last of his three Purple Hearts. Kerry's crewmates support the candidate and call him a hero.

The ad, scheduled to air in a few markets in Ohio, West Virginia and Wisconsin, was produced by Stevens, Reed, Curcio and Potham, the same team that produced McCain's ads in 2000.

"I wish they hadn't done it," McCain said of his former advisers. "I don't know if they knew all the facts."

Asked if the White House knew about the ad or helped find financing for it, McCain said, "I hope not, but I don't know. But I think the Bush campaign should specifically condemn the ad."

McCain, chairman of Bush's campaign in Arizona, later said the Bush campaign has denied any involvement and added, "I can't believe the president would pull such a cheap stunt."

White House spokesman Scott McClellan declined to condemn the ad. He did denounce the proliferation of spending by independent groups, such as the anti-Kerry veterans organization, that are playing on both sides of the political fence.

"The president thought he got rid of this unregulated soft money when he signed the bipartisan campaign finance reform into law," McClellan said. A chief sponsor of that bill, which Bush initially opposed, was McCain.

In 2000, Bush's supporters sponsored a rumor campaign against McCain in the South Carolina primary, helping Bush win the primary and the nomination. McCain's supporters have never forgiven the Bush team.

McCain said that's all in the past to him, but he's speaking out against the anti-Kerry ad because "it reopens all the old wounds of the Vietnam War, which I spent the last 35 years trying to heal."

"I deplore this kind of politics," McCain said. "I think the ad is dishonest and dishonorable. As it is, none of these individuals served on the boat (Kerry) commanded. Many of his crew have testified to his courage under fire. I think John Kerry served honorably in Vietnam. I think George Bush served honorably in the Texas Air National Guard during the Vietnam War."

Retired Adm. Roy Hoffmann, head of the Swift Boat group, said they respected McCain's "right to express his opinion and we hope he extends to us the same respect and courtesy, particularly since we served with John Kerry, we knew him well and Sen. McCain did not."

McCain himself spent more than five years in a Vietnam prisoner of war camp. A bona fide war hero, McCain, like Kerry, used his war record as the foundation of his presidential campaign.

The Kerry campaign has denounced the Swift Boat Veterans for Truth, saying none of the men in the ad served on the boat that Kerry commanded. Three veterans on Kerry's boat that day -- Jim Rassmann, who says Kerry saved his life, Gene Thorson and Del Sandusky, the driver on Kerry's boat, said the group was lying.

They say Kerry was injured, and Rassmann called the group's account "pure fabrication."

The general counsel for the Kerry campaign and the Democratic National Committee sent television stations a letter asking them not to run the ad because it is "an inflammatory, outrageous lie" by people purporting to have served with Kerry.

Hoffmann said none of the 13 veterans in the commercial served on Kerry's boat but rather were in other swiftboats within 50 yards of Kerry's. The group claims that there was no gunfire on the day Kerry pulled Rassmann from a muddy river in the Mekong Delta and that Kerry's arm was not wounded, as he has claimed.

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Done. *THUD*

That little issue is offically deceased.

What do you suppose will be next for the GOP purveyors of slime?

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Like most stories told from multiple points of view, this one has different versions. "Eyewitness Accounts" of the same incident can vary widely ... something which confounds otherwise straightforward legal procedings all the time. When a controversy such as this arises, it is useful to consider the backgrounds and likely motivations of those involved, as wel as the preponderance of testimony. In that regard, it appears Kerry has 9 staunch supporters, and several times as many detractors, among whom is numbered only one veteran of Kerry's crew.

I expect controversy involving Kerry's record, military and otherwise, has but barely begun. This flap likely is a love tap compared to the roundhouse blows almost certain to follw. Politics is a bloodsport. I would be unsurprised should this particular ad backfire. Should it not, and should it not fade to onscurity in the relative near term, it will prove quite inconvenient for Kerry. Should that prove the case, or should other Vietnam-related negative allegations arise, Kerry has no one to blame but himself; he is the one who has made his Vietnam service the cornerstone of his image while at the same time his anti-war activities have alienated a huge number of vets. Kerry asked for this, whatever comes of it.

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One thing for sure, while Kerry was actually fighting in Vietnam, Bush was hiding. No amount of whitewash will ever alter that fact. A lot of military came home and, having recognized the folly of that war, became anti-Vietnam War activists. I did the same. It was the moral thing to do.

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CNN's Inside Politics had their story this afternoon on the smears on Kerry's Vietnam service.

What went unrevealed in CNN's little expose' was the fact that none of the SBVFT vets actually served on the same boat as John Kerry. In fact, all the men who did, with the exception of the one who is deceased, were on stage with Kerry last Thursday night.

