Never vote Republican, no matter what.

I will admit every statement in my post is extreme and fallacious if we attempt to apply it to every liberal. But I believe it is well documented--and no I'm not going to hunt up links so don't even ask--that every argument posted has been made or at least insinuated by liberals on message boards, in speeches, in political discourse, etc. including at least many here on A2K.

This gives conservatives a huge amount of ammunition. Several of the assertions can no doubt be countered and disputed at least in part with documented facts, but liberals don't seem to be able to articulate their side as well.

Here on A2K could possibly be the exception.

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Fox, in the future you might not want to try to deny that you are very partisan in nature, to the point of being unable to argue reasonably. Posting drek like that is a staple of the narrow-sighted ideologue.

Hell you are at it right now. Saying that liberals don't articulate their side well. Quite frankly Fox you don't articulate your arguments for your side well at all and are not one to talk. And there are plenty of conservatives here who can and whose arguments are not regurgitated partisan brainfarts. I can only wish they were as prolific here to better represent their side.

IMO you are a boon to the left.

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what you need to believe to be republican
1. Being a drug addict is a moral failing and a crime, unless you're a conservative radio host. Then it's an illness and you need our prayers for your recovery.
2. Government should relax regulation of Big Business and Big Money but crack down on individuals who use marijuana to relieve the pain of illness.
3. Saddam was a good guy when Reagan armed him, a bad guy when Bush's daddy made war on him, a good guy when Cheney did business with him and a bad guy when Bush needed a "we can't find Bin Laden" diversion.
4. Trade with Cuba is wrong because the country is communist, but trade with China and Vietnam is vital to a spirit of international harmony.
5. Government should limit itself to the powers named in the Constitution, which include banning gay marriages and censoring the Internet.
6. What Bill Clinton did in the 1960s is of vital national interest, but what Bush did in the '80s is irrelevant.
silly isn't it?

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Fighting brainfarts with brainfarts dys? Come on guys are we on an email chain letter level?

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see above

Quote:

silly isn't it?

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Yes it is.

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Foxfyre wrote:

This gives conservatives a huge amount of ammunition. Several of the assertions can no doubt be countered and disputed at least in part with documented facts, but liberals don't seem to be able to articulate their side as well.

LOL I missed this lapse in basic common sense the first time around. You actually think that that's good ammunition? That the fact that you can collate a silly list is ammunition against liberals in general?

That would be about as fair as saying your arguments are fair ammunition to use to denigrate all conservatives. It's not, many conservatives can argue their cases well.

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For every long, spam-like list available for one point of view there exists an equal spate of tripe to be introduced by the other one, each "proving" a particular point of view. The longer and more partisan it gets, the less likely I will read it, regardless of point of view.
There are those who look down on we who don't back it up with endless links, but that's their concern.

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CDK wrote:

Quote:

LOL I missed this lapse in basic common sense the first time around. You actually think that that's good ammunition? That the fact that you can collate a silly list is ammunition against liberals in general?

I didn't collate the list. Somebody else did. I felt it useful for illustration, however, in my belief that many, perhaps most, conservatives can rationally and logically argue their side of every point of it, whether or not others agree with them.

It has been my observation, however, that many, if not most, liberals in this situation will 1) condemn/dismiss the messenger, and/or 2) condemn/dismiss the list, and/or 3) condemn conservatives/GOP in general and/or 4) change the subject. Very few will take any point and attempt to make the liberal case for it.

This should not be construed that I think no liberal can make a rational argument for their conviction or point of view. It's just that on so many issues, so few seem to be able to articulate a complete argument and I think this is their particular weakness going up against conservative when values/points of view are debated. I am simply giving my perception of Edgar's post.

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Well Fox if it's any consolation to you other folk on the other side persist in what I see as a really silly attempt to try to assert a intellectual superiority of an entire political ideology's following on a statistical level.

