31
   

COUP IN KYIV?

 
 
Lordyaswas
 
  2  
Reply Wed 26 Feb, 2014 08:24 am
@revelette2,
Seriousness?

Never let it be said.

Inanities? I just call it an occasional teabreak, when we post things like this to make people smile before it all gets faux serieuse again....

http://www.freakingnews.com/pictures/109000/Putin-and-Angela-Merkel--109438.jpg
0 Replies
 
JTT
 
  -1  
Reply Wed 26 Feb, 2014 08:26 am
@Ragman,
Ragman: Keith B. Alexander, is the current director of the National Security Agency. Obama is simply the Prez in his role just receives security updates and 'presides'. Why more intellectual dishonesty?
//////

Why more intellectual dishonesty indeed, Ragman! Aren't you kinda light on the first part?

0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  0  
Reply Wed 26 Feb, 2014 08:28 am
@Walter Hinteler,
Ragman wrote:
Putin was the head of the KGB.
Walter Hinteler wrote:
Well, so Obama is the head of the NSA,
Queen Elisabeth II of the GCHQ ...
Yeah; as Truman put it: "The buck stops here."
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Wed 26 Feb, 2014 08:31 am
@Ragman,
Indeed, Putin was for one year the director of Federal Security Service of the Russian Federation (FSB). (And he re-organised the FSB when he became president.)

Lordyaswas
 
  1  
Reply Wed 26 Feb, 2014 08:31 am
@OmSigDAVID,
Why are you taking the blame, Omsig? You are totallly blameless for once!
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Wed 26 Feb, 2014 08:42 am
@revelette2,
FOR THE RECORD:
I have never cared much for Pat Buchanan.
I dont find him to be much of a conservative (i.e., orthodox).
Conservatism is adhering very closely to original principles.

I doubt that Washington or Madison woud have accepted him
as being one of them, in his theocratic views of the world.
Thay intentionally created a secular republic.

Buchanan is not sufficiently LIBERTARIAN to fit in with the Founders.
Buchanan is not sufficiently INDIVIDUALISTIC to fit in with the Founders.



( In fairness, I will admit that he was a good anti-communist ally in the Third World War. )





David
JTT
 
  -1  
Reply Wed 26 Feb, 2014 08:48 am
@OmSigDAVID,
You don't know **** about USA history, Om.

Of course you know **** about USA history, Om.
0 Replies
 
Lordyaswas
 
  1  
Reply Wed 26 Feb, 2014 09:08 am
@Walter Hinteler,
Walter Hinteler wrote:

Indeed, Putin was for one year the director of Federal Security Service of the Russian Federation (FSB). (And he re-organised the FSB when he became president.)




When you say re-organised, Walter, did a lot of people go missing?
Walter Hinteler
 
  2  
Reply Wed 26 Feb, 2014 09:15 am
@Lordyaswas,
No idea. But it made the FSB even worse for many Russians than the KGB had been.
JTT
 
  0  
Reply Wed 26 Feb, 2014 09:20 am
@Lordyaswas,
Lordy: When you say re-organised, Walter, did a lot of people go missing?

---

Pilger uncovers the shocking complicity of the US and Great Britain governments in the East Timor genocide - the same governments who were willing to go to war with Saddam Hussein for his invasion of Kuwait, but who stood aside as Indonesia broke the exact same UN regulations to rape and pillage East Timor using Western arms.

https://archive.org/details/timor_conspiracy
0 Replies
 
Lordyaswas
 
  1  
Reply Wed 26 Feb, 2014 09:28 am
@Walter Hinteler,
Yep. I think he's one sinister b'stard underneath that sinister exterior.
JTT
 
  0  
Reply Wed 26 Feb, 2014 09:35 am
@Lordyaswas,
How's tricks, Pot?
0 Replies
 
izzythepush
 
  1  
Reply Wed 26 Feb, 2014 09:39 am
The latest.

Quote:
Pro-Kiev and pro-Moscow protesters have scuffled in Ukraine's Crimea region, as tensions increase following last week's ousting of President Viktor Yanukovych.

One person was crushed to death during the face-off outside parliament in Simferopol, the BBC confirms.

Only a police cordon separated the rallies - one pro-Russian, the other involving Crimean Tatars and people backing Ukraine's change of government.

A new cabinet is due to be unveiled in the capital Kiev in a few hours' time.

It is widely expected that a number of activists from Kiev's main protest camp, the Maidan, will be offered ministerial roles.

Any new cabinet will face a daunting set of challenges, with many areas of government in Ukraine needing urgent reform, the BBC's David Stern in Kiev reports.

In a separate development, the interim authorities have disbanded the elite Berkut police units, which are blamed for the deaths of dozens of protesters in the Ukrainian capital last week.

'Provocation'

Thousands of people took part in the two rival rallies in Crimea's administrative capital ahead of a planned session of the region's parliament, where the issue of Crimea's status had been initially expected to be raised.The violence in Simferopol illustrates the complexity of the situation in Crimea - a situation made worse by the current power vacuum on the southern Ukrainian peninsula.

