Reply Wed 16 Apr, 2014 02:15 pm
I was already squeamish and sad, and then I just read this headline -

South Korean shipwreck survivors: Passengers told 'don't move' as ship sank
CNN - ‎7 minutes ago‎
Jindo, South Korea (CNN) -- Passengers aboard a sinking South Korean ferry faced a terrifying choice as the vessel rolled: obey commands barked over loudspeakers to stay in place, or don life vests and jump into the chilly ocean water.

This is so awful -
http://edition.cnn.com/2014/04/16/world/asia/south-korea-sinking-ship-students/

I'm no sinking ship expert. I might be able to understand the caution if I try hard, but gee.


"Don't move," a voice warned, according to a recording obtained by CNN affiliate YTN. "If you move, it's dangerous. Don't move."
That announcement, some witnesses worried, may have cost some passengers on the ferry Sewol their lives.

"Kids were forced to stay put," one survivor told CNN affiliate YTN, "so only some of those who moved survived."

As rescuers searched the frigid water for nearly 300 people who remained unaccounted for, witnesses told horrific stories of their final minutes on the sinking ship.

"We were told to stay where you are, so we kept staying," another survivor told YTN. "But later on, the water level came up. So we were beside ourselves. Kids were screaming out of terror, shouting for help."

At least some of those who jumped or made their way to the top of the ship were rescued. Helicopters crews plucked some from the deck.
Others were pulled from the water by crews aboard the multitude of fishing boats and military vessels that raced to the scene as the ship rolled over and capsized.

"I had to swim a bit to get to the boat to be rescued," Lim Hyung Min, one of more than 300 Seoul high school students who was aboard the ship for a four-day field trip, told CNN affiliate YTN. "The water was so cold and I wanted to live."
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Type: Discussion • Score: 4 • Views: 1,771 • Replies: 17
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farmerman
 
  2  
Reply Wed 16 Apr, 2014 07:02 pm
@ossobuco,
    http://rt.com/files/news/25/57/c0/00/fe-4.jpg                                  AS it rolled over all those "pilot house" decks were swamped. Id have said"**** it" Im taking my chances with the water. I don't know how cold it was but probably in th 50's so hypothermia would be a major concern.
We always kept survival suits with Epirbs on the boat. They would keep you floating and mostly warm to sustain a 45 degree water for about 2 hours before hypo set in. The Delaware Bay ferry system has pretty much wider flat bottom boats which aren't much good for offshore like these. Once those pilot houses swamped and the cars settled, it was only a matter fo an hour or so as the thing would flip and start sinking.

I never minded the Catamaran tyle ferries. They would not flip over as long as their bladders were tight
ossobuco
 
  2  
Reply Wed 16 Apr, 2014 07:33 pm
@farmerman,
I haven't been on that many ferries in my life, and most of those when I was a kid.
I don't think I've been on the Staten Island Ferry, and definitely not the one from (is it?) Sausalito to SF. Marin area to SF, anyway.
The most recent one was when Pifka (Piffka) of a2k put me up at their place in the Seattle area for a few days, and she parked her car on the ferry for a while, beautiful ferry ride, beautiful place, beautiful day in our tour of the general area.
We went shopping on one of the islands (beautiful, natch) and I bought a kimono I still have.. so that's my big ferry memory.

I do seem to remember, over the years, reading a fair number of baaaaad ferry wrecks/sinkings in different places around the world.

A catamaran type does sound smarter..
ossobuco
 
  2  
Reply Wed 16 Apr, 2014 07:34 pm
@ossobuco,
Forgot to say, I saw a headling about fifteen minutes ago that some are still alive onboard, some area with air pocket.

I'm assuming our FBM wasn't on the ferry, but I hope he checks in here anyway.
0 Replies
 
farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Wed 16 Apr, 2014 10:44 pm
@ossobuco,
Sausalito is a flat bottom style(Shallow draft but wide body). These kind are not the best ride and when its too rough they must stop running. BUT, they are, IMHO, safer per mile travelled.

The Cats are still king VIZ

   http://bangordailynews.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/12/NOVA-SCOTIA-CAT-600x406.jpg
0 Replies
 
ossobuco
 
  1  
Reply Fri 18 Apr, 2014 10:06 am
Oy -

http://online.wsj.com/news/articles/SB10001424052702304311204579508662325226006?mg=reno64-wsj&url=http%3A%2F%2Fonline.wsj.com%2Farticle%2FSB10001424052702304311204579508662325226006.html

ASIA NEWS
South Korea Ferry Sinking: Authorities Arrest Captain
Confirmed Accounts That Captain Was Among the First to Abandon Ship
ossobuco
 
  1  
Reply Fri 18 Apr, 2014 10:10 am
@ossobuco,
and -

http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/south-korea-ferry-disaster/did-south-korea-ferrys-turn-cause-deadly-sinking-n84136

From South Korea: Rescuers penetrate ferry, find nothing
http://koreajoongangdaily.joins.com/news/article/Article.aspx?aid=2988144
Korea JoongAng Daily

In Depth: UPDATE 9-
Vice-principal of South Korea school in ferry disaster commits suicide
Reuters
http://in.reuters.com/article/2014/04/18/korea-ship-idINL3N0NA1JK20140418
ossobuco
 
  0  
Reply Wed 23 Apr, 2014 12:54 pm
@ossobuco,
More bad.. (besides all the deaths): link to article in the Wall Street Journal


WORLD NEWS
South Korea Ferry Probe: Cargo Was Three Times Recommended Maximum
Officials From Ship Operator Are Banned From Leaving the Country

By IN-SOO NAM in Seoul, and MIN-JEONG LEE and JEYUP S. KWAAK in Mokpo, South Korea
Updated April 23, 2014 10:04 a.m. ET

http://online.wsj.com/news/articles/SB10001424052702304518704579518993969767898?mg=reno64-wsj&url=http%3A%2F%2Fonline.wsj.com%2Farticle%2FSB10001424052702304518704579518993969767898.html
farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Wed 23 Apr, 2014 01:32 pm
@ossobuco,
Sad when you have to read that its sheer negligence that causes stuff like this. Overweight cargo (Any cargo at all that is not part of a rig load is looked at askance in US ferry systems).
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Wed 23 Apr, 2014 01:53 pm
@farmerman,
Other media report that it did not appear that the ship was overloaded, according to figures provided by the company and the South Korean coast guard. But coast guard officials said investigators won't know for sure how much cargo the ship was carrying until it is salvaged.
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Wed 23 Apr, 2014 02:02 pm
@Walter Hinteler,
The Sewol's Gross Tonnage: 6586 and DeadWeight: 3981

NBC-report
Quote:
The Sewol was loaded with more than 3,600 tons of cargo when it left port, according to politician Kim Young-roc. Kim cited prosecutors for the figure, which is more than three times its recommended weight in cargo and more than double the weight of the ship itself.
katsung47
 
  -1  
Reply Fri 9 May, 2014 02:47 pm
@Walter Hinteler,
831. S. Korea ferry tragedy was created by US intelligence too (5/5/2014)

It was done under similar tactic like the missing Malaysia airliner. The purpose was to justify another planned ship accident - My sisters were arranged a cruise trip in Europe (Italy) from 4/15 to 4/30 while the Korean ferry accident kills hundreds of people.


Quote:
'Deeply Ashamed' Ferry Captain Among First to Abandon Ship
Good Morning America By JOOHEE CHO and DAN GOOD 4/17/2014

http://news.yahoo.com/deeply-ashamed-ferry-captain-among-first-abandon-ship-112032771--abc-news-topstories.html


The news about the Lee Jun-Seok (captain of Korean ferry) reminded me of another Italian one:

Quote:
Captain 'Jumped Off Sinking Costa Concordia'

Francesco Schettino, who insists he fell into a lifeboat, is accused of abandoning the ship before all passengers were evacuated.
http://news.sky.com/story/1167011/captain-jumped-off-sinking-costa-concordia


Both men gave up their duty as captains to run for their own lives because they knew in advance it was a pre-planned accident and there would be a lot of deaths. None wanted to be a sacrifice of the plot.

In Chinese media I learned that Lee Jun-Seok was a replacement of the original ferry captain. That was an important clue. I then had a google search for more detail. The words I entered were: “S. Korea ferry sink captain vacation”. There were so many news – all of them were from mainstream media – but none talked about Lee was a temporary replacement. I tried to change the words into “former captain vacation”, “captain on leave”, all the efforts failed. At last I enter the words this way: “captain vacation S. Korea ferry sink”. Then the news came – with none from mainstream media, some from foreign news such like Chinese of Korean.

Quote:
The ferry's captain who had gone on vacation was replaced by a substitute surnamed Lee, who the ship's operator Chonghaejin Marine claimed is a veteran with eight years of experience on the Incheon-Jeju Island route.

http://www.newkerala.com/news/2014/fullnews-40335.html


Quote:
The Sewol Tragedy: 10 Things That Could Have Changed Everything

1. The missing captain

The real captain for the ferry Sewol was on vacation at the time and not on board. Thus, another captain took on the job. There is a good chance that if the original captain were on the ferry, nothing would have gone wrong. Of course, no one could have predicted the future.

6. The crew and a different captain

Another captain was filling in for the main captain of Sewol, who was on vacation. Nonetheless, the substitute turns out that he also has had a lot of experience as a captain. So how could something like this happen? Unfortunately, the captain was not at the helm when the ferry began to sink. Instead, it was a 25-year-old crew member with only one-year of experience who was steering. So what did this "captain" do? Apparently, not much. He was one of the very first to abandon the ship.

http://www.9korea.com/articles/sewol-tragedy-10-things-that-could-have-changed-everything/


My google search experience shows a mind control. If I hadn’t read Chinese newspaper, I might have missed that important clue that Lee was a temporary replacement. The mastermind of the created accident also control mainstream media (or google search) to block some information from the public and lead people to the way they want you to follow.


Supplementary to 831.

811. Cruise – a murder trap (1/18/2014)

Since the Feds (FBI and DEA) planted the isotope money (radioactive twenty dollars notes) on me through B (my brother in law), they planned murder plot on my relatives because they are witnesses. A major method is to create a cruise incident. The Feds arranged four cruises trip for them in recent three years.


1. “This time the Feds arranged a 7 night Western Caribe - holiday cruise for my family, dated from Dec. 19 to Dec. 26. 2010” See story at #656.

One month before the plot, they created a fire case to justify the coming incident.

Quote:
Carnival cruise ship ends nightmare trip with engine room fire, passengers reveal horror stories
By Lukas I. Alpert AND Aliyah Shahid / November 11, 2010,

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/carnival-cruise-ship-ends-nightmare-trip-engine-room-fire-passengers-reveal-horror-stories-article-1.453985#ixzz2qiMlwM7z


2. “July 2011. My brother and sisters have a boat trip this time in Europe.” See #675.

Fire was not enough to kill. They sunken a tourist fishing boat at same month of the plot.

Quote:
Some Bay Area Survivors Of Capsized Fishing Boat Return Home

July 8, 2011
NOVATO (KCBS) – Some of the Bay Area survivors of the ill-fated tourist fishing boat that sunk in the Sea of Cortez Sunday have returned home.
http://sanfrancisco.cbslocal.com/2011/07/08/two-bay-area-survivors-of-capsized-fishing-boat-return-home/



3. “My mother, my sisters and brother and their families, are arranged for a trip to Hawaii in the end of October. 2012” See #740

A tourist fishing boat was too small. The Feds upgraded the murder model to a cruise ship that caught eyeballs of the world.

Quote:
Captain Held After Cruise Ship Capsizes
15 January 2012

A major rescue operation was launched after the liner, which was carrying 4,234 people, began sinking near the island of Giglio,

http://news.sky.com/story/917454/captain-held-after-cruise-ship-capsizes


4. “My wife and my relatives are having a Mexico cruise trip from 1/5 to 1/9, 2014.” See # 809.

Big case impressed people longer. Two months before another plot, the Feds talked about that capsized ship to remind people sunken cruise ship was not a rare event.

Quote:
Costa Concordia Captain Allegedly 'Jumped Off' Sinking Ship, On Trial For Manslaughter
Agence France Presse | Posted: 11/11/2013

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/11/11/concordia-captain-jumped-off-ship_n_4253884.html


farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Fri 9 May, 2014 02:59 pm
@katsung47,
the Captain of the Concordia isn't the only thing that's "off" around here
ossobuco
 
  1  
Reply Fri 9 May, 2014 03:04 pm
@farmerman,
But he had an excuse.. (party).
katsung47
 
  1  
Reply Tue 20 May, 2014 02:02 pm
@ossobuco,
833. The South Korea airliner crash in 2013 (5/16/2014)

On July 6, 2013, an Asiana airliner crashed in San Francisco airport.

