Illinois Governor Commutes All Death Sentences

Why is the cost of prison building a red herring?

Oh, by the way, here is one person who sincerely and firmly believes that:

THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS CLOSURE.

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closure
Not even in degrees? Rolling Eyes

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Just what sort of a criminal justice system is it that forces a prisoner to take medication to get him fit enough to execute?
Insane that's what.

http://www.nytimes.com/2003/02/11/national/11DEAT.html?th

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(mixed you up with someone else back there, dadeo.)

Anywho, the multiplication of prisons has very little to do with prisoners being housed for crimes eligible for capital punishment. I'm still looking for a nationwide breakdown, but felons convicted of homicide account for less than 10% of the states I've looked at so far (CT, AZ, and CA). Drug possession crimes (not even trafficking, but just possession) account for almost a quarter of the total prison population in spite of the fact that the sentences for these crimes are relatively short -- and this doesn't include property crimes motivated by addiction (and artificially high costs of recreational drugs). In CT, only 2 percent of prisoners are serving terms of 60 years or more. Executing every single one of these prisoners would have a fairly negligible effect on the prison population.

First work morning of the week, need coffee, need statistics.

And, oh yeah, need to do some work...

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Okay, here are some numbers for federal prisons. Probably a bit different than the overall numbers for state prisons, but numbers nonetheless. (Connecticut, apparently, is not very representative of the rest of the country in its violence and drug use...)Federal Prison Population by Offense (and other stuff)

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Good info.

The "percentage of sentenced prisoners who are drug offenders" growth was startling -- 16% in 1970, 55% in 2002.

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Imagine the savings if drug policies were changed. What earthly good does it do to imprison folks for simple possession of pot? Many here fear that our government efforts to protect us from attack endangers our constitutional liberties. A far greater threat is posed by the seizure of the personal property of people accused of possessing small amounts of grass for their own use.

Some drugs pose so great a threat to public health that they probably should always be illegal. Traffic in physically addictive narcotics, like heroin, may properly be a Federal crime. Others pose less risk to the country, and should be regulated by the States.

Decriminalization of marijuana would be a good place to begin reforming our drug policies.

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I'll smoke to that!

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This is the single most awful topic for me. While I can't agree
with the taxpayers dollars spending over $50,000 per year for
each inmate on death row - and I can't believe that the death
penalty is a viable solution - I am really torn. Our criminal
justice system is such a total failure in the US that it makes
no sense whatever way you look at it. I believe that all those
who break the laws should be incarcerated and kept from
doing harm to others ... I simply can not agree with what it
costs to keep your average prisoner per year (I hear it's a
minimum of $40,000) So many law abiding citizens have
far less than this to live on. I feel that there must be a way
found that puts the people who break the laws to WORK in
a manner that earns the money that it costs for their care.
It is terribly innapropriate that law abiding citizens with no
medical care, no dental care and have far worse housing,
than prison inmates. Worse still that these same taxpayers
must help foot the bill to keep convicted criminals in better
housing, having all of their medical and legal needs met, when
many of our law abiding citizens have far less security and
means to get medical care. We still have migrant farm workers
in this country who are US citizens, living in poverty and they
don't go around breaking any laws. So there is such an issue
in the unfairness of this entire situation that I am truly torn
about what ought to be done with these death row prisoners.
Violent criminals who have multiple life sentences are such a
drain on our economy - but then, on the other hand - if our
own government were more interested in handling a budget
in such a way that the poorest of our law abiding citizens
were better off than our criminals, I must admit that I would
feel far more comfortable with commuting all these death
penalties. WE need to figure out how to AFFORD to keep all
these law breakers - at a far lesser cost to the taxpayer. The
prisoners ought to be responsible for earning their own room,
their own food, their medical attention, legal assitance & whatever
else they have which many American citizens have to do without.

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Asherman, I doubt that the majority of prisoners are there
for using recreational drugs. Granted most of them DO use
drugs - they are incarcerated for far worse crimes than
smoking pot, shooting heroin. Child molesters get out in 2
years (multiple cases of child molesters) Murderers get
a life sentence, end up spending maybe 10 years in jail.
Federal law breakers are treated to the best housing &
conditions our legal system has to offer criminals. Drugs,
sure - I'll agree that our government is foolish, just as
it was during prohibition, for trying to force its beliefs
about drugs - about speed limits - about tons of things.
In fact, the US govt meddles in the affairs of citizens
more than most governments do. But then if you will recall,
there were many people in law enforcement who made a
bundle of $$$$$ by turning a blind eye to the use of booze,
and now to the use of drugs. Greed/graft/lawlessness seem
to be the cornerstone of life in America today.

