It's about time for a2k prime

No Timur. The problem is the personal attacks made to shut down discussions and shut out viewpoints.

I want interesting discussions with people who disagree with me (i.e. have diverse viewpoints). There are several people here that have disagreed with me respectfully without vulgarity or personal attacks or vulgar personal attacks. I appreciate that. That is why I am here.

The problem is the group of prominent members who make personal attacks specifically to shut down certain viewpoints and the people who hold them. Setanta and Izzy and EhBeth and Edgar and the rest of this clique have decided that certain viewpoints should be punished, and they enforce this with insults. They are also manipulating tags and thumbs (which isn't that important). The big problem is the personal attacks.

The solution to such bullying is to identify it and to stand up to it.

When people use personal attacks to shut down discussions and viewpoints, we trolls get very cranky.

I think we should consider lenobanks and gus to run the thing.

That's a lot easier than facing the truth which is a lot of people have independently seen through Max. For all his claims about civilised discourse he's as nasty as any of us. He's completely dishonest, lies about his circumstances and his character.

And he tries to make every thread about him, in this case being shunned by some imaginary 'in crowd.'

He'd rather play the victim than deal with reality.

Thank you Izzy for supporting my point about personal attacks (although these are fairly tame).

I think you get what I am saying. Anytime you would like to have a respectful discussion without any personal attacks, I am all for it.

A bucket of **** doesn't pretend to be anything other than a bucket of ****. A bucket of **** doesn't whine on about how hard it is to be a bucket of ****. And you can empty a bucket of **** on your roses, leaving you with a bucket.

Give me a bucket of **** any day.

Anyone looking for an exclusionary A2K should try to get into the A2K facebook.

Me: I want a big tent, and I am a big boy, I can handle the full on A2K.

You people have stood in my way long enough. I'm going to clown college!

Really? I have seen no requests to join that group in quite a while, and I believe I recognize most of the names in the group. If you don't ask to join a group, then the answer is always going to be no.

I dont want to join, because I want a big tent, and I mostly only use facebook to keep up on family pics. Plus I dont think that facebook works well to argue ideas, which is mostly what I am after. I know that some people dont agree.

Then don't complain that it's exclusionary, because it's certainly not intended to be.

Truth be told, A2k on Facebook is meant for exactly one purpose - to tell people news about an outage as they wouldn't be able to get news from A2k.

That is the big, dark secret of A2k on Facebook.

Several people have been in the threads claiming otherwise, Jane is the only one I remember by name however. And you cant deny that at base Facebook is intended to be exclusionary, that it is supposed to be a large part of its appeal.

Then they are mistaken.

Seriously. Like I said, it's just for informing people of outages. If people have a problem with Facebook then I'm afraid my bank account says that I don't run Facebook.

As for the complaints in the forums, I do take them seriously. I'd love to see some links if people are concerned. I would like to address their concerns. Thank you in advance for taking the time to find this information so that it can be put right.

On second thought Jane was probably talking about the group of people who have left here or mostly have, and who still meet up on Facebook after friending each other...not the A2K facebook page itself. In anycase she said that I would never be allowed in by the group, nor would others like me, because getting away from alleged loudmouths and disturbers of the peace is mostly the point. As is the point of the idea presented in the opening post here. It is just not my speed. I think life is naturally messy, at least if it is good, and while I agree that some policing is required and that sometimes civil standards need to be imposed by the collective I came to A2k because I had a relationship question and there was a lot of smart people here of different opinions and so this was a good place to collect thoughts on a problem I had. I stayed because it was a fairly operational arena of ideas. Anything that gets in the way of that is a problem for me, to include exclusion.

I don't think any facebook interaction between A2K members is a big deal.

Facebook is a closed platform. You own the threads you start. You can delete people's responses, and prevent people from either joining or talking. You can close yourself off to a group of people who agree with you if you want.

Able2know is an open platform where anyone can express their opinions and where people can't prevent responses to their posts.

The technology directs the community. I come to Able2know because it is an open platform. That some people might be interacting on facebook too doesn't concern me.

I did not claim concern, I said that people who want the small tent, those who want to be in an exclusionary setting, already have it available. There is no need to reinvent the wheel.

EDIT: and I dont say that exclusionary places are always bad. I have long been on forums for sexual abuse survivors and the people in their lives, which are highly exclusionary and are policed with a heavy hand, so that those who are currently traumatized will feel comfortable opening up. THat is a legit cause. But the purpose for these sites is very limited, a mass site like this should never be anywhere near that exclusionary.

Comparing someone to a bucket of ****. That is very classy Izzy.

We would do much better though, without the personal attacks.

Clearly he has an anger problem. I dont usually care about motivations of members here but Izzy is so over the top, and posts so much anger motivated content, that it would be helpful to know more about his problem. Maybe we could help.

I appreciate the clarification but I do want to make one thing clear. When things like this are said, and they turn out to be inaccurate, like any other retraction, people are a lot less likely to read it than they are to read the initial statement, which is buried back God knows how many posts. I do thank you, though.

Whoever people are friending on FB, or not, I have never felt is my concern. If they want to friend me, great. You'll see pictures of dogs and hear about my writing. Today I reported pea-sized hail coming down. A thrill a minute, I know.

If people feel excluded by that, then they are more than welcome to send me a friend request. My real name is excruciatingly easy to find as I have A2k on my resume.

And I throw out the welcome mat to the A2k Facebook group for anyone who wants to join. Like I said, it's generally only officially used to inform people of outages. Fortunately we haven't had many lately.

Apologies to the bucket.

Finally - it has been a long time - I'm considered "in".

I had that album..