Judy Woodruff interviewed Larry Thurlow, who is refuting not only Kerry's account but the one in the official record of the Bronze Star commendation, and Jim Rassman, whose life John Kerry saved.

Thurlow was claiming that during Kerry's rescue of Rassman, there was no enemy fire at all, and hence Kerry didn't deserve a Purple Heart or a Bronze Star. Rassman stood his ground, saying that Thurlow must be telling his story for partisan reasons.

A simple Google search reveals a completely different account from the one Thurlow declares in American History magazine from this past April. While Kerry was rescuing Rassman:

Quote:

"Thurlow was struggling to get PCF-3's wounded gunner out of his hole and onto the deck when the damaged Swift ran aground hard on a shoal on the right side of the river, sending Thurlow somersaulting into the water. At the same moment, the five Swifts came under fire from the right side again, and Kerry remembered thinking that was it -- they were going to get completely cut off and annihilated in a crossfire."

Thurlow noted in the IP interview that he was thrown into the water that day, but didn't say why. The American History article also notes:

Quote:

"Kerry and the other wounded men received medical attention aboard a Coast Guard cutter, which was the closest ship capable of treating them. Along with a third Purple Heart for the injury to his right arm, Kerry was also awarded a Bronze Star for his bravery, as was Larry Thurlow."

In other words, if Kerry doesn't deserve his bronze star, Thurlow doesn't deserve his either.

But I don't see him rushing to give it back.

It's really shameful to allow a vet like Thurlow, whatever kind of person he is now, to tarnish his own heroism by encouraging these lies.

If George W. Bush had the slightest understanding of honor, he would never allow this by his surrogates.

It's just disgusting. But that sort of thing has never slowed the GOP down before.

I'll let Col. David Hackworth have the last word:

Quote:

The grousers, to a man, seem to be simply passing on secondhand bilge that they ought to stow in their sea bags and lay off.

(Oh, did I forget to mention that Bush still, after losing and finding his service records, has some months missing?)

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I think this issue is a huge win for Kerry.

The Republican come off looking shallow and mean spirit.

Kerry gets to keep talking about his Vietnam Service with a prominant republican McCain backing him up.

These attacks are wonderful for the Democrats.

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I hope you're right, ebrown.

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CNN was wrong, at least one of kerrys crew is openly against him, Steven Gardner.

The truth about Kerrys dishonorable activities in nam is just starting to leak out. This is huge, when the book is released it will hurt Kerry badly, that is why he has his legal team working feverishly to stop this book.

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Right. That's why the storeies pro and con break on political affiliation, with the recipients of Kerry's bravery on his side.

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Veteran Backs Off Attack on Kerry's War Record
Fri Aug 6, 2004 01:33 PM ET
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BOSTON (Reuters) - John Kerry's commanding officer in Vietnam has backed away from attacks on the Democratic presidential candidate, saying he made a mistake in accusing the U.S. senator of having lied about his wartime record.
George Elliott, who was one of Kerry's superiors in Vietnam when he was awarded medals for heroic actions, had signed an affidavit suggesting Kerry did not deserve the Silver Star.

In the document, Elliott said, "I was never informed that he had simply shot a wounded, fleeing Viet Cong in the back."

But in Friday's Boston Globe, Elliott said: "It was a terrible mistake probably for me to sign the affidavit with those words. I'm the one in trouble here."

Elliott told the newspaper he thinks Kerry did deserve the medal.

"I still don't think he (Kerry) shot the guy in the back," Elliott is quoted as saying in the Globe.

Kerry used his nominating convention in Boston in July to paint himself as a decorated war hero capable of leading the nation in troubled times and a man better qualified to be commander-in-chief than President Bush.

But Elliott and other members of a group called Swift Boat Veterans for Truth, oppose Kerry.

This week they launched a television advertisement accusing the Democrat of having lied about his service in Vietnam and hurting other veterans by criticizing the war after returning home. Next week the group will publish a book, "Unfit for Command: Swift Boat Veterans Speak Out Against John Kerry."

Elliott was not immediately available for comment.

Kerry, arguing his combat experience in Vietnam qualifies him as a strong leader on national security issues, has surrounded himself with other veterans who have said the candidate did heroic deeds to save his own crew mates.

The new attacks on Kerry sparked an angry response from Republican Sen. John McCain, also a Vietnam veteran, who called the attack dishonorable and dishonest and urged the Bush administration to also denounce the ad.

The administration distanced itself from the advertisement on Thursday but did not condemn it.

"We have not and we will not question Sen. Kerry's service in Vietnam," said White House spokesman Scott McClellan.

© Reuters 2004. All Rights Reserved.

http://www.reuters.com/newsArticle.jhtml?type=politicsNews&storyID=5899870

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I just watched Andrea Mitchell on Hardball. She said that she was in contact with Elliot's family and Elliot stands by the Swiftboatveteransfortruth ad.

