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Does "had to call on the state to ball them out" mean...?

Forums: English, Esl, Grammar, English As A Second Language
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oristarA
 
Reply Thu 24 Sep, 2015 07:37 pm
Does "had to call on the state to ball them out" mean "had to rally the United States to drive them away/kick them out (of America or any nation affected by events such as 911)"?

Context:

http://i.imgur.com/lQNkT.jpg
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Type: Question • Score: 2 • Views: 606 • Replies: 18
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View best answer, chosen by oristarA
InfraBlue
 
  1  
Reply Thu 24 Sep, 2015 09:41 pm
Bail them out, not ball them out.
0 Replies
 
chai2
 
  1  
Reply Thu 24 Sep, 2015 09:41 pm
@oristarA,
It doesn't say "ball them out", it says "bail them out"
0 Replies
 
oristarA
 
  1  
Reply Thu 24 Sep, 2015 10:36 pm
Well, thank you for the correction.
Now the question is:
Does "had to call on the state to bail them out" mean "had to rally the United States to help them out"? Who's them?
InfraBlue
 
  1  
Reply Thu 24 Sep, 2015 11:25 pm
@oristarA,
"Them" are the perpetrators of the 9/11 attacks.
oristarA
 
  1  
Reply Fri 25 Sep, 2015 12:16 am
@InfraBlue,
InfraBlue wrote:

"Them" are the perpetrators of the 9/11 attacks.


The author says "suppose they'd killed the president...and drove the country into one o the worst depressions in its history and had to call on the state to bail them out."
Here, "they" are terrorists who killed the president and "had to call on...", that is, the subject of "had to" is exactly the perpetrators of 911.
Two possibilities for this:
(1) the author made a grammatical mistake.
(2) We's misinterpreted the meaning of "had to call on the state to bail them out."
McTag
 
  1  
Reply Fri 25 Sep, 2015 03:54 am
@oristarA,

Quote:
Does "had to call on the state to ball them out" mean "had to rally the United States to drive them away/kick them out (of America or any nation affected by events such as 911)"?


bail, not ball.

No, it means "Had to call on the government to assist."
oristarA
 
  1  
Reply Fri 25 Sep, 2015 04:42 am
@McTag,
McTag wrote:


Quote:
Does "had to call on the state to ball them out" mean "had to rally the United States to drive them away/kick them out (of America or any nation affected by events such as 911)"?


bail, not ball.

No, it means "Had to call on the government to assist."


Thanks.
But what is the subject of of the predicate "had to call on"?
McTag
  Selected Answer
 
  2  
Reply Fri 25 Sep, 2015 08:10 am
@oristarA,

Quote:
But what is the subject of of the predicate "had to call on"?


Aha, a good question because the sentence is clumsily constructed.

The sense is, the country (the people) had to call on the government to bail them out.

Well spotted. A gold star is on its way to you.
oristarA
 
  1  
Reply Fri 25 Sep, 2015 09:19 am
@McTag,
McTag wrote:


Quote:
But what is the subject of of the predicate "had to call on"?


Aha, a good question because the sentence is clumsily constructed.

The sense is, the country (the people) had to call on the government to bail them out.

Well spotted. A gold star is on its way to you.


Yeah, it seems to refer to "(the people) Had to call on the government to assist them (the people, not perpetrators of 911)." (that is, the government should help the people out/"bail them out")
0 Replies
 
InfraBlue
 
  1  
Reply Fri 25 Sep, 2015 10:28 am
@oristarA,
I don't see a mistake in that sentence.

It's saying that the terrorists, who are the subject of the sentence, had to call on the state, which is the object of the sentence, to bail the terrorists out after the terrorists drove the country into one of the worst depressions in its history.
oristarA
 
  1  
Reply Fri 25 Sep, 2015 11:10 am
@InfraBlue,
InfraBlue wrote:

I don't see a mistake in that sentence.

It's saying that the terrorists, who are the subject of the sentence, had to call on the state, which is the object of the sentence, to bail the terrorists out after the terrorists drove the country into one of the worst depressions in its history.


Well, please tell what "bail out" means in your mind,
InfraBlue
 
  1  
Reply Fri 25 Sep, 2015 01:27 pm
@oristarA,
To help out of a predicament.
oristarA
 
  1  
Reply Fri 25 Sep, 2015 02:02 pm
@InfraBlue,
InfraBlue wrote:

To help out of a predicament.


Well, do you think it is logically possible that terrorists request a government to help them out of a predicament while such a democratic government usually wants to fight against terrorism?
InfraBlue
 
  1  
Reply Fri 25 Sep, 2015 03:12 pm
@oristarA,
It was a hypothetical posed by the author in which the terrorists take over the country's government by establishing a military dictatorship.
McTag
 
  1  
Reply Fri 25 Sep, 2015 03:16 pm
@InfraBlue,

Infra, when you've painted yourself into a corner, time to stop digging. Smile
InfraBlue
 
  1  
Reply Fri 25 Sep, 2015 03:39 pm
@McTag,
Heh

I really don't see how the author's sentence is ungrammatical.
InfraBlue
 
  1  
Reply Fri 25 Sep, 2015 03:45 pm
The quote, by the way, is from this interview:
http://www.counterpunch.org/2012/04/30/talking-with-chomsky/
0 Replies
 
McTag
 
  2  
Reply Sat 26 Sep, 2015 01:25 am
@InfraBlue,

The sense is there, the meaning is clear, but it's like a transcript of a conversation. Ori is right, grammatically it doesn't hang together.
Maybe you need to be a foreigner!
0 Replies
 
 

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