ossobuco
 
  2  
Reply Sat 5 Sep, 2015 10:16 am
Hebdo et al were a cartooning/satire group that attacked everybody in a kind of free for all equal opportunity. If I remember, Hebdo or one of the others was good friends with the black female politician and, this may well be misremembering by me, that she wasn't angry about it.

The thing about me and Slappy is that I long berated him for un PC jokes, and his reply was that everything can be a source of humor/satire. I finally turned a corner and gradually saw his point. Though I don't make cartoons like that myself, I can see the free speech of a group like Hebdo. And no, Auschwitz (my favorite writer is Primo Levi) and Stalin and so on are not sources of humor to me, and I would never draw that stuff, but I can see the Hebdo group being at base an anti-all-hate group itself. I didn't read them for years, as many apparently did, so of course I'm not sure. It's that I have a little room to glimpse that might be true.
izzythepush
 
  2  
Reply Sat 5 Sep, 2015 11:06 am
@Lash,
This isn't anger it's frustration. I come on here to debate, I'm getting sick of having to explain really basic things all the time.
Lash
 
  0  
Reply Sat 5 Sep, 2015 11:19 am
@izzythepush,
If you hadn't assumed so much, we might have had an interesting conversation.

I'll go ahead and block you, so if you don't respond to my posts, I will cease to be a source of frustration for you. Problem solved!
0 Replies
 
Lash
 
  1  
Reply Sat 5 Sep, 2015 07:21 pm
Going to see Bernie and Cornell West at Benedict University next weekend!!! Wooohoooo.
0 Replies
 
Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Reply Sun 6 Sep, 2015 11:45 am
Some people used to whoop it up when they ran to a gathering of Occupy Wall Street.

How'd that work out?
Lash
 
  0  
Reply Sun 6 Sep, 2015 11:47 am
@Frank Apisa,
It has found a political leader named Bernie Sanders and will occupy the Oval Office.
Frank Apisa
 
  2  
Reply Sun 6 Sep, 2015 11:52 am
@Lash,
Lash wrote:

It has found a political leader named Bernie Sanders and will occupy the Oval Office.


Really!

Wanna make a friendly on-line bet of some kind on that? (Maybe a heartfelt thread titled, "I was wrong and Frank Apisa was right!")

I say Bernie will never become president of this or any other country.

I say Bernie will never become the nominee of the Dems.

Bet?
Lash
 
  -2  
Reply Sun 6 Sep, 2015 12:02 pm
@ossobuco,
That's similar to my opinion. I don't see anything humorous about the Stalin/Jew thing - and I try to test my biases, though that is really difficult.

And then of course, I see a lot of Mohammad drawings as potentially funny - again, trying to check my biases, but I find humor in many of them. I can at least understand the attempt at humor. Since Islam "forbids" any depiction of Mohammad at all, and since I take offense to Islamists demanding to the threat of death that non-Islamists follow that non-depiction law, my sense of humor may be affected...

I have been offended by what some call satire, but I defer to people's right to self-expression.

I think there is a difference between satire and drawings / depictions that aren't intended as satire, but are designed to offend races or religions. I'm not sure anything should be done about them, but they should at least be called what they are.
izzythepush
 
  2  
Reply Sun 6 Sep, 2015 12:12 pm
@Lash,
Lash wrote:

I don't see anything humorous about the Stalin/Jew thing


Who does? It was never meant to be funny, it was meant to shock. The question I put to Osso was it is acceptable? The answer is a resounding no, but not to you. You look for humour in it and ask if there was any justification for it.

It's just as well you weren't talking to a neo Nazi because Christ knows what he'd have you believe.

I've never known anyone increasingly fail to understand the flaming obvious to this extent.

Here we go again. The point of the poster was to sell a lie, that Jews were manipulating/controlling both the USSR and USA. It's a lie, there's no justification to it, and absolutely no humour. Stupid and ignorant people believe lies, a lot of Germans believed that the Jews were controlling the USSR and USA, similarly a lot of stupid people like you believed Saddam Hussein was responsible for 9/11 and had WMDs.
izzythepush
 
  3  
Reply Sun 6 Sep, 2015 12:19 pm
This is from another point, and it sums things up quite well, re the confusion some people seem to be having right now.

