Butterflynet misunderstands.
I will repeat. If the religious right exists, then certainly the irreligious left does also.
I will explain:
quote:
"...liberal society is of necessity a secular society, one in which religion is mainly a private affair. The demands placed upon liberal society, in the name of "temporal" happiness have become even more urgent and ever more unreasonable."
from "Capitalism, Socialism and Nihilism" by Irving Kristol.
I do hope that you understand now, Butterflynet, what I mean by the irreligious left.
cicerone imposter wrote:nimh, I doubt that another recall of Ahnold would be seen as a good political strategy. Ahnold won 49 percent of the votes, and that includes dems and moderates that voted - including women. Anybody that stirs the pot now is gonna backfire on them.
Yes, c.i., again I actually agree with you ... just look at my previous post:
Quote:against Arnold, right now, they'd stand little chance yet. The recall succeeded against Davis because he was already so impopular as a person, and resentment had been building up for some time. You gotta give Arnold time to fail, first, and only then start thinking about a recall again, otherwise it'll just look like you're a sore loser. And before he's had the chance to do much wrong, itll be 2004 and the Democrats wont want the trouble of a recall campaign to interfere with the Presidential campaign ... so my bet is that he'll be safe till 2005.
All I
also said was that:
Quote:I do think the "recall" logic, now that the genie's out of the bottle, will be repeated (kinda like with the TX redistricting) - now that its been used against (a) Democrat(s) they'll be likely to use it back. So welcome to an age of slightlymore anarchic politics.
nimh is correct. The genie is indeed out of the bottle.
And if it were to happen that the Democrats would elect a president in 2004( there is virtually no chance that they would take over the House or the Senate) what would happen to ANY nomination for high judicial posts made by the president????
nimh wrote:Am I glad you dont write the headlines for no paper, Timber ...
... On an aside, what kind of punishment would a graffiti kid like that be in for in America?
LOL ... that was pretty much on the "Yellow Journalism" side, wasn't it?
As to the penalty for a minor, non-violent felony; in absence of a history of similar convictions, the charge likely would be bargained to a misdemeanor breach of peace, and the culprit would receive at most a fine and possibly, though not necessarilly, a few months in jail.
Thanks for the info. Usually just a fine, huh? That sounds reasonable, I mean, they do cause bother - and the illegality of it is part of the kick in any case, I'm sure. Jailtime seems a bit much, for graffiti'ing ('specially in an American prison ...).
There's an odd bit of mixed message in there, isnt there? If you do graffiti, you go to jail, unless someone 'discovers' that you're really good, and then you go to the city's art galleries, instead?
Anywho, thats probably way too far off-topic ... <g>
nimh wrote: But dont you think a succesful one will elicit many times more new recall attempts than would have been tried otherwise?
I think some people will try for purely political reasons but I think this whole fiasco opened the eyes of a lot of people in CA and the general public isn't going to go down this road again for quite some time. Just guessing but I think a lot of people in CA saw the whole thing as a bit of an embarrassment.
Overlooked in the hoopla over the California circus, a somewhat less organized and nowhere near as popular gubernatorial recall effort is underway; a challenge to Republican Governor Kenny Guinn, who was elected in '02 with 68% of the vote. A spokesman for the recall effort concedes that it is unlikely sufficient signatures will be gathered to place the question on the ballot. He attributes this to lack of cooperation from State Authorities.
Recall Not a Good Bet in Nevada
is "recall" a virus not unlike Sars?
How could they recall Guinn?
He won 52 to 42%--6% other in 1998 and as has been noted 68% in 2003. The Almanac of American Politics says:
quote:
Guinn is safe. Although Democrats are competitive here, Guinn has not left them many openings to challenge him...end of quote
It is my opinion that only off the wall types like Davis who bankrupt their states will be vulnerable.
speaking of off the wall......
Yes, Dys, my thoughts exactly.......... <shaking head> I simply can't go on with a straight face.
I'll be traveling this week end. I'll check in some, but mostly I'm going to be busy so I may not see much of any of you until next week. My absence from these threads will no more reflect my amazement at some of the off the wallness than does my presence.
It ain't The Dems trying to oust Guinn ... its the ultra-conservative fringe, upset over a tax increase.
A Democrat never met a tax he didn't like.
and repubs seem to never meet a deficit they didn't like.
On the bright side-- there is now someone in politics, who assaults the English language worse than Bush, she bleats in a possibly grammatically incorrect sentence.
<This may be why Bush supported Arnold...>
So much, so little time. c.i.-have no fear. I most certainly do get it.
Recall will not get the attention it demands, any longer. Too much time, too much money, too little payoff.
did i hear Arnold spend 23 million? is this the same man that said he didn't want contributions?
dys, With friends like Warren Buffet, 23 million is but a pittance.
Everything had to be coughed up NOW.
Timber- Whoever is trying to remove Guinn, it isn't going to work according to the Almanac of American Politics, edited by Michael Barone.
Recall will work with a dumb pencil-neck spender like Davis but not with many more politicians
Davis was truly pathetic- No charisma; no real friends; no support in the final analysis.
There are no other governors as disliked as much as Davis was.
Do you know of any?
I looked over the list and couldn't find any.
The candidates' debate is currently live on CNN...
..how about getting this thread permanently back on topic by weighing in with your opinions about their performances?
I'll start.
Al Sharpton already gets off the best soundbite, referring to Bush and Blair as "two guys in a phone booth" thinking they represent the entire world.
Wes Clark is getting shots from all angles, including moderator Judy Woodruff.
And Gephardt sounds the most effective and populist so far("'If you want to live like a Republican, then you vote for the Democrats").
