22
   

Donald Sterling

 
 
BillRM
 
  1  
Reply Sun 25 May, 2014 07:43 pm
@Advocate,
Quote:
because whites don't assault and rob passersby.


They don't !!!!!!!!!!!!

Never hear that no whites have ever assaulted or rob a passerby...lol

All you can in fact said is that by crime statistics and knowing nothing about the person behind you other then skin color the odds would be better with a person behind you having a white skin however the white skin stranger could be a mass killer and the black stranger could be an FBI agent.
firefly
 
  1  
Reply Sun 25 May, 2014 07:44 pm
Quote:
May 22, 2014
Mark Cuban and the “Price” of Progress
by Ian Crouch

In April, as the scandal involving the Clippers owner Donald Sterling made headlines, many of Sterling’s fellow-owners issued stern condemnations. Mark Cuban, the tech millionaire and owner of the Dallas Mavericks, said that, while Sterling’s comments were “wrong” and “abhorrent,” he wasn’t convinced that Sterling should be forced out of the league. “I think you’ve got to be very, very careful when you start making blanket statements about what people say and think, as opposed to what they do,” he said. “It’s a very, very slippery slope.”

Later, after the N.B.A. commissioner Adam Silver announced that he had suspended Sterling for life and would force him to sell the team, Cuban tweeted his full support of the decision. (Silver’s decision wasn’t unprecedented: Major League Baseball banned the Cincinnati Reds owner Marge Schott from taking part in team operations in 1993, and again between 1996 and 1998, as punishment for a string of offensive remarks she made about Jews, African-Americans, and Asians.) Yet Cuban’s basic discomfort with the premise of the N.B.A. punishing someone for his private statements seems to remain. On Wednesday, Cuban expanded on his earlier comments about Sterling in a video conversation with Inc. magazine.

Most of the attention has been paid to Cuban’s candid discussion of his own prejudices—and of his examples of people he crosses the street to avoid. But it is worth considering what Cuban says, a moment earlier in the interview, about the progress that has been made by minority communities in America: “We’ve come a long way, and with that progress comes a price. We’re a lot more vigilant, and we’re a lot less tolerant of different views. And it’s not necessarily easy for everybody to adapt, or evolve.”

The word that stands out here is “price,” as if by working toward a more inclusive and tolerant society we have lost something important. But just what might that be? The right for people to lean on archaic religious arguments to excuse modern injustices toward gay people? Or for Donald Sterling to reserve the right to go on living in some combination of the eighteen-fifties and the nineteen-fifties? Perhaps some people are allowed to say less today, but many people are finally free to say more. For much of the history of sports, African-American athletes who advocated for civil rights were branded as troublemakers; gay athletes kept silent rather than risk their jobs by speaking about the people they loved. Jackie Robinson, famously, was told that if he wanted to be the first black major leaguer he had to take the abuse hurled from the stands in silence. He had to be far more “vigilant” than Cuban or anyone else must be today.

Still, Cuban’s comments come at a time when the major American professional-sports leagues have become especially active in monitoring the speech of their employees, and, at times, punishing them for what they say. On May 10th, after Michael Sam became the first openly gay player to be drafted by an N.F.L. team and was shown kissing his boyfriend when he received the news, Don Jones, of the Miami Dolphins, tweeted “OMG” and “horrible.” He promptly deleted the tweets, but not before they’d been spotted. The Dolphins quickly fined Jones, excused him from the team, and required that he attend sensitivity training. He apologized to Sam, as well as to his own organization, and has since been reinstated. Miami’s swift response was likely spurred by its recognition that everyone in the N.F.L. would be under intense scrutiny after Sam was drafted, and by the memory of the franchise’s own recent sordid, public shame.

Last season, Jonathan Martin left the team because of a sustained regime of bullying led by Richie Incognito and several other Dolphins veterans. An independent report introduced the wider world to the kind of talk that went on in the Miami locker room: a word salad of homophobic, racist, threatening language that exceeded even the worst suspicions that we may have had about jock talk. Incognito was suspended by the Dolphins for three months, and is now a free agent. Earlier in the same season, Riley Cooper, a receiver for the Philadelphia Eagles, was caught on camera at a Kenny Chesney concert saying that he would “fight every nigger here.” The video spread widely online, and Cooper was fined, suspended for two days, and made—as is the pattern—to attend sensitivity training.