I used much stronger words to describe it the last time a liberal approached me with one of a similar scope to your but let me just say I find it to be very very silly.

And please remember these things if you ever say you are not fervently partisan because I suspect assertions of this ilk that go a long way towards others perceiving you that way.

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Okay Craven. I have never denied that I was partisan. While I do not agree with every issue supported by every conservate and while I do hold some beliefs/values that would usually be put on the liberal side of the ledger, overall I do believe conservatism to be ideologically, morally, and fiscally superior to liberalism. And I do not object to anyone calling me conservative.

Anyhow, you beautifully illustrated the points I made above. Boon for the left? Gee, glad you think I'm a boon for something.

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Calling someone a hate-filled liberal every time they attack your point of view is counterproductive, fox. I am glad you seem to have calmed down a bit on that one. There are some conservatves and other type opposition figures on a2k that I can argue or discuss with, such as sofia and occasionally mysteryman and finn. So far I am not doing well with you and scrat. Perception hates my guts from some long forgotten by me encounter on Abuzz, so there is no hope of discussion with him. Your perception of events and facts is so at odds with almost everything I want to say, I really despair of getting anything settled.

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Foxfyre wrote:

I do believe conservatism to be ideologically, morally, and fiscally superior to liberalism. And I do not object to anyone calling me conservative.

And you seem to think conservatives are smarter better people.

Well at least there's a lot of irony when you say that.

Quote:

Boon for the left?

Yes, you represent the left very well, if perhaps unintentionally. Laughing

I hope you expound on any other differences you see betwen the average conservative and liberal's thought process.

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Goddammit what does a conservative have to around here to get some props!? :wink:

Well, I felt I should get in on this thread while the gettings good. I read Foxfyre's list and I have to say that I agree, in general, on it's precepts. I think that it gives a general accountability on what most liberals "points of light" are. It's a general list, therefore it should not be expected to apply to every liberal, but the stereotypical liberal.

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McGentrix
Your diatribes against Hillary keep me from taking you seriously.

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McGentrix wrote:

Goddammit what does a conservative have to around here to get some props!? :wink:

Use decent arguments and not regurgitate fallacy in lieu of thought. Ultimately there are subjective differences of opinion but some arrive at their positions through use of falsehoods and fallacious reasoning.

I have no qualm with someone having a subjective difference of opinion while not mangling logic and reason on their way to their positions.

There are plenty of conservatives who can do this.

Finn, JamesMorrison, Brandon, Thomas and more.

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Craven de Kere wrote:

McGentrix wrote:
Goddammit what does a conservative have to around here to get some props!? :wink:

Use decent arguments and not regurgitate fallacy in lieu of thought. Ultimately there are subjective differences of opinion but some arrive at their positions through use of falsehoods and fallacious reasoning.

I have no qualm with someone having a subjective difference of opinion while not mangling logic and reason on their way to their positions.

Yeah that leaves me pretty much out of it. It seems that everytime I try to think I get yelled at for not supplying links or backup material or when I do use a link, it's too conservative or something else. I have also never taken a debate class nor felt the desire to learn about the various forms of debate, so when others start throwing around fallacious arguements or mangling logic I generally let it slide because I just figure they are making their case the best way they can.

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McG, I always had the impression that you weren't really trying to debate so much as just have fun with liberals. <shrugs>

I've found it funny sometimes.

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McG, Go ahead and challenge statements made by liberals that cannot be backed up by sources other than themselves. It's not necessary to "let it slide." On that, I'm on your side.

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You know, we could do a basic tutorial on logical fallacies here. Would you be interested, McG?

I'm actually being serious on this. It's not complicated stuff usually, and if I were developing curricula for schools, I've have it taught at junior high level.

I find that some familiarity with these fallacies is a very valuable aid in spotting not only mistakes in reasoning, but in identifying bullshit and bullshitters.

I'd be happy to help.

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Never vote Republican, no matter what.

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