Angry Russian Crimeans are denouncing the new government in Kiev, who they fear will undermine their links to Russia. We even saw them chanting "Berkut", the name of the riot police who killed so many protesters last week.

But today, Crimea's Tatars turned up in force to show their support for the new government in Kiev. That's because of their long-running suspicion of Russia. They were the original occupants of Crimea. They were first invaded by the Russians in the 18th Century, and then kicked out by Stalin in the 1940s, only returning to Crimea in the 1990s.

However, parliamentary speaker Volodymyr Konstantinov later said MPs would not discuss any secession by Crimea, which currently enjoys autonomy within Ukraine.

Mr Konstantinov described as "provocation" earlier media reports on the issue.

In Simferopol, Crimean Tatars chanted "Glory to Ukraine!", while the pro-Russian activists responded with "Russia!"

After the meeting, Crimean Tatar leader Refat Chubarov called on activists - including ethnic Russians - to form self-defence units to prevent any violence or provocations, Ukrainska Pravda news website reports.

Crimea - where ethnic Russians are in a majority - was transferred from Russia to Ukraine in 1954.

Ethnic Ukrainians loyal to Kiev and Muslim Tatars - whose animus to Russia stretches back to the horrors of Stalin's deportations during World War II - have formed an alliance to oppose any move back towards Moscow.

The change of government in Kiev has raised questions over the future of Russia's naval bases in the Crimean port city of Sevastopol, the lease for which was extended until 2042 by Mr Yanukovych.

Most experts believe the new leadership will not push for the withdrawal of the Russian fleet, as this could further threaten Ukraine's internal stability as well as the country's fragile relations with Russia, the BBC's Ilya Abishev reports.

A statement issued by three former Ukrainian presidents on Wednesday - Leonid Kravchuk, Leonid Kuchma and Viktor Yushchenko - condemned what it said was Russian interference in Crimean politics.

Also on Wednesday, Russian President Vladimir Putin ordered a snap drill to test the combat readiness of troops in central and western Russia, near the border with Ukraine.

Such checks are not uncommon, although the timing is seen as significant, correspondents say.

Russia, along with the US, UK and France, pledged to uphold the territorial integrity of Ukraine in a memorandum signed in 1994.

Ukraine's interim President Oleksandr Turchynov has expressed concern about what he called the "serious threat" of separatism following the ousting of Mr Yanukovych.

Russia has portrayed the ousting of Mr Yanukovych as a violent seizure of power by the opposition, while EU countries have largely backed the change in government.

Crimea
Autonomous republic within Ukraine
Transferred from Russia in 1954
Ethnic Russians - 58.5%*
Ethnic Ukrainians - 24.4%*
Crimean Tatars - 12.1%*
Source: Ukraine census 2001



The Ukrainian need to very careful that they're not perceived to be cracking down on ethnic Russians. That last thing Putin needs to be given right now is an excuse.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-26354705
0 Replies
 
izzythepush
 
  2  
Reply Wed 26 Feb, 2014 09:42 am
@revelette2,
revelette2 wrote:

I admit I have no knowledge of Ukraine until a few days ago I saw an article on a news site, which is why I haven't said too much.


There's nothing wrong with that, I think everyone on this thread is on a learning curve. I've learnt loads since this started. The problem arises when idiots like Romeo Fabulini, who knows far less than you, make sweeping statements based on nothing but prejudice and columns from The Daily Mail.
JTT
 
  0  
Reply Wed 26 Feb, 2014 09:53 am
@izzythepush,
Izzy: suck, suck suck suck suck ...
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  2  
Reply Wed 26 Feb, 2014 09:54 am
There was a live CBC report on that incident in the Crimean which sounded pretty harrowing. The correspondent was pressed up against the parliament building wall near the entrance, and she had shout into her microphone to make herself heard. From her vantage, the police did not seem to be taking sides, but just maintaining a cordon around the entrance, two-deep with their arms locked. She described them as not reacting to the crowds, but vetting anyone who attempted to enter the building. Hard times in the Ukraine right now.
izzythepush
 
  1  
Reply Wed 26 Feb, 2014 09:58 am
@Setanta,
It does sound harrowing, someone got crushed to death.
JTT
 
  0  
Reply Wed 26 Feb, 2014 09:59 am
@Setanta,
As harrowing as you made it for the people of Vietnam, Set?
0 Replies
 
JTT
 
  0  
Reply Wed 26 Feb, 2014 10:01 am
@izzythepush,
Good god, Izzy! SomeONE! Iraq, Afghanistan, Indonesia, ... .
0 Replies
 
Lordyaswas
 
  2  
Reply Wed 26 Feb, 2014 10:04 am
@Setanta,
It's going to kick off, one way or another I feel, as there is too much upping of gander on both sides, and as long as you have civilians with crash helmets and sticks overseeing things, people aren't going to feel like being sensible and moderate anytime soon.

They need to have a clearing of the air east/west meeting on neutral ground and some sort of impartial body to mediate.

Then again, it might be the strategy of one or both sides to inflame the situation in order to bring about eventual partition.

Anyway, what the eff do I know?

0 Replies
 
 

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