Union Labor: For or Against?

The unions bully the workers. And, NO ONE can do anything about it. They will get their dues, and do with them as they please. Some mob guy buys his girlfriend a new ring with those hard earned dues.

At least there is legal recourse and remedy when the bosses bully workers.

Unions tell members how to vote. No boss can do that.

"On the Waterfront" wasn't somebody's creative imagination.

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In other words, you don't want workers organizing to their own betterment. Unions can be cleaned and kept clean. Bosses don't have workers' best interest at heart.

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Well, edgar, I want to modulate my tone...

<smiling at sweet edgar, who is just a tad predisposed to be anti-business...>

Edgar, I have worked in a couple of places where the benefits were great, off time for family stuff was allowed, the pay was good... Once in a while, there is need for change and improvement. We know how to yank DOL, OSHA and other agencies for complaints and grievances...

These agencies have information posted with phone numbers and laws at all work places.

But, more importantly, to me, organizing can be done by workers, with no union boss necessary, no dues necessary. You can keep your money and organize a "blue flu" and call in a myriad of helpful agencies and attys if conditions merit. I am not against organization, per se--just the kind where the 'solution' is worse than the problem.

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I assume that since you have made the blanket statements on many occasions, that ALL unions are corrupt, you could not under any circumstances complain when I say that ALL employers are corrupt, and NONE of them have any concern for their employees whatsoever.

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The way I see it, there are good employers and there are bad employers. The same goes for Unions. Personally, I would prefer to work under a Union. But....that's just my opinion.

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Wilso wrote:

I assume that since you have made the blanket statements on many occasions, that ALL unions are corrupt, you could not under any circumstances complain when I say that ALL employers are corrupt, and NONE of them have any concern for their employees whatsoever.

Completely agree.

I've left* my union, because of personal reasons (they had been to here in my county to much on employer's site, I thought), but if they weren't, life for employees and workers would be more terrible than it is.
(*Mrs. Walter still is a member, although she'd left work more than 10 years ago.)

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squinney wrote:

Wilso, it appears that the unions are very different in the Outback. Here, there is a lot of reported arm twisting and abuse. If you don't go along... They take you out back.

squinney

The unions of Oz serve not only the workers outback (in the remote regions) but also, most workers in the cities. They are not perfect, but without them workers would have a really tough time of things ... trust me!

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If we hadn't had the unions, we wouldn't have our labour laws, tariffs nationwide, regulated working hours, legal aid at labour courts ... ...

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Exactly, Walter!

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We'd also be working 60 hour weeks for half of what we earn now, and be expected to be greatful that we've got a job at all.

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Wilso, if it weren't for unions that cute little kid under your arm would be down in a coal-mine slaving to keep Kerry Packer in loose change for the roulette table. And the fuc&ing National Farmer's Federation would be scouring the world for 4 year-olds to do it cheaper and break the grip of the unions on the wharves too............

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http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2004/08/09/national/main634985.shtml

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I worked at UPS for 4 yeaars, first as a union member and then as management. My opinion was that the Union does good things like get health insurance (for part time workers at UPS), better wages and safer work environments.

What I didn't like about the union was they fostered lazyness. I worked hard at my job while the guy down the line from me did nothing because he knew the Union would protect him. All this did was make me have to work twice as hard. Then whenever a supervisor came to help me...there would be the Union steward (sp?) to tell him to stop doing Union work. But he never offered to come in and help.

They do get good benifits for employees, but they do more harm by protecting bad employees and not helping the good ones.

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I average at least 1 60-hour week every 2-3 months...my boss averages at least one a month. Never been in a union here, never needed one. I've dealt with my share of bad employers. I didn't need the mafia to hold my hand.

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Wildflower 63 wrote:

What do you think of union labor today? Do you feel it necessary, as an employee, to have collective bargaining power? If you work for non-union labor, do you feel that you get a fair deal?

I work in a sector in Germany where wages are set by a powerful union called the IG Metall. My workweek is 35 hours (7 hours a day), and when I work longer than 10 hours on any given day, German labor laws require that my boss gets in trouble.

The thing is, I like my job, and I like working long hours in it. This means that neither the 35 hour work week nor the compulsory legal 10-hours-a-day limit puts arbitrary contstraints on me without giving me anything I care to have. If it was my choice, I would prefer a world without the IG Metall, and without those labor laws. A free labor market does an adequate job at creating reasonable working conditions and wages, thank you very much.

Wildflower 63 wrote:

What do you think about labor unions?

I basically think of them as monopolies in the labor market. Economically, I think they're a wasteful institution, just like monopolies elswhere are wasteful. Politically, I support a laissez-faire approach to unions for the same reasons I support a laissez-faire approach to monopolies: regulations to curb union power, just like regulations to curb monopoly power elswhere in the economy, usually cause more problems than they solve.

Walter Hinteler wrote:

If we hadn't had the unions, we wouldn't have our labour laws, tariffs nationwide, regulated working hours, legal aid at labour courts ... ...

And that would be a bad thing because .... ?

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Thomas wrote:

Walter Hinteler wrote:
If we hadn't had the unions, we wouldn't have our labour laws, tariffs nationwide, regulated working hours, legal aid at labour courts ... ...

And that would be a bad thing because .... ?

Because I think that we neither live in the Middle Ages anymore nor in the 19th century.

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Walter Hinteler wrote:

Thomas wrote:
Walter Hinteler wrote:
If we hadn't had the unions, we wouldn't have our labour laws, tariffs nationwide, regulated working hours, legal aid at labour courts ... ...

And that would be a bad thing because .... ?

Because I think that we neither live in the Middle Ages anymore nor in the 19th century.

... as a result of trade unions? Without trade unions, time would have failed to continue running, and we would still be living in the 19th century? Is that what you're saying?

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Thomas wrote:

A free labor market does an adequate job at creating reasonable working conditions and wages, thank you very much.

Tell that to the children slaving in Asian sweatshops. I just can't believe the level of naivety/stupidity that I see on this site at times.

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Well, Thomas, while you are more on the employers site, I'm by profession, character, conviction and by what I know from my own and human history ... on the other :wink:

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Walter

Yes, indeed!

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Union Labor: For or Against?

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