31
   

COUP IN KYIV?

 
 
revelette2
 
  1  
Reply Sun 30 Mar, 2014 06:02 am
@JTT,
I am sure when you look into the history of almost any country, they were filled with raping, pillaging and conquering. It was the way it was then, however we are now in modern times, ideally able to be more humane. After all, most of the countries are already conquered. It is hard to explain, but that is the main reason I was against the Iraq war, I looked at from the Bush administration of trying to forcibly change middle east into our idea of democracy. Afghanistan, I was for originally for the simple reason that the Taliban refused to give up Osama Bin Laden. You disagree, however, this is not the place to discuss it.
revelette2
 
  1  
Reply Sun 30 Mar, 2014 06:03 am
Russia counts economic cost of Crimea intervention
0 Replies
 
revelette2
 
  1  
Reply Sun 30 Mar, 2014 06:18 am
@izzythepush,
I really don't think Set's sneering is reserved for Brits. He can't really talk to me or about me without sneering as though I am too stupid to even be trying to participate in this forum. If I took it to heart, I wouldn't have the willingness to keep coming here.
izzythepush
 
  1  
Reply Sun 30 Mar, 2014 07:39 am
@revelette2,
You're right. That's why I call him Malvolio.

The devil a puritan that he is, or any thing
constantly, but a time-pleaser; an affectioned ass,
that cons state without book and utters it by great
swarths: the best persuaded of himself, so
crammed, as he thinks, with excellencies, that it is
his grounds of faith that all that look on him love
him;
spendius
 
  1  
Reply Sun 30 Mar, 2014 07:56 am
@izzythepush,
Quote:
that cons state without book


Robert Graves mentions that criticism in The White Goddess. The idea that a person can know anything worthwhile out of his or her own resources and without recourse to the scholarship of long standing traditions which Shakespeare was deeply immersed in.

Some on this site have boasted about knowing everything about religion by the age of 12 and thus feeling no need to move on. One actually rejected religion in order to lie in on Sunday morning.
JTT
 
  -1  
Reply Sun 30 Mar, 2014 08:51 am
@revelette2,
Rev: Afghanistan, I was for originally for the simple reason that the Taliban refused to give up Osama Bin Laden. You disagree, however, this is not the place to discuss it.
//////////////

That is absolutely false, Rev. But even if they had refused to give up OBL, it would still have been the war crime that it was and is.

You keep changing your reasons to justify a major war crime. Would you like it if an invading horde of criminals killed your children/grandchildren?

////////////

'Pakistan will always support the Taliban'

Newly Disclosed Documents Shed More Light on Early Taliban Offers, Pakistan Role

By Jeremy R. Hammond

September 21, 2010 "Information Clearing House" -- U.S. government documents obtained through the Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) and recently posted on the website of the George Washington University National Security Archive shed some additional light on talks with the Taliban prior to the terrorist attacks of September 11, 2001, including with regard to the repeated Taliban offers to hand over Osama bin Laden, and the role of Pakistan before and after the attacks.[1]

http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article26410.htm


//////////

The USA harbours many terrorists and has refused to give them up. Has the USA been attacked for that, no, because other countries operate according to the rule of law.

0 Replies
 
JTT
 
  -2  
Reply Sun 30 Mar, 2014 08:57 am
@revelette2,
Rev: I am sure when you look into the history of almost any country, they were filled with raping, pillaging and conquering. It was the way it was then, however we are now in modern times, ideally able to be more humane.

:::::::::::::::::::

We are talking modern times, post WWII, post Nuremberg, and the USA is still acting as it always has, a rogue lawless nation. For heaven's sake, the USA is the only country ever designated as a terrorist nation by the ICJ for its war crimes and terrorism against Nicaragua under reagan.

The USA has just come off the illegal invasions, the war crimes against Iraq and Afghanistan.
Olivier5
 
  2  
Reply Sun 30 Mar, 2014 09:23 am
@izzythepush,
Quote:
I was never able to make such a decision, like I said, he was on to me from day 1.

Same here. Typical bully behaviour: pick up on the new kid as soon as he gets on the block, just to let him know who's the Boss.
JTT
 
  -1  
Reply Sun 30 Mar, 2014 09:26 am
@Olivier5,
Did you see this, O5?

