Surely, ican, you understand that the reason I pointed out the chronology of your references is that you claim that it is false that your reference B perused the same unreliable "intelligence" as your reference A. For example, your reference B perused a Defense Intelligence Agency (DIA) analytic report, ,"Special Analysis: Iraq's Inconclusive Ties to Al-Qaida,"--now pay special attention to the date, ican--published July 31, 2002, that your reference A did, ergo your reference B perused the same unreliable "intelligence" as your reference A. It would be my pleasure to go over this with you again if you're still having a difficult time comprehending the point, ican.
Your argument with what I said
here is that Iraq willingly harbored al Qaeda/Ansar al Islam in northern Iraq, ican. Is is not? And you've proceeded to provide your references thereof. Correct? One of my points is that the most your reference A could say about an Iraq/Al Qaeda link is that the most it could conclude about an Iraq/Al Qaeda link is that Iraq tolerated Ansar al Islam in the isolated area it did not control, and that Iraq may even have helped them. That's a weak argument for your position that Iraq willingly harbored al-Qaeda/Ansar al Islam in northern Iraq.
Another of my points is that your reference B has been demonstrated to be incompetent and demagogic by Associated Press writer Charles J. Hanley. For example:
Powell said "most United States experts" believed aluminum tubes sought by Iraq were intended for use as centrifuge cylinders for enriching uranium for nuclear bombs.
Energy Department experts and Powell's own State Department intelligence bureau had already dissented from this CIA view... No centrifuge program has been reported found.
"We have no indication that Saddam Hussein has ever abandoned his nuclear weapons program," Powell said.
On July 24, Foreign Minister Ana Palacio of Spain, a U.S. ally on Iraq, said there was "no evidence, no proof" of a nuclear bomb program before the war. No such evidence has been reported found since the invasion.
At two sites, Powell said trucks were "decontamination vehicles" associated with chemical weapons.
Nothing has been reported found since... Norwegian inspector Jorn Siljeholm told AP on March 19 that "decontamination vehicles" U.N. teams were led to by U.S. information invariably turned out to be water or fire trucks.
Powell said defectors had told of "biological weapons factories" on trucks and in train cars. He displayed artists' conceptions of such vehicles.
After the invasion, U.S. authorities said they found two such truck trailers in Iraq, and the CIA said it concluded they were part of a bioweapons production line. But no trace of biological agents was found on them, Iraqis said the equipment made hydrogen for weather balloons, and State Department intelligence balked at the CIA's conclusion.
According to Powell, unidentified sources said the Iraqis dispersed rocket launchers and warheads holding biological weapons to the western desert, hiding them in palm groves and moving them every one to four weeks.
Nothing has been reported found, after months of searching by U.S. and Australian troops in the nearly empty desert.
Powell noted Iraq had declared it produced 8,500 liters of the biological agent anthrax before 1991. None has been "verifiably accounted for," he said.
No anthrax has been reported found, post-invasion. The Defense Intelligence Agency (DIA), in a confidential report last September (five months before the Powell speech) said that although it believed Iraq had biological weapons it didn't know their nature, amounts, or condition.
Powell showed video of an Iraqi F-1 Mirage jet spraying "simulated anthrax." He said four such spray tanks were unaccounted for, and Iraq was building small unmanned aircraft "well suited for dispensing chemical and biological weapons."
According to U.N. inspectors' reports, the video predated the 1991 Gulf War, when the Mirage was said to have been destroyed, and three of the four spray tanks were destroyed in the 1990s. No small drones or other planes with chemical-biological capability have been reported found in Iraq since the invasion.
Powell said Iraq produced four tons of the nerve agent VX.
Powell didn't note that most of that was destroyed in the 1990s under U.N. supervision. No VX has been reported found since the invasion. Experts at Britain's International Institute of Strategic Studies said any pre-1991 VX most likely would have degraded anyway.
"We know that Iraq has embedded key portions of its illicit chemical weapons infrastructure within its legitimate civilian industry," Powell said.
No "chemical weapons infrastructure" has been reported found. The recently-disclosed DIA report of last September said there was "no reliable information" on where Iraq might have established chem-warfare facilities.
"Our conservative estimate is that Iraq today has a stockpile of between 100 and 500 tons of chemical-weapons agent," Powell said.
Powell gave no basis for the assertion, and no such agents have been reported found. That same DIA report had reported "no reliable information on whether Iraq is producing and stockpiling chemical weapons."
"Saddam Hussein has chemical weapons...And we have sources who tell us that he recently has authorized his field commanders to use them," Powell said.
No such weapons were used in the war and none was reported found.
Powell said 122-mm "chemical" warheads found by U.N. inspectors in January might be the "tip of an iceberg."
The warheads were empty, a fact Powell didn't note. No others have been reported found since the invasion.
Powell said "intelligence sources" indicate Iraq had a secret force of up to a few dozen prohibited Scud-type missiles. He said it also had a program to build newer, 600-mile-range missiles.
No Scud-type missiles have been reported found. No program for long-range missiles has been reported.
As far as his claims of an Iraq/al Qaeda/Ansar al-Islam harboring link, according to the source that Old Europe provided
here, American intelligence sources had said right before Powell's infamous speech before the UN that the intelligence was practically non-existent, and that most of the intelligence being used to support the idea of a link between al-Qa'eda and Saddam Hussein comes from Kurdish groups who are the bitter enemies of Ansar al-Islam.
"It is impossible to support the bald conclusions being made by the White House and the Pentagon given the poor quantity and quality of the intelligence available. There is uproar within the intelligence community on all of these points, but the Bush White House has quashed dissent." an American intelligence source is quoted as saying in OE's link.
Throughout Powell's demagoguery he sprinkled tidbits of inciteful terrorism such as:
"Less than a teaspoon of dry anthrax, a little bit about this amount--this is just about the amount of a teaspoon--less than a teaspoon full of dry anthrax in an envelope shutdown the United States Senate in the fall of 2001. This forced several hundred people to undergo emergency medical treatment and killed two postal workers just from an amount just about this quantity that was inside of an envelope."
"A single drop of VX [nerve agent] on the skin will kill in minutes."
"Call it ingenuous or evil genius, but the Iraqis deliberately designed their chemical weapons programs to be inspected. It is infrastructure with a built-in ally."
"Our conservative estimate is that Iraq today has a stockpile of between 100 and 500 tons of chemical weapons agent. That is enough agent to fill 16,000 battlefield rockets.
"Even the low end of 100 tons of agent would enable Saddam Hussein to cause mass casualties across more than 100 square miles of territory, an area nearly 5 times the size of Manhattan."
"We also have sources who tell us that, since the 1980s, Saddam's regime has been experimenting on human beings to perfect its biological or chemical weapons.
"A source said that 1,600 death row prisoners were transferred in 1995 to a special unit for such experiments. An eye witness saw prisoners tied down to beds, experiments conducted on them, blood oozing around the victim's mouths and autopsies performed to confirm the effects on the prisoners. Saddam Hussein's humanity--inhumanity has no limits."
"It is noteworthy that, over the last 18 months, Saddam Hussein has paid increasing personal attention to Iraqi's top nuclear scientists, a group that the governmental-controlled press calls openly, his nuclear mujahedeen. He regularly exhorts them and praises their progress. Progress toward what end?"
"Saddam Hussein's intentions have never changed. He is not developing the missiles for self-defense. These are missiles that Iraq wants in order to project power, to threaten, and to deliver chemical, biological and, if we let him, nuclear warheads."
"Less than a pinch--image a pinch of salt--less than a pinch of ricin, eating just this amount in your food, would cause shock followed by circulatory failure. Death comes within 72 hours and there is no antidote, there is no cure. It is fatal."
Thusly, I have demonstrated that your contention about about extradition of "AQ leadership" and or the lack thereof is merely speculation on your part is based on the fact that you rely on demonstrably discredited and unreliable information, ican. That your contention, furthermore, is based on your own flights of fancy in interpreting said discredited and unreliable information is self evident.
You speculate that the Iraq government refused to attempt to remove the terrorist bases from Iraq. Where in all of your references does it say exactly that, ican?
You speculate that the Iraq government had the wherewithal to do so. Where in all of your references does it say exactly that, ican?
You do not provide evidence demonstrating the credibility of the claim that the US even approached that government to perform the aforementioned, given the discredited and unreliable nature of your very references, ican.
About your contention in your response to OE that the connection/link between bin Laden and Iraq being superfluous, you are correct ican.
The point is that Powell accused Iraq of willingly harboring al-Qaeda and Ansar al-Islam, and that it willingly did nothing to extradite Zarqawi. There is no evidence of this only Powell's selfsame discredited, willful, instigative demagoguery.