Quote:
There seems to be a confusion among some users that satire (and we are a satire site) has to be funny. To evoke laughter. To pee your pants laughing (as I do). No, satire is thusly, according to Dictionary.com and other definition sites:
"sat·ire    [sat-ahyuhr] noun 1. the use of irony, sarcasm, ridicule, or the like, in exposing, denouncing, or deriding vice, folly, etc. 2. a literary composition, in verse or prose, in which human folly and vice are held up to scorn, derision, or ridicule. 3. a literary genre comprising such compositions. Origin: 1500–10; < Latin satira, variant of satura medley, perhaps feminine derivative of satur sated ( see saturate) Can be confused:  1. burlesque, caricature, cartoon, parody, satire (see synonym note at burlesque; see synonym note at the current entry ) "
I'm back now. Satire has a long backbone as a political and historical form of all the things mentioned above. Some satire is funny - but it doesn't have to be imnho and in the opinion of many definition makers. I've noticed over my many years here (well, not quite 3) that some users judge VFH entries on if it makes them laugh out loud. That's fine, yet I just wanted to point out that uncyclopedia is a satire site and not a lol (LOL) site. None of my dozen or so articles are funny, I've never written a funny article. Most of mine are actually used at bars to sober people up so they don't laugh. This is true. Thanks for not laughing. Discussion is welcome, but I won't be here myself for a week or so


http://uncyclopedia.wikia.com/wiki/Forum:Satire_does_not_have_to_be_funny-_hahahahahahaha!!
0 Replies
 
georgeob1
 
  1  
Reply Sun 6 Sep, 2015 12:22 pm
@Frank Apisa,
No one knows the future with certainty Frank, not even you. Certainly the public reaction to Sen. Sander's campaign has exceeded most expectations, probably including his own. At the same time Hillary's has fallen well short of expectations. Indeed commentators are starting to recall the disapointments and lapses in her last campaign. All this is going on during a period of fairly widespread turbulence in public political reactions, all of which suggest we may be in a period of real change - one in which events are particularly hard to forecast reliably.

I don't share Lash's enthusiasm for Sanders and I don't expect hin to win. However I can understand his appeal to many folks, and I don't entirely discount its potential effects.

Do you still believe that Hillary Clinton will be our next President? Are you as certain of this now as you were three months ago?

Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Reply Sun 6 Sep, 2015 12:33 pm
@georgeob1,
georgeob1 wrote:

No one knows the future with certainty Frank, not even you. Certainly the public reaction to Sen. Sander's campaign has exceeded most expectations, probably including his own. At the same time Hillary's has fallen well short of expectations. Indeed commentators are starting to recall the disapointments and lapses in her last campaign. All this is going on during a period of fairly widespread turbulence in public political reactions, all of which suggest we may be in a period of real change - one in which events are particularly hard to forecast reliably.

I don't share Lash's enthusiasm for Sanders and I don't expect hin to win. However I can understand his appeal to many folks, and I don't entirely discount its potential effects.

Do you still believe that Hillary Clinton will be our next President? Are you as certain of this now as you were three months ago?



George...any one of the contenders (and several others not yet contenders) could win the presidency.

I have never said otherwise.

But I am willing to bet Sanders will not ever be elected president...and will not even be the Dem candidate.

You want to take that bet?

I have NEVER been certain that Hillary will be our next president. If I were forced to bet on that...I would say that Hillary will be the Dem candidate...and she will be our next president.

And I most assuredly have NEVER...anywhere, at any time, in any place EVER...said I believe Hillary Clinton will be our next president.

I do not do "believing."
McTag
 
  4  
Reply Sun 6 Sep, 2015 12:46 pm
@Frank Apisa,

Failed to understand this post.

But don't rush to explain it. The whole thing is a matter of complete imbuggerance to me, as my dear old pappy used sometimes to say.
0 Replies
 
snood
 
  4  
Reply Sun 6 Sep, 2015 12:53 pm
@Frank Apisa,
Frank, you really push the "definition of is" type sophistry to the limits. Everything you have said about the coming election has left the impression that you don't think any democrat has a snowballs chance but Hillary. I believe you've even used that particular idiomatic metaphor to describe
Bernie's chances. But, when pressed, you fall back on things like "I never said exactly that in exactly those words", to the point that it's really (forgive me but)juvenile. We all know what you have meant, and what you have clearly meant is that you think Hillary is going to be the nominee, and no one else so far running can beat her. Why do the stupid dance?
Lash
 
  -1  
Reply Sun 6 Sep, 2015 01:48 pm
@izzythepush,
Now Izzy. I can hear your blood pressure rising, and I've done my part to prevent that from happening.

I was having a separate conversation with osso, referring to what she said below. Are you now going to yell at her because you disapprove of our conversation? Is she allowed to speak her opinion? Am I? Will you get lost?