The N.F.L. announced this winter that it was considering adding a new rule to its games which would penalize a team fifteen yards for unsportsmanlike conduct if a player was heard using the N-word during a game. The proposal never came to a vote, but it suggested that the league was serious enough about punishing hate speech that it would police it not only on the Internet but also on the field. Al Sharpton called it a “good first step.” Michael Wilbon, a sportswriter, disagreed on his show “Pardon the Interruption”: “So you’re gonna have a league with no black owners and a white commissioner—middle-aged and advanced-aged white men—say to black players, mostly, (because that’s what we’re talking about) ‘You can’t use the N-word on the field of play, or we’re gonna penalize you.’ ” Wilbon’s point was similar to some of the most forceful responses to the current Sterling affair—that worrying about words obfuscates the real problems of racial inequality in professional sports. In the N.B.A., seventy-six per cent of the players are African-American, versus only one of the thirty-one owners who will decide Donald Sterling’s fate in June: Michael Jordan. (Jordan’s candid discussion of his own prejudices as a student in North Carolina appears in a new book: “I considered myself a racist at the time. Basically, I was against all white people.”)

But words still matter, and when they’re spoken by athletes who occupy an elevated position in America’s sports culture they can be transformative. In 2011, Kobe Bryant was fined a hundred thousand dollars for calling a referee “a ******* faggot.” A month later, Joakim Noah, of the Chicago Bulls, was fined fifty grand after he was heard using the word. The league’s crackdown served as a vital cultural model, and fans received a clear message: it is not acceptable to speak this way.

Was the N.B.A. enlightened, or was it simply worried about the bottom line? The answer might not matter: by making the issue of gay slurs a serious one, the association spurred a national conversation, and it surely made some kid in a pickup game somewhere think of a different word to use. Bryant filmed a P.S.A. in support of gay rights, and, two years later, he could be seen calling his fans out on Twitter for using gay slurs. Had he undergone a change of heart, or was he simply towing a new company line? That might not matter much, either.

In the interview on Wednesday, Cuban was asked if there was a way to keep bigotry out of the N.B.A. No, he said. “There’s no law against stupid.” But there’s no reason not to hold players and owners to a higher standard. The crackdown by pro leagues on offensive speech may generate concerns about the rights of players, or about the reflexive nature of the kind of group outrage that's fostered by the Internet. Some of these concerns are legitimate. But a corporation making its employees responsible for the things they say can have a sweeping impact when it happens to be a corporation that has millions of fans.

After Michael Sam was drafted, ESPN asked an unnamed player on the Rams if the team’s show of support had been genuine or merely an example of political correctness. “Clearly, I’m not sure how everyone feels,” the player said. “But, from what I can tell so far, I think it’s a little bit of both, honestly.” If half of the players on the St. Louis Rams are just being politically correct when they say that they accept Michael Sam’s sexuality, they are also, not inconsequentially, modelling correct behavior. The more that fans hear them say it, the more likely they are to consider their own prejudices. And, the more that the players hear themselves say it, the more likely they are to think about it, too.

http://www.newyorker.com/online/blogs/sportingscene/2014/05/mark-cuban-bigotry-and-the-nba.html
OmSigDAVID
 
  2  
Reply Sun 25 May, 2014 09:00 pm
@firefly,
The owners and the players made a huge, un-American mistake
if thay signed away their rights of free speech.





David
OmSigDAVID
 
  2  
Reply Sun 25 May, 2014 09:03 pm
@Advocate,
Advocate wrote:
You evidently infer that Jesse Jackson felt safe that the folks behind him were white, and therefore helpless and weak. He felt safe because whites don't assault and rob passersby.
I remember Flip Wilson making a joke about the same thing.





David
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Sun 25 May, 2014 09:39 pm
@OmSigDAVID,
You were an attorney?
Quote:
Hate speech is, outside the law, speech that attacks a person or group on the basis of e.g. race, religion, gender, disability, or sexual orientation.[1][2]

In law, hate speech is any speech, gesture or conduct, writing, or display which is forbidden because it may incite violence or prejudicial action against or by a protected individual or group, or because it disparages or intimidates a protected individual or group. The law may identify a protected individual or a protected group by certain characteristics.
Ticomaya
 
  1  
Reply Sun 25 May, 2014 11:32 pm
@cicerone imposter,
cicerone imposter wrote:
You were an attorney?

Once an attorney, always an attorney.
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Mon 26 May, 2014 10:08 am
@Ticomaya,
That's what I thought and believed, but David said he's now 'retired.'
Finn dAbuzz
 
  2  
Reply Mon 26 May, 2014 10:12 am
@Ticomaya,
Ticomaya wrote:

I don't normally care for Stephen A. Smith, but in this instance, he speaks the truth!


