132
   

Why do people deny evolution?

 
 
Romeo Fabulini
 
  -1  
Fri 20 Dec, 2013 10:39 am
Quote:
Rap said: BTW Romeo I impose Godwin's law.

Haha I just looked it up-
WIKI- "Godwin said that, given enough time, in any online discussion—regardless of topic or scope—someone inevitably makes a comparison to Hitler or the Nazis"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin's_law

Hilarious and it's true, waddya say Spock?..Smile

"Fascinating"
http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g64/PoorOldSpike/spock-ss.gif~original
neologist
 
  2  
Fri 20 Dec, 2013 11:09 am
@JimmyJ,
Quote:
You were the one who brought up "lazy".
JimmyJ wrote:
Is it not lazy to ask someone else to do your research for you?
You mean I should do research to prove your point? How about just proving your point as does farmerman? He makes a formidable intellectual effort. I never question the evidence he presents, BTW, only his conclusions. I'd happily pop a libation with him anytime. I'd even buy.

Same goes for a large number of A2K folks, none of whom believe as I do.
anonymously99
 
  0  
Fri 20 Dec, 2013 12:00 pm
@neologist,
Why mention lazy as you do? Don't you understand what stress does, can do to an individual? Unknowingly. There are some individuals whose lives pass right before their eyes they unable to live the life they wanted to live due to the amount of stress, depression, else more they were, are forced to face it only getting worse with time. I mention so from experience. Sad for me to feel as I look back.
I feel your feelings, feel why not I share mine.
neologist
 
  1  
Fri 20 Dec, 2013 12:15 pm
@anonymously99,
"Lazy" was Jimmy's word, not mine.
0 Replies
 
farmerman
 
  1  
Fri 20 Dec, 2013 12:30 pm
@Romeo Fabulini,
corollary to Godwin' Law is that, whoever first brings up the "H" word, hs lot ll cred.

Im sorry, were going to have to shoot you for your own good. Youll thank me later.
anonymously99
 
  0  
Fri 20 Dec, 2013 12:46 pm
@farmerman,
Godwin's law

TalkMike Godwin (2010)Godwin's law (also known as Godwin's Rule of Nazi Analogies or Godwin's Law of Nazi Analogies[1][2]) is an assertion made by Mike Godwin in 1990[2] that has become an Internet adage. It states: "As an online discussion grows longer, the probability of a comparison involvingNazis or Hitler approaches 1."[2][3] In other words, Godwin said that, given enough time, inany online discussion—regardless of topic or scope—someone inevitably makes a comparison to Hitler or the Nazis.Although in one of its early forms Godwin's law referred specifically to Usenet newsgroupdiscussions,[4] the law is now often applied to any threaded online discussion, such asforums, chat rooms and blog comment threads, and has been invoked for the inappropriate use of Nazi analogies in articles or speeches.[5]In 2012, "Godwin's Law" became an entry in the third edition of the Oxford English Dictionary.[6]

Corollaries and usageEdit

There are many corollaries to Godwin's law, some considered more canonical (by being adopted by Godwin himself)[3] than others.[1]For example, there is a tradition in many newsgroups and other Internet discussion forums that once such a comparison is made, the thread is finished and whoever mentioned the Nazis has automatically lost whateverdebate was in progress.[7] This principle is itself frequently referred to as Godwin's law. It is considered poor form to raise such a comparison arbitrarily with the motive of ending the thread. There is a widely recognized corollary that any such ulterior-motive invocation of Godwin's law will be unsuccessful.[8]Godwin's law applies especially to inappropriate, inordinate, or hyperbolic comparisons of other situations (or one's opponent) with Nazis – often referred to as "playing the Hitler card". The law and its corollaries would not apply to discussions covering known mainstays of Nazi Germanysuch as genocide, eugenics, or racial superiority, nor, more debatably, to a discussion of other totalitarian regimes or ideologies, if that was the explicit topic of conversation, since a Nazi comparison in those circumstances may be appropriate, in effect committing thefallacist's fallacy. Whether it applies to humorous use or references to oneself is open to interpretation, since this would not be a fallacious attack against a debate opponent.While falling afoul of Godwin's law tends to cause the individual making the comparison to lose his argument or credibility, Godwin's law itself can be abused as a distraction, diversion or even as censorship, fallaciously miscasting an opponent's argument as hyperbole when the comparisons made by the argument are actually appropriate.[9] Similar criticisms of the "law" (or "at least the distorted version which purports to prohibit all comparisons to German crimes") have been made by Glenn Greenwald.[10]

HistoryEdit

Godwin has stated that he introduced Godwin's law in 1990 as an experiment in memetics.[2]Godwin's law does not claim to articulate a fallacy; it is instead framed as a memetic tool to reduce the incidence of inappropriate hyperbolic comparisons. "Although deliberately framed as if it were a law of nature or of mathematics, its purpose has always been rhetorical and pedagogical: I wanted folks who glibly compared someone else to Hitler or to Nazis to think a bit harder about the Holocaust", Godwin has written.[11]

