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Same Sex Marriage

 
 
BillW
 
  1  
Reply Thu 5 Jun, 2003 03:19 pm
CodeBorg, I have previously written of a friend who was a hermaphrodite. At the age of thirteen he was made into a man. He was an accomplished artist, married and father 3 lovely daughters.

He told me that a part of him was missing and lost forever. It ruined him when they preformed the operation on him, especially without his consultation. Unfortunately, today he is dead - but he was a very caring person whom I miss.
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Misti26
 
  1  
Reply Sat 7 Jun, 2003 10:42 pm
How sad that is!
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cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Sun 8 Jun, 2003 11:16 am
If god created the hermaphrodite, how can he at the same time denounce homosexuality? I just don't get it, I guess. c.i.
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BillW
 
  1  
Reply Mon 9 Jun, 2003 04:16 pm
Denouncing is a human error atributed to God; or else (those that believe in a higher power Smile ), we would have to say - "God makes mistakes sometimes". How many problems does that put into the stew - which is an error and which is perfection - which is so/so?
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ehBeth
 
  1  
Reply Wed 11 Jun, 2003 05:40 am
link to toronto star article (i hope)


Quote:
Gay couple married after ruling
Couple celebrates end of 20-year fight
Judges rewrite definition of marriage


TRACEY TYLER AND TRACY HUFFMAN
STAFF REPORTERS

Two gay men said "I do" yesterday, after Ontario's highest court said "they can."

Crown Attorney Michael Leshner and his long-time partner Michael Stark were married by Mr. Justice John Hamilton in a hastily arranged ceremony in the jury waiting room of a Toronto courthouse, as a crowd that included everyone from judges to janitors looked on.

Just hours before, the Ontario Court of Appeal rewrote the definition of marriage to include same-sex couples, saying denying gays and lesbians the ability to marry offends their dignity, discriminates on the basis of sexual orientation and violates their equality rights under the Charter of Rights and Freedoms.

A unanimous three-judge panel, made up of Chief Justice Roy McMurtry and justices James MacPherson and Eileen Gillese, then took the issue further than any other court in the world.

Gay and lesbian marriage became legal in Ontario, effective immediately.
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blatham
 
  1  
Reply Sat 14 Jun, 2003 09:55 pm
ehBeth

Little by little, we get there. This was a nice step.
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ehBeth
 
  1  
Reply Sun 15 Jun, 2003 05:52 am
<nods>
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ehBeth
 
  1  
Reply Tue 17 Jun, 2003 08:51 pm
it gets even better! click

Quote:
Historic law will allow same-sex marriage, but give churches choice

ALEXANDER PANETTA
Canadian Press

Tuesday, June 17, 2003

OTTAWA (CP) - The federal government will overhaul the age-old definition of marriage and make Canada the world's third country to recognize same-sex matrimony, Prime Minister Jean Chretien announced Tuesday.

The landmark legislation will be drafted within weeks, then sent to the Supreme Court of Canada for fine-tuning and put before the House of Commons in a free vote by MPs months from now. But the prime minister made it clear Ottawa would not impose the new law on religious groups, who can still refuse to perform same-sex weddings. Canada would join Belgium and the Netherlands as the only countries allowing gay and lesbian weddings.

"What we're doing at this moment might put Canada at the forefront of any solutions that exist," Chretien said.

"What is important for me is the freedom of the churches to interpret according to their faith."

Huddled around a cabinet table, ministers sensed they were making history Tuesday as they spent a good part of the day haggling over details of the plan.

"There were a lot of vibes around the table," Justice Minister Martin Cauchon said.

"It's always special to be around the table when such an important decision is about to be debated."

One source said ministers unanimously supported the principle of same-sex marriage, but spent most of the time discussing how to navigate what could be a political minefield.

Polls have suggested Canadians are almost evenly split on the issue. Alberta immediately announced it would fight the move with all the jurisdictional clout at its disposal.

The law covering the changes will be ready within weeks - unusually speedy for such contentious legislation.

It will balance the need for equality with religious freedoms guaranteed in the Constitution, Chretien said.

The religious exemption is also intended to help assuage the fears of some skeptical members of the Liberal caucus and make the bill easier to pass.

"We don't want there to be a long period of uncertainty," Chretien said.

"We want to complete this file and deal with it as quickly as possible, and as soon as we have the reference, then the House of Commons will vote."

Bitterly divided federal Liberals did not willingly become trailblazers.

The government was forced to act after a series of court rulings struck down marriage laws. Some MPs had been urging Chretien to fight the lower court rulings to the finish in the Supreme Court.

Courts in Ontario, Quebec and British Columbia have ruled that the exclusion of gays and lesbians unjustifiably violates equality rights.

Ottawa was already preparing its response to those verdicts when it was hit last week by a bold ruling in the Ontario Court of Appeal.

Gays and lesbians were allowed to marry immediately after the Ontario verdict, and did so, under a new right denied to them throughout most of human history.

Ottawa was left with two major options: fight the ruling in the Supreme Court or rewrite the law.

Cauchon convinced his cabinet colleagues to drop their gloves.

"It's a great day for Canada," he said. "I'm very proud to be part of this country.

"This (decision) is important for freedom, for values, for what we believe and what we have in our Charter of Rights and freedoms."

One Canadian Alliance critic denounced the move as an abdication of parliamentary responsibility.

"The announcement . . . has cemented the irrelevance of Parliament on a fundamental social policy matter," said justice critic Vic Toews.

"The Liberals have abandoned their responsibility to the courts, and Parliament will not have its voice heard."

But the NDP and Bloc Quebecois will likely overwhelmingly support the bill, perhaps along with some Conservative MPs.

Parliament's most vocal gay-rights advocate was clearly overjoyed.

"I feel very proud to be a Canadian today," said Svend Robinson, an openly gay NDP MP.

"I salute the prime minister. I think that Jean Chretien has shown courageous leadership here."

Robinson said memories flooded into his minds while listening to the announcement.

The first one was of sitting across a negotiating table from Chretien in 1981, while parliamentarians were drafting clauses for the Charter of Rights.

He challenged Chretien - justice minister at the time - to include gay and lesbian rights in the charter.

"(He responded) right back to me that, 'This isn't an issue that Canadians are prepared to accept.' " Robinson recalled.

"Well we've come a long way."

The announcement was expected to meet some provincial resistance.

Quebec and Manitoba immediately endorsed the federal announcement, and Ontario is already issuing same-sex marriage licences because of the appeals-court ruling.

But Alberta appears headed for further court battles.

The right to marriage may be defined by Ottawa but it's up to the provinces to issue the licences, Alberta Justice Minister David Hancock said.

And Alberta has no intention to hand them out to same-sex couples, he said.

Instead, the province will invoke the Constitution's notwithstanding clause if Ottawa tries forcing it to hand out same-sex marriage licences.

The controversial clause allows governments to supersede parts of the Charter of Rights and Freedoms for a five-year period.

The historic view of marriage as a heterosexual institution was thought to be so obvious that it was never explicitly included in federal statutes.

It only became enshrined in federal law in recent years, including a bill in 2000 that extended full federal tax and social benefits to same-sex couples.

Gays and lesbians weren't satisfied with the changes.

They argued that current laws have resulted in a patchwork of inequality, as some provinces extend full benefits while others don't.

And, they argued, the issue at stake is human rights.
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blatham
 
  1  
Reply Tue 17 Jun, 2003 09:07 pm
ehBeth

bravo for sanity...bravo for equal treatment...bravo for celebrating human variation.

Notice how thrilled Cauchon was to be writing up this sort of liberating legislation. Perhaps we ought to write him and suggest he does it more often.
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