Agreed on both accounts.
0 Replies
 
Finn dAbuzz
 
  3  
Reply Mon 26 May, 2014 11:38 am
@BillRM,
Peculiar as it is for me to "defend" Advocate, I'm fairly certain that he doesn't believe whites never assault people on the street.

I'm just as certain that Jackson's expression of relief upon learning that the footsteps behind him on a dark street belonged to a white person, did not arise from a confidence that he could whup the cracker if he tried anything. Buttermilk's interpretation of the comment was a forced way to defend Jackson.

Whether or not every black male who wears his hair in cornrows and dresses in baggy pants, skullcaps and hoodies is an actual threat to innocent pedestrians, every black males who chooses to adopt this style knows it roots and connotations.

It is the gangbanger or gangsta look and it is intended to portray a dangerous persona. Google "gangsta look" or "gangbanger look" and this is quite evident.

Because actually half-way decent kids without any criminal intent may choose to adopt this look doesn't mean they should be shot or arrested, but it is prudent for the innocent pedestrian (of any color) to avoid them....i.e. cross the street, when alone at night, or in a sketchy part of town.

It is absurd that someone who deliberately dresses in a manner intended to convey danger complains about the desired effect.

I very much doubt that many white people are crossing the street to avoid conventionally dressed black men ("conventional" ranges from t-shirt and jeans to suit and tie). Otherwise every major city in the US would be a chaotic scene of white people moving back and forth across city streets.

The gangsta look isn't limited to blacks, plenty of white and Latino kids adopt it, and I would be as wary of them as I were of their black counter-parts.

As a much younger man I dressed like a "hippie": Long hair, patched bell-bottom jeans, t-shirt with some political slogan or another. I knew, pretty clearly, what connotations my appearance conjured up in the average adult, that was part of the allure of the persona. It would have been ridiculous for me to demand that no one assume certain things about me based on how I looked.

You are absolutely right that a person who, because of the way he or she looks, doesn't set off an inner alarm, could be a very real danger, but we know that statistically the threat is much reduced. It's not about being 100% correct about every real threat, it's about avoiding the most apparent, and people, of any color, who dress to appear threatening certainly qualify.

All this goes to say that the use of the terms "bigot" and "racist" is used far too liberally in our society, however they do apply to some people and Donald Sterling is one of them.
Thomas
 
  1  
Reply Mon 26 May, 2014 06:10 pm
@OmSigDAVID,
OmSigDAVID wrote:
The owners and the players made a huge, un-American mistake
if thay signed away their rights of free speech.

Are you suggesting we take away their Second-Amendment right to shoot themselves in the foot?
OmSigDAVID
 
  0  
Reply Mon 26 May, 2014 11:24 pm
@Thomas,
OmSigDAVID wrote:
The owners and the players made a huge, un-American mistake
if thay signed away their rights of free speech.
Thomas wrote:
Are you suggesting we take away their Second-Amendment right
to shoot themselves in the foot?
No, but it raises the question
of whether freedom of speech is inalienable.

Can u sell your right to express an opinion?
Can u sell or barter away your right to live ?

Dictionary.com:
inalienable

adjective

not alienable; not transferable to another
or capable of being repudiated: inalienable rights.
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Mon 26 May, 2014 11:46 pm
@cicerone imposter,
cicerone imposter wrote:
That's what I thought and believed, but David said he's now 'retired.'
That 's true. I have retired from the Bar of NY.
I retired from the practice of law long ago.
I have moven to Florida.
I have no need nor desire to work.


An attorney REPRESENTS his clients. He is a representative.
I have no active clientele.

Black's Law Dictionary wrote:
In the most general sense this term denotes an agent or substitute,
or one who is appointed and authorized to act in the place or stead of another. In re Ricker, 60 N. H. 207, 29 Atl. 559, 24 L. R. A. 740; Eichelberger v. Sifford, 27 Md. 320. It is “an ancient English word, and signifies one that is set in the turn, stead, or place of another; and of these some be private * * * and some be publike, as attorneys at law.” Co. Litt. 516, 128a; Britt 2856. One who is appointed by another to do something in his absence, and who has authority to act in the place and turn of him by whom he is delegated.
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Mon 26 May, 2014 11:59 pm
@Finn dAbuzz,
Finn dAbuzz wrote:

Peculiar as it is for me to "defend" Advocate, I'm fairly certain that he doesn't believe whites never assault people on the street.