Quote:
The thing about me and Slappy is that I long berated him for un PC jokes, and his reply was that everything can be a source of humor/satire. I finally turned a corner and gradually saw his point. Though I don't make cartoons like that myself, I can see the free speech of a group like Hebdo. And no, Auschwitz (my favorite writer is Primo Levi) and Stalin and so on are not sources of humor to me, and I would never draw that stuff, but I can see the Hebdo group being at base an anti-all-hate group itself. I didn't read them for years, as many apparently did, so of course I'm not sure. It's that I have a little room to glimpse that might be true.


I'm going to claim the right to talk to other people about things that don't concern you.
bobsal u1553115
 
  3  
Reply Sun 6 Sep, 2015 02:08 pm
Why this Latino supports Bernie Sanders and not Hillary Clinton:

Due to recent tone deaf statements that marginalize Sanders' existing minority support, I felt compelled to post this article and say a few words about my support as a Latino for Bernie Sanders and why I do not support Hillary Clinton.

I am proud to support a candidate who actually took the time to visit the fields and see first hand how migrant workers were being horribly mistreated and then spoke up for them. I am proud to support a candidate who traveled to Nicaragua to take a stand against U.S. imperialism under Reagan. Actions speak louder than words. I am proud to support a candidate who rightfully says the war on drugs has been a failure. I am proud to support a candidate who believes healthcare is a right, especially since this issue affects minorities in such a disproportionate way.

I am proud to support a candidate who doesn't need to be dishonest about their immigrant heritage to pander or flip flop and refuse to take a stand until it's politically expedient. I have zero trust in Hillary Clinton to be an advocate for Latinos and immigrants in general. I fully expect her continued support for violent right wing regimes and then to continue to turn her back on the refugees her actions help create.

I stand with Bernie Sanders because he stands with us.

GREAT read and links at Kos: http://www.dailykos.com/story/2015/07/29/1406832/-Why-this-Latino-supports-Bernie-Sanders-and-not-Hillary-Clinton
0 Replies
 
Frank Apisa
 
  0  
Reply Sun 6 Sep, 2015 03:02 pm
@snood,
snood wrote:

Frank, you really push the "definition of is" type sophistry to the limits. Everything you have said about the coming election has left the impression that you don't think any democrat has a snowballs chance but Hillary. I believe you've even used that particular idiomatic metaphor to describe
Bernie's chances. But, when pressed, you fall back on things like "I never said exactly that in exactly those words", to the point that it's really (forgive me but)juvenile. We all know what you have meant, and what you have clearly meant is that you think Hillary is going to be the nominee, and no one else so far running can beat her. Why do the stupid dance?


No, Snood...I have never done that. I have never suggested she is the only Dem who can win this contest...mostly because I think there are several Dems who could win this race. But there are a limited number running...and the only Dem who will win...is going to be someone who IS running.

I am willing to vote for anyone who beats Hillary in the primaries. I don't think that will happen...and I do not think someone further left than she can win.

If anyone can come along and oust her...let him or her do it.

I have said that if Sanders does it...I will happily and proudly vote for him.

Otherwise...she will be the nominee...and the winner of the contest between her and the Rep nominee will be our next president.

There was no need for the "stupid dance" remark.
georgeob1
 
  3  
Reply Sun 6 Sep, 2015 03:03 pm
@Frank Apisa,
Oh, now I understand. You are willing, even eager to bet on it but you don't believe it. Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes
snood
 
  3  
Reply Sun 6 Sep, 2015 03:28 pm
@Frank Apisa,
I call it stupid for the same reason that george just pointed out. You're going about challenging people to bet on the outcome on the one hand, but on the other you say you aren't really saying you're picking a winner.
bobsal u1553115
 
  2  
Reply Sun 6 Sep, 2015 03:51 pm
Sanders Leads Clinton By 9 in N.H., Gains in Iowa: NBC News Poll

http://www.nbcnews.com/meet-the-press/marist-poll-n422111

-snip-
Bernie Sanders has jumped out to a nine-point lead over front-runner Hillary Clinton in New Hampshire, and he's gained ground on her among Iowa voters in the Democratic presidential race, according to a pair of brand-new NBC News/Marist polls.

In New Hampshire, the Vermont senator gets the support of 41 percent of Democratic voters, Clinton gets 32 percent and Vice President Joe Biden gets 16 percent. No other Democratic candidate receives more than 1 percent.
-snip-
 

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