//////////////

The Rise of U.S. Imperialism: Teddy Roosevelt’s Racist U.S. War Crimes in the Philippines, 1898-1902

When searching for the documentary record of the “good old days” back when the U.S. Government provided a shining example of honest government to the world, one quickly comes to the realization that those halcyon days never actually existed. In fact, the record of the English and Dutch occupations of North America, which led to the establishment of English colonies and later to the American Revolution are a record of unparallelled brutality and thievery: first of the lands of the aboriginal peoples of the North American continent, and almost immediately, the twin, world-historic crimes of the genocide of the Native American population and the African Slave Trade show that from its very inception, the U.S. Government has been a plague on world civilization and has been responsible for horrendous atrocities throughout its short and hopefully not much longer-lived history.
0 Replies
 
izzythepush
 
  0  
Reply Sun 30 Mar, 2014 11:35 am
@spendius,
spendius wrote:
One actually rejected religion in order to lie in on Sunday morning.


Have you heard of The Sunday Assembly? It's a group of Atheists/Agnostics who miss going to church, so they meet up every Sunday for a non religious church event. I know, I couldn't believe it either, the main benefit of not being religious is not having to go to church. What sort of person would put themselves through that without the dubious promise of eternal salvation? Not the sort of person you'd want to be trapped in a lift with.
http://sundayassembly.com/
spendius
 
  1  
Reply Sun 30 Mar, 2014 12:16 pm
@izzythepush,
I imagine that is due to them being unable to fester in bed with an easy conscience.
0 Replies
 
revelette2
 
  1  
Reply Mon 31 Mar, 2014 06:03 am
@JTT,
Actually I haven't changed the reason I supported the war in Afghanistan which is where Osama Bin Laden was located at the time, (not Pakistan then) and still haven't. The crime of 9/11 was committed in the US, he should have been tried by the US, not Pakistan or Afghanistan.

However, I will agree that the US should have been made to acknowledge it's use of torture and other abuses and paid some kind of restitution so that the issue could have been put to rest. Gitmo should have torn down long ago for the same reason. The lies and/or misstatements of the Bush administration concerning Iraq should have been seriously investigated and some kind of acknowledgement should have been made as to its misleading information in the lead up to Iraq.
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  2  
Reply Mon 31 Mar, 2014 06:03 am
I've just started to translate the German article ... but now it's online on the English version of Spiegel:
Fighting Words: Schäuble Says Putin's Crimea Plans Reminiscent of Hitler
Quote:
Schäuble said Russia's actions in Ukraine remind him of the expansionism of Nazi Germany. "Hitler already adopted such methods in Sudetenland," Schäuble said at a public event at the Finance Ministry in Berlin on Monday morning. "That's something that we all know from history." Schäuble's comments were directed at the justification provided by the Russians for annexing Crimea. Russian officials claim ethnic Russian residents of the peninsula are threatened by Ukraine. The Nazis argued similarly in the 1938 that "ethnic Germans" in peripheral regions of what was then Czechoslovakia required protection.
Given stewing tensions between Russia and the West and the finance minister's political prominence in Europe, Schäuble's comments could further intensify discord.

The finance minister made the comments while speaking to 50 school children from Berlin participating in a government-organized EU Project Day. Schäuble answered children's' questions about European unity and the euro crisis. He made his remarks after a student asked if the Ukraine crisis could potentially intensify the euro zone's problems. Schäuble said the most important thing was to prevent Ukraine from becoming insolvent. He said if the government in Kiev were no longer able to pay its security forces, "then of course some armed bands would seek to take power." That, he warned, could serve as a pretext for a Russian intervention. "The Russians would then say they can't accept that, that they are threatening our Russian population. Now we have to protect them, and that is our reason for invading."

The finance minister also explained to the students how Russia's occupation of Crimea came about. "At some point the situation escalated and then Putin said, 'I actually always wanted Crimea anyway.'" Schäuble said Putin had justified the action because the Russian Black Sea fleet is located on the peninsula. He said Putin must have told himself, "And the current opportunity is the right one." Schäuble also claimed the Russian president deployed troops near the Ukrainian border, "to show that I can take care of ensuring order if need be."

Schäuble also told the students that concerns about Russian actions are widespread among his colleagues in the EU member states that used to be part of the Eastern Bloc -- particularly Hungary, Poland and the Baltic states. "They're quite scared," he said. He said the finance ministers of these countries have told him personally that they planned to expand their military expenditures. But Schäuble said there were no plans to increase Germany's defense budget. "That would be of no use," he said.