I'm just as certain that Jackson's expression of relief upon learning that the footsteps behind him on a dark street belonged to a white person, did not arise from a confidence that he could whup the cracker if he tried anything. Buttermilk's interpretation of the comment was a forced way to defend Jackson.
Flip Wilson made a joke on TV of experiencing that relief
upon finding that it was a white behind him, not a black.
He did not portray himself to be a muscular, looming threat to whites.
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  0  
Reply Tue 27 May, 2014 12:03 am
@cicerone imposter,
cicerone imposter wrote:

You were an attorney?
Quote:
Hate speech is, outside the law, speech that attacks a person or group on the basis of e.g. race, religion, gender, disability, or sexual orientation.[1][2]

In law, hate speech is any speech, gesture or conduct, writing, or display which is forbidden because it may incite violence or prejudicial action against or by a protected individual or group, or because it disparages or intimidates a protected individual or group. The law may identify a protected individual or a protected group by certain characteristics.

C.I., U submit a quote
without citing its source ???????
Thomas
 
  3  
Reply Tue 27 May, 2014 10:31 am
@OmSigDAVID,
OmSigDAVID wrote:
No, but it raises the question of whether freedom of speech is inalienable.

In the context of contracts, of course it is! When you were a lawyer, gossiping about your clients would have gotten you fired from the lawfirm that employed you. Would that have violated your freedom of speech? If so, that only goes to show that freedom of speach shouldn't be inalienable. And if not, how is Sterling's case any different? Sterling has every right to run his mouth. He does not have the right to inflict financial losses on his contract partners by any means. In particular, he has no right to inflict such losses by running his mouth.
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Tue 27 May, 2014 10:36 am
@OmSigDAVID,
From Wiki.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hate_speech
0 Replies
 
hawkeye10
 
  2  
Reply Tue 27 May, 2014 07:05 pm
Somewhere back in this thread I predicted that Sterling would fight in the courts, preferably till he dies, and Firefly said that he would probably just go, that he said that he is too old for a court fight


From Camp Sterling
Quote:
So, in reality, Mr. Sterling is being banned for life, fined $2.5 million, and stripped of his ownership for a purely private conversation with his lover that he did not know was being recorded and that he never intended would see the light of day.
We do not believe a court in the United States of America will (emphasis mine)enforce the draconian penalties imposed on Mr. Sterling in these circumstances, and indeed, we believe that preservation of Mr. Sterling’s constitutional rights requires that these sham proceedings be terminated in Mr. Sterling’s favor.


http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nba-ball-dont-lie/donald-sterling-responds-to-the-nba--saying-a--lovers--quarrel--is-leading-to-the-league-s--illegal--actions-005021843.html
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  2  
Reply Tue 27 May, 2014 07:41 pm
There's a very easy cure for Mr Sterling. All the players and fans needs to strike the Clippers until they go broke. The sales price will be so depressed, nobody will want to pay the $1 billion estimated asking price. Any other owner who wishes to be in the same situation will think twice before they think they can control any team with their bigotry or the NBA.

The NBA can start a new team, and hire the Clippers players. The NBA can null and void the contracts based on Mr Sterling's bigotry.

BillRM
 
  0  
Reply Tue 27 May, 2014 08:07 pm
@cicerone imposter,
Quote:
The NBA can start a new team, and hire the Clippers players. The NBA can null and void the contracts based on Mr Sterling's bigotry.


I never hear of a third party being able to null a employee/employer contract but then what the hell by picking on an old sick man who seems not to have the will to fight for his legal rights his team is sadly being seized in any case.

If I was an NBA owner and looking at this example I would be looking to find a buyer for my many hundreds of million investment before some comments of mine that is not PC in some sense or other is used to seized my team.

In any case, it is easy for the media to drum up short term PC outrage but not lasting outrage and if the players wished to turn their backs on millions of dollars a year, somehow I do not question that others players could be found that would play at a fraction of the cost.

The clippers did well while not being in the play offs for year after year.


cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Tue 27 May, 2014 08:55 pm
@BillRM,
Mr Sterling is prohibited from any connection with the team. It's up to Mr Silver and the other owners of teams in the NBA.

If the players refuse to play, and the fans refuse to attend any games, that franchise is essentially kaput!
 

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