The liberal media has now spoken, is that good enough...

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If it were a liberal media, Dean would probably be the Democratic nominee instead of Kerry. The press sabotaged him with negativity at every turn. In short, the lie that the media is liberal don't fool as many people now.

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The media didn't do Dean in, the DNC was smart enough to know that closer to center is what the majority of America wants.

Kerry was willing to portray himself as centrist, Dean wasn't.

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Your spin -

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and I'm stickin' to it. :wink:

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It's a sticky one, all right.

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It ain't ready to lay down just yet:

Quote:

Anti-Kerry Vietnam Veterans Hold Strong

The following statement from Swift Boat Veterans for Truth is in response to an article appearing in the morning edition of the Boston Globe ("Veteran Retracts Criticism of Kerry") which implies that one Vietnam Veteran wishes to retract an affidavit he signed regarding John Kerry's actions during and after Kerry's time in Vietnam. The signed affidavit can be seen below.
"Captain George Elliott describes an article appearing in today's edition of the Boston Globe by Mike Kranish as extremely inaccurate and highly misstating his actual views.
He reaffirms his statement in the current advertisement paid for by the Swift Boat Veterans for Truth, Captain Elliott reaffirms his affidavit in support of that advertisement, and he reaffirms his request that the ad be played. [See both affidavits below.]

"Additional documentation will follow. The article by Mr. Kranish is particularly surprising given page 102 of Mr. Kranish's own book quoting John Kerry as acknowledging that he killed a single, wounded, fleeing Viet Cong soldier whom he was afraid would turn around.

"Swift Boat Veterans for Truth has more than 250 supporters who are revealing first hand, eyewitness accounts of numerous incidents concerning John Kerry's military service record. The organization will continue to discuss much of what John Kerry has reported as fact concerning his four-month tour of duty in Vietnam."

The linked website has reproductions both of Mr Elliott's original affidavit and the one filed in response the the Kranish/Globe story today, which refutes Mr Kranih's assertions.

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PDiddie wrote:

CNN's Inside Politics had their story this afternoon on the smears on Kerry's Vietnam service.

What went unrevealed in CNN's little expose' was the fact that none of the SBVFT vets actually served on the same boat as John Kerry. In fact, all the men who did, with the exception of the one who is deceased, were on stage with Kerry last Thursday night.

Judy Woodruff interviewed Larry Thurlow, who is refuting not only Kerry's account but the one in the official record of the Bronze Star commendation, and Jim Rassman, whose life John Kerry saved.

Thurlow was claiming that during Kerry's rescue of Rassman, there was no enemy fire at all, and hence Kerry didn't deserve a Purple Heart or a Bronze Star. Rassman stood his ground, saying that Thurlow must be telling his story for partisan reasons.

A simple Google search reveals a completely different account from the one Thurlow declares in American History magazine from this past April. While Kerry was rescuing Rassman:

Quote:
"Thurlow was struggling to get PCF-3's wounded gunner out of his hole and onto the deck when the damaged Swift ran aground hard on a shoal on the right side of the river, sending Thurlow somersaulting into the water. At the same moment, the five Swifts came under fire from the right side again, and Kerry remembered thinking that was it -- they were going to get completely cut off and annihilated in a crossfire."

Thurlow noted in the IP interview that he was thrown into the water that day, but didn't say why. The American History article also notes:

Quote:
"Kerry and the other wounded men received medical attention aboard a Coast Guard cutter, which was the closest ship capable of treating them. Along with a third Purple Heart for the injury to his right arm, Kerry was also awarded a Bronze Star for his bravery, as was Larry Thurlow."

In other words, if Kerry doesn't deserve his bronze star, Thurlow doesn't deserve his either.

But I don't see him rushing to give it back.

It's really shameful to allow a vet like Thurlow, whatever kind of person he is now, to tarnish his own heroism by encouraging these lies.

If George W. Bush had the slightest understanding of honor, he would never allow this by his surrogates.

It's just disgusting. But that sort of thing has never slowed the GOP down before.

I'll let Col. David Hackworth have the last word:

Quote:
The grousers, to a man, seem to be simply passing on secondhand bilge that they ought to stow in their sea bags and lay off.

(Oh, did I forget to mention that Bush still, after losing and finding his service records, has some months missing?)

thanks, pdid.
nimh's also covered this off nicely on another thread.

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Elliot's waffling. He's lost credibility.

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But Kerry's waffling doesn't lose him credibility?

Elliott says he never retracted his opinion of Kerry and his words were manufactured by a writer who, not incidentally, is on the Kerry campaign. That isn't exactly a waffle.

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McCain condemns ad, Kerry's commander backs off

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