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babsatamelia wrote:

Asherman, I doubt that the majority of prisoners are there for using recreational drugs. Granted most of them DO use drugs - they are incarcerated for far worse crimes than
smoking pot, shooting heroin.

Babsatamelia, Patiodog just provided some statistics on it, some three-four posts up. 54,8% of Federal prison population is there for drug offenses.

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Moreover, the criminalization of drugs draws users into contact with a necessarily criminal community, just as did with the prohibition of alcohol.

(The numbers might be lower in nonfederal prisons, as many drug offenses fall under federal jurisdiction, but it's high either way.)

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costs
Babs, a very reasonable complaint. I just wonder, however, what should be done. Should we put them to work? I should think that would be reasonable; put them to work doing some kind of community service in areas where free citizens do not want to work. But I do not think we should somehow take it out on the prisoners, to inflict "cruel and unusual punishment" on them (e.g., severely reduced diets and medical care) because there are citizens (e.g., farm workers) who are suffering (due to our economic system: remember competitive capitalism PRODUCES "failures", people who suffer not for crimes but because of their inability to compete. But this cannot be blamed, of course, on prisoners--many of them committed crimes because of their inability to compete effectively in the legitimate competitive game. The solution to this problem is very worthy of our time. Credit to you, Babs for bringing increased attention to it. But please don't minimize the number of people who are in prison because of pot smoking. Statistical facts should not be denied out of hand.

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It always angers me when one politician or judge makes a decision that affects so many people. Those prisoners were put there for a reason. They went through the system and were found guilty. This system which is in accordance with that laws of the land put those people on death row. And one person thinks he's doing the world a favor by abusing power and forcing his own beliefs on everyone else by taking them off death row.

There will still be a death sentence in that state, only know you will only get off if you were lucky enough to have been on death row when the pardon happened.

What an outrage. Our government gives too much power to presidents, governors and judges. That's where our system has it's major flaws.

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Hmmh - I think, how it works that's exactly the system: commonly called democracy.

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roverroad wrote:

It always angers me when one politician or judge makes a decision that affects so many people. Those prisoners were put there for a reason. They went through the system and were found guilty. This system which is in accordance with that laws of the land put those people on death row. And one person thinks he's doing the world a favor by abusing power and forcing his own beliefs on everyone else by taking them off death row.

There will still be a death sentence in that state, only know you will only get off if you were lucky enough to have been on death row when the pardon happened.

What an outrage. Our government gives too much power to presidents, governors and judges. That's where our system has it's major flaws.

Alternative? Flip a coin, if tails, then turn 'em over to a lynch mob?

First, as the new DNA technology has revealed, no insignificant number of people charged and convicted of crimes are shown to be innocent.

Second, the studies done (lots of them) demonstrate that there is no reduction in crime rates for a particular offence where that offence has a captial punishment consequence. No gain. None. So if you insist that it's a groovy thing to electrocute someone, recognize that you are being motivated by revenge and not any social good.

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blatham wrote:

First, as the new DNA technology has revealed, no insignificant number of people charged and convicted of crimes are shown to be innocent.

Than free the innocent ones and kill the guilty ones. This guy set them all free.

As far as that being Democracy, when one man makes the decision for everyone else without a vote, I call that dictatorship. I resize that in our REPUBLIC we vote those people in to make our decisions for us. Because I guess Americans can't think for themselves, but that is what's wrong with our system. Over all it's ok but this is an extreme abuse of the system.

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roverroad wrote:

This guy set them all free.

No he did not. You are making a demonstratably false claim.

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Quote:

Than free the innocent ones and kill the guilty ones. This guy set them all free.

The second sentence is false. The first sentence avoids the two points I made. Your post loses some value, you realize.

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Craven de Kere wrote:

roverroad wrote:
This guy set them all free.

No he did not. You are making a demonstratably false claim.

I didn't mean set them all free, I meant to say took them all of death row. i'm still waking up.

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Illinois Governor Commutes All Death Sentences

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