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin's_law
neologist
 
  1  
Fri 20 Dec, 2013 12:50 pm
@farmerman,
I believe Romeo has already shot his self in the foot.
0 Replies
 
Romeo Fabulini
 
  1  
Fri 20 Dec, 2013 12:50 pm
Quote:
Farmerman said: corollary to Godwin' Law is that, whoever first brings up the "H" word, hs lot ll cred

Look at it another way mate, only real nazis are afraid of the 'nazi' word..Smile
I mean, if somebody accused you of being a nazi you'd just laugh it off, but if you really were a nazi you'd get hot under the collar,,Smile

anonymously99
 
  0  
Fri 20 Dec, 2013 12:51 pm
@anonymously99,
How are you supposed to know who is a Nazi? I honestly wouldn't know. Sure anyone can talk about Nazis. And how would you know if you were making a comparison? I honestly wouldn't know. I think about things different things a lot of the time. Yes. So it is difficult for me to control myself. It is as if someone opened a door (in my head) and I can't close (am unable to gain control. of myself). Am I starting to panic for no reason? I don't know. Feedback is nice.
0 Replies
 
farmerman
 
  1  
Fri 20 Dec, 2013 12:52 pm
@Romeo Fabulini,
its your credibility that was lost not whether you are a Nazi.
0 Replies
 
anonymously99
 
  0  
Fri 20 Dec, 2013 12:53 pm
@Romeo Fabulini,
Why would someone get upset for being accused of being a Nazi?
0 Replies
 
Romeo Fabulini
 
  0  
Fri 20 Dec, 2013 12:55 pm
Quote:
Anonymously asked: How are you supposed to know who is a Nazi? I honestly wouldn't know

Well, the nazis went in for burning all sorts of books they didn't like, and atheists today would like to burn the Bible, so perhaps atheists are nazis?
neologist
 
  1  
Fri 20 Dec, 2013 12:57 pm
@farmerman,
farmerman wrote:
Macroevolution is evolution ABOVE the species level

That's all it means. Evidence and direct observations about both can be seen through multiple human life-times of observation. We don't even need the fossil record to intervene.
Would the fossil record suffice? Where I diverge is at the point where a new species is produced.
farmerman
 
  1  
Fri 20 Dec, 2013 01:13 pm
@neologist,
The Grant's (of Princeton U ornithology program) have measured "Speciation" In Galpogos finches from early previous studies (including initial data from John Gould who did all of Darwin's identifications of the Ilands finches (s well s other genera).
The Grants have measured the divergenceof species until they've actually identified two new genera since the late 1800's (or about 100 years of waltching).

The problem with LIVE analyses, it involves catch and release of specimens and all that entails.
Its still compelling stuff. The Creationists have all balked at the "Macro" level mostly by denying that it could happen in a humans lifetime.
Fossils usually provide some fo the best close-in stratigraphic evidence for speciation and development of higher taxa. The story of the whale, and the evidence for vascular plants is very very strong.
As is the evidence for the development of mammals from Ictidiosaurian reptiles, sub order of the Therapsids, and the development of amphibians from Rhipidistrian fishes.

Fossils are sometimes incorrect in assuming the cladistics based on "convergence" but most often, fossils are quite accurate to define speciation and evolutionary morphological adaptation.

I was recently looking over conodont fossils , searching for an index fossil that is indicative of good gas filed rocks. I found these at sveral locations many tens of miles apart and all following a train of earlier conodonts in the rock core. These are extinct critters but have their own unique evolutionary tree. (Just so happens that they and several other associated tricks which I shant reveal) we can pinpoint good "play fields"
anonymously99
 
  1  
Fri 20 Dec, 2013 01:14 pm
@Romeo Fabulini,
I did not know that. I'm not against anyone's beliefs. Not against anyone for any reason. Are the Nazis against anyone in general? Or is it only people who despise who they are that they are against? When younger I had such friends. Got along fine. Has things changed over the years?
0 Replies
 
rosborne979
 
  3  
Fri 20 Dec, 2013 01:16 pm
@Romeo Fabulini,
Romeo Fabulini wrote:
...atheists today would like to burn the Bible...

I don't know of any atheists who want to burn the bible. How many atheists do you actually know? Any?
0 Replies
 
neologist
 
  1  
Fri 20 Dec, 2013 01:28 pm
@farmerman,
I am no match for your exemplary research, farmer.
Show me a finch that's not a finch and I will flinch.
And, I'll pay for the drinks.

I'll pay the first round anyway, farmer. Just PM me when you get to Seattle.
anonymously99
 
  0  
Fri 20 Dec, 2013 01:45 pm
@neologist,
Words in general..

It is all permanent.
0 Replies
 
farmerman
 
  1  
Fri 20 Dec, 2013 03:09 pm
@neologist,
youll have it easy, just show me a good cuppa coffee nd NO STARBUCKS
spendius
 
  0  
Fri 20 Dec, 2013 04:30 pm
@neologist,
Quote:
How about just proving your point as does farmerman? He makes a formidable intellectual effort. I never question the evidence he presents, BTW, only his conclusions. I'd happily pop a libation with him anytime. I'd even buy.


Take care, neo, not to fall for fm's shtick.
 

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