Walter Hinteler
 
  2  
Reply Mon 31 Mar, 2014 06:04 am
@Walter Hinteler,
http://i1334.photobucket.com/albums/w641/Walter_Hinteler/a_zps4fea6fc3.jpg
Graphic: Military strenghts of Eastern European NATO members


Walter Hinteler
 
  2  
Reply Mon 31 Mar, 2014 06:04 am
@Walter Hinteler,
http://i1334.photobucket.com/albums/w641/Walter_Hinteler/b_zps5231b484.jpg
Map: Europe from the Russian Perspective
0 Replies
 
revelette2
 
  1  
Reply Mon 31 Mar, 2014 08:30 am
Putin's Crimea Grab Seems To Be Backfiring

0 Replies
 
oralloy
 
  -1  
Reply Tue 1 Apr, 2014 10:06 am
@oralloy,
oralloy wrote:
It is long past time that we welcomed Georgia into NATO though, and maybe the Georgians would be willing to allow the US Navy to have a permanent base on the Black Sea.

I'm not sure we really want to tie up a significant portion of our Navy in the Black Sea, but even a small base with just one or two warships would send a message to Putin.


Also maybe time for us to build up a troop presence in Poland and Romania, if they are willing to allow us bases.

And maybe we could ask Poland and Romania if they'd each like to be a repository for 10-20 of our new tactical nukes.


A small start:

Quote:
(Reuters) - The United States has asked to boost the number of troops and aircraft it has stationed at an airbase in NATO ally Romania, President Traian Basescu said on Tuesday, as tensions between the West and Russia simmer over neighboring Ukraine.

U.S. forces have used the Mihail Kogalniceanu air base on the Black Sea in eastern Romania since 1999. It is a major hub for U.S. troops leaving Afghanistan and is located not far from Ukraine's Crimea peninsula, annexed last month by Russia.

"The U.S. embassy in Bucharest has asked for support from Romanian authorities to expand current operations at the Mihail Kogalniceanu base," Basescu said in a letter of notification to the speaker of Romania's lower house of parliament.

The U.S. request would add up to 600 U.S. troops to the roughly 1,000 currently stationed in Romania and would also increase the number of military aircraft there, the letter said.
http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/04/01/us-ukraine-crisis-usa-romania-idUSBREA3012J20140401

Quote:
NATO and Ukraine announced in a joint statement after their ministers met in Brussels that they would intensify cooperation and promote defense reforms in Ukraine through training and other programs.
http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/04/01/us-ukraine-crisis-nato-russia-idUSBREA301AL20140401

Quote:
(Reuters) - Poland's Prime Minister Donald Tusk said on Tuesday that the pace at which NATO increases its military presence in Poland was unsatisfactory.

"We are gaining something step by step, but the pace of NATO increasing its military presence for sure could be faster. You remember the endless debates about the missile shield, with mediocre results," Tusk told a press conference.

"This is an unsatisfactory result for us," he said, commenting on earlier statements by Polish foreign minister, who said he would be fully satisfied if NATO located two heavy brigades in Poland.
http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/04/01/poland-nato-military-idUSW8N0MG00M20140401
0 Replies
 
revelette2
 
  1  
Reply Tue 1 Apr, 2014 02:24 pm
Putin's Brazen Demand In Return For Him NOT Invading Ukraine
JTT
 
  0  
Reply Tue 1 Apr, 2014 05:56 pm
@revelette2,
Quote:
We would like to propose to the Russian side that before issuing ultimatums to a sovereign and independent state, it turn its attention to the disastrous conditions and complete powerlessness of its own national minorities, including the Ukrainian one…


Did Ukraine say this to the USA on the eve of the illegal invasions of I and A, Rev?
0 Replies
 
revelette2
 
  1  
Reply Thu 3 Apr, 2014 09:14 am
"Let's be clear from the outset. The Cold War is not back. Russia for all its military power and posturing is not the Soviet Union of old. This is not going to be a re-run of the ideological battle that divided the world for most of the last century."

Quote:
That in a nutshell was the view of one senior Nato diplomat who I spoke to recently.

But something has changed in the wake of Russia's seizure of the Crimea and its continuing military threat to eastern Ukraine.

Moscow has broken with a pattern of behaviour that has characterised diplomacy in Europe since the end of the Cold War and arguably one that has held sway in western Europe since the collapse of Nazi Germany.

The idea that disputes will be settled by diplomacy rather than force; that the currency of power is increasingly economic might rather than military.

Worse still, Mr Putin's Kremlin speech some 10 days ago signalled that this might not end here. Russian spokesmen may say they have no desire to move troops into Ukraine but their deployments signal otherwise - and that is precisely what they are intended to do.

 

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