The flight, which originated in Shanghai China before stopping in Seoul en route to San Francisco, carried 61 U.S. citizens, 77 South Koreans and 141 Chinese.

Similar to the missing Malaysia air craft MH370, most passengers on crafts were Chinese ethnic. Either the destination or the origin of the flights were China. The airliner’s company, however, were from small Asia countries.

I notice this because the flight route of Asiana was the one my wife had taken when she went to Shanghai and San Francisco is the airport my relatives used to use when they have a trip. I allege the Feds continueously create new traffic accidents in their murder case on my family members.


Quote:
Lee Kang Kuk, a 46-year-old pilot who was landing the big jet for his first time at San Francisco, "stated it was very difficult to perform a visual approach with a heavy airplane."

Though Lee was an experienced pilot with the Korea-based airline, he was a trainee captain in the 777, with less than 45 hours in the jet. He had not piloted an airliner into San Francisco since 2004, according to NTSB investigator Bill English.

Lee insisted in interviews that he had been blinded during a critical instant before the botched landing by a piercing light from outside the aircraft. NTSB investigators repeatedly probed him about the light, but he was unable to pinpoint its origin or how it precisely affected him.

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/asiana-airlines-pilot-nervous-deadly-crash-san-francisco-article-1.1544318#ixzz31uGsAxS3


When a South Korea ferry sunk last month and news reported that the ferry captain was a substitution to the original one,(see #831), I recalled the air crash in San Francisco last year. Was that another coincidence that the craft captain was a new trainee?
roger
 
  1  
Reply Tue 20 May, 2014 04:03 pm
@katsung47,
Just one gosh darn conspiracy after another, eh katsung?
katsung47
 
  1  
Reply Sat 31 May, 2014 01:19 pm
@roger,
Whatever label you like to stick on.

834. Small countries became sacrifice in US plots (5/23/2014)

In 1983, a South Korea passenger airplane KAL 007 was shot down in Russia.

A few years ago, after former Soviet Union had collapsed, I came across with an analysis of that incident. The article said the Korean pilots couldn’t make such a big mistake to diverge the normal flight path. It alleged it was a plot that Pentagon used it to test air defense of Soviet Union. It was cold war time. I believe so. The original path was mostly over the ocean. The deviation track went over Kamchatka Peninsula. That is a big land. Pilots couldn’t miss it.

Quote:
1983: Korean Air Lines Flight 007 Shot Down By Soviet Fighter Plane

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/9c/KAL007.svg

It was discovered later the crew either did not switch from HEADING to INS or else attempted to switch but the computer did not transition from INERTIAL NAVIGATION ARMED to INS mode because the aircraft had already deviated off track by more than the 7.5 nautical miles (13.9 km) tolerance permitted by the inertial navigation computer. In both scenarios, the autopilot remained in the HEADING mode, and the problem was not detected by the crew. As a result KAL 007 began to diverge from its proper flight path and missed its waypoints by many miles until it overflew the restricted airspace of the Soviet Kamchatka peninsula on the morning of 1 September 1983 and crossed the Sea of Okhotsk north of the Kuril Islands instead of passing hundreds of miles to the south.

http://www.politics.ie/forum/history/215438-1-september-1983-korean-air-lines-flight-007-shot-down-soviet-fighter-plane.html


People didn’t believe the Feds would sacrifice civilian lives for their strategic benefit at that time. The 911 attack later proved they would even sacrifice American’s lives if they thought it was necessary. I think the Asiana airliner crash in San Francisco of 2013, Malaysia’s missing MH370, and the ferry sinking in South Korea in April 2014 were all belong to this category. Most of these disasters related to South Korea. That indicates a small country has to pay a big price when it depends on US. I think US intelligence has infiltrated all levels of South Korea society.
roger
 
  1  
Reply Sat 31 May, 2014 01:39 pm
@katsung47,
Twin towers, missing aircraft, ferries, the list never ends, does it?
0 